Zoa pests?

StrangeDejavu · Dec 7, 2016

I've been seeing these small things in my zoas at night but haven't been able to ID them on any of the lists i've found so far. They're extremely tiny, about the size of a copepod or maybe a hair bigger, and look like microscopic hermit crabs. White shell with what looked like tiny gray specks. Hard to manually remove unless you catch them off guard, as they appear to latch on just like a hermit crab does when you try to move one. I managed to siphon one out with a turkey baster last night, only for it to be crushed by the slide cover as I was placing it on a microscope slide. :/ I did get a few photos though, so maybe someone will recognize them and help me with a good/bad ID?

Little info on the zoas: I have two types currently. Some ORA greens and some ORA reds. The reds haven't been too happy lately but the greens are thriving. They stay open almost all the time and are growing fast. This is also where I find all of these little critters moving about. I'd imagine if they were pests or irritators, the zoas would be closed up but i've not seen anything like that with the greens. I'm also not seeing any signs of eggs on the stalks of zoas.

This is the best photo I could get before it was crushed. I used a magnifier app on my phone to get super close but the quality isn't too great.

This is the closest thing I could find on Google as far as similarities go. Even these look big compared to what i'm seeing.

twilliard · Dec 7, 2016

Looks like you have figured it out

Now the question is how do you get rid of them

StrangeDejavu · Dec 7, 2016

twilliard said:
Looks like you have figured it out
Now the question is how do you get rid of them

I'm not 100% sold on foraminiferans though. I have seen these in my tank before and they look like microscopic snails, no visible legs or claws like what I see on these critters.

twilliard · Dec 7, 2016

StrangeDejavu said:
I'm not 100% sold on foraminiferans though. I have seen these in my tank before and they look like microscopic snails, no visible legs or claws like what I see on these critters.

At first I was thinking spiders but the shell doesn't match up and no legs in the first picture.
Maybe not enough caffeine yet LOL

Harris3005 · Dec 7, 2016

Foraminiferans aren't a single thing. I only know this because we use them for isotope analysis in ice cores in archaeology to look at past climates. I don't know if this info is of any use to you I just mean you may have to narrow it down a bit more to find out exactly how to deal with a particular type.

mcarroll · Dec 7, 2016

I think zoanthids are one of the fussiest corals you can keep and you're looking hard to find nothing. The fussy ones are just being fussy.

Lack of symptoms on the greens is all the proof you need.

StrangeDejavu · Dec 7, 2016

twilliard said:
At first I was thinking spiders but the shell doesn't match up and no legs in the first picture.
Maybe not enough caffeine yet LOL

These are way, way smaller than spiders. They're about 1/3 the size of a grain of Fiji Pink sand so i'd guess about 0.1 - 0.2 mm. Plus that whole shell thing.

Gonna go with mcarroll on this one unless I start seeing symptoms.

StrangeDejavu · Dec 7, 2016

I managed to get one on a slide without crushing it this time, lol. Hopefully these will help in getting a solid ID, and if not, maybe it'll help someone else down the road.

scoopsthedog · Dec 8, 2016

StrangeDejavu said:
I've been seeing these small things in my zoas at night but haven't been able to ID them on any of the lists i've found so far. They're extremely tiny, about the size of a copepod or maybe a hair bigger, and look like microscopic hermit crabs. White shell with what looked like tiny gray specks. Hard to manually remove unless you catch them off guard, as they appear to latch on just like a hermit crab does when you try to move one. I managed to siphon one out with a turkey baster last night, only for it to be crushed by the slide cover as I was placing it on a microscope slide. :/ I did get a few photos though, so maybe someone will recognize them and help me with a good/bad ID?

Little info on the zoas: I have two types currently. Some ORA greens and some ORA reds. The reds haven't been too happy lately but the greens are thriving. They stay open almost all the time and are growing fast. This is also where I find all of these little critters moving about. I'd imagine if they were pests or irritators, the zoas would be closed up but i've not seen anything like that with the greens. I'm also not seeing any signs of eggs on the stalks of zoas.

This is the best photo I could get before it was crushed. I used a magnifier app on my phone to get super close but the quality isn't too great.

This is the closest thing I could find on Google as far as similarities go. Even these look big compared to what i'm seeing.

Saw this article apparently there are red zoa specific pests. https://reefbuilders.com/2016/11/29/red-zoanthid-nudibranch/

saltyfilmfolks · Dec 8, 2016

scoopsthedog said:
Saw this article apparently there are red zoa specific pests. https://reefbuilders.com/2016/11/29/red-zoanthid-nudibranch/

They turn the color of the zoa they eat. They are sap suckers. There not red.

saltyfilmfolks · Dec 8, 2016

Harris3005 said:
Foraminiferans aren't a single thing. I only know this because we use them for isotope analysis in ice cores in archaeology to look at past climates. I don't know if this info is of any use to you I just mean you may have to narrow it down a bit more to find out exactly how to deal with a particular type.

Hahaha. That's just cool.

saltyfilmfolks · Dec 8, 2016

I'm not saying your wrong but I have A LOT OF BUGS. Are you sure the zoas are closed because of bugs and might I suggest a bug eating fish or two.

Zoas close up and melt for a lot of reasons. It's a cliche actually. If most folks put thier tanks under a microscope they'd quit the hobby. If bristle worms freak them out this would make them run screaming.
Bugs are a natural part of an eco system and biosphere. In agriculture and vivariums you seed the soil with them to insure the rest of the animals survive. True you need to control the populations but that's husbandry. I'd look at a scooter blenny. Mine wouldn't eat frozen for about four or five months no matter what we tried.
And It's fat.
Usually a very very easy to condition fish.

This from a guy who trains mandarins and other dragonetts to eat frozen.

And thanks for the great scope pics. Those are simply amazing.

TheEngineer · Dec 8, 2016

That's amazing that you got video of it under a microscope! How has @Lionfish Lair not already been here!?

Lionfish Lair · Dec 8, 2016

Sorry, I threw my back out yesterday and I'm sofa bound.

I'm on an iPad, so it's hard to see the conversation, but did you ID them? They're ostracods.

TheEngineer · Dec 8, 2016

Lionfish Lair said:
Sorry, I threw my back out yesterday and I'm sofa bound.

I'm on an iPad, so it's hard to see the conversation, but did you ID them? They're ostracods.

that's the worst! I have a bad back too.

Lionfish Lair · Dec 8, 2016

It sucks, right?! This is the first time for me since I had surgery 3 years ago. I thought I was done with this part of it. I'm very disappointed.

I can't watch the videos, but I assume they look like they are running on their side?

TheEngineer · Dec 8, 2016

Lionfish Lair said:
It sucks, right?! This is the first time for me since I had surgery 3 years ago. I thought I was done with this part of it. I'm very disappointed.

I can't watch the videos, but I assume they look like they are running on their side?

I haven't needed surgery, thankfully. I fractured one of my vertebrae years ago and now my spine can shift out of place and get a bulging disc. Thankfully going to the chiropractor seems to keep it in check.

That's exactly what they look like on the video. Running on their side.

StrangeDejavu · Dec 8, 2016

Thank you @Lionfish Lair! A quick Google search of "Ostracod reef" and this is definitely what i'm seeing. Good to know they're also reef safe, i'll leave them be now.