Zoas shrinking, melting and dying

[Terry Mattson]

Here is the red sea iodine pro from bulk reef supply

 

[Saltyreef]

Your phoshates are too low for your nitrate level.
Bump it up a bit to 1ppm or bring your nitrate down below 1ppm with .04ppm phosphates.
My zoas were struggling for a while until i realized my nutrient imbalance. Melting, dying and suffering from zoa pox. Furan 2 dips or iodine didnt work. Only when i started to raise my phosphate, immediately i noticed the zoa pox healing and the zoas slowly stop melting away into brown messy goops. Most of my other coral is doing ok but zoas really showed the worst symptoms. This was directly after changing my natural nutrient balance from 0ppm nitrate, .02ppm phosphate to 50ppm nitrate and .04ppm phosphate.
Even after bringing it down to 10ppm nitrate my phosphates were still apparently too low.

 

[Bxr126]

Your phoshates are too low for your nitrate level.
Bump it up a bit to 1ppm or bring your nitrate down below 1ppm with .04ppm phosphates.
My zoas were struggling for a while until i realized my nutrient imbalance. Melting, dying and suffering from zoa pox. Furan 2 dips or iodine didnt work. Only when i started to raise my phosphate, immediately i noticed the zoa pox healing and the zoas slowly stop melting away into brown messy goops. Most of my other coral is doing ok but zoas really showed the worst symptoms. This was directly after changing my natural nutrient balance from 0ppm nitrate, .02ppm phosphate to 50ppm nitrate and .04ppm phosphate.
Even after bringing it down to 10ppm nitrate my phosphates were still apparently too low.

Interesting.

 

[Saltyreef]

Interesting.

Ive been dosing small amounts of monopotassium phosphate concentrate to the pre determined amount it should be at for .1ppm in my tank, and my low range test kit barely reads half of that. It means that either my rocks are binding it faster than im dosing or my corals are depleating it out of the water fast due to the high nitrate. Since my corals seem to finally be on their way to recovery im leaning towards it being lack of p04.

 

[Bars]

So, maybe I need to be more patient, but I was wondering something.
My remaining zoas are still really small and I feel like my lotr frag isn't looking as good anymore as before. However, I did move them about a month ago due to a small rescape, so maybe the lotr is still a bit moody about that. Could these frags just be 'permanently damaged' though because they've been in less than ideal conditions, and possibly been eaten by pests, for months?

I'm going to my lfs tomorrow to see if they have some nice frags. If they do I'm gonna pick 1 or 2 up and see how they'll do.

Iodine is pretty stable right now by the way at about .05

 

[Bars]

Just came across a picture from dec 26th. Turns out the Lotr zoa actually looks a lot worse now, a lot more stretched and very thin polyps.

First picture is from december, second picture is from today. The orange zoa hasn't changed it seems, although it seems to be facing up a bit more. Is this a light issue or something else? The amount of light it receives is the same as the last few months...

Have seen a fair bit of growth in a bunch of other corals (Favia, Montipora) in these few weeks, yet the zoa battle continues I guess...

 

[Saltyreef]

Mine are under two hydra 52s at 3" below water surface. Guessing 350+ par based on past readings.
Still stretching....dont think its from lighting. Theyve been doing that since i had them under 2x hydra 26s.
Po4 deficient is my guess. They used to look like this under hydra 26s and no nitrate with slightly elevated p04.

 

[Terry Mattson]

Have you sent your owater to one of those ipc testing places. It will tell you the values of many things including heavey metals. The test would be a good clue either way. I have two of the AI 26HD. Run carbon one every 4 to 6 weeks ... don't give up .... you will figure it out.

 

[Bars]

I have no idea if my lighting is sufficient enough to be honest, because I can't find anything online about user experiences. Running a single Aquamedic Qube 50 on a (roughly) 27x20 tank. My LFS had one above one of their freshwater display tanks last year, it's small and pretty cheap, so it seemed like a good choice when I got it. Tank is well lit for the most part, but again, I'm not sure if it's enough. Maybe a second one would do the trick?

Mine are under two hydra 52s at 3" below water surface. Guessing 350+ par based on past readings.
Still stretching....dont think its from lighting. Theyve been doing that since i had them under 2x hydra 26s.
Po4 deficient is my guess. They used to look like this under hydra 26s and no nitrate with slightly elevated p04.

My PO4 is usually pretty high though, so I'd be surprised if that would be the case. Could too much phosphates cause the stretching as well?

Have you sent your owater to one of those ipc testing places. It will tell you the values of many things including heavey metals. The test would be a good clue either way. I have two of the AI 26HD. Run carbon one every 4 to 6 weeks ... don't give up .... you will figure it out.

Something like Triton? I haven't, might be worth doing it though.
I'm also not at the point of giving up yet

 

[Saltyreef]

Seeing as your po4 is .05 and nitrates are 10. It pretty much mimics my nutrient ratio.
Im raising my po4 slowly and keeping my nitrates as is. Ill update on how the zoas respond. So far theyve stopped melting and zoa pox are finally knocked back....i feel some stretching had receeded too.

 

[Bars]

I guess we'll see then.

Any downsides to running carbon 24/7? I never run carbon, but might be worth doing. As I understand it, leathers are quite aggressive and I've got some huge (and thriving) toadstools. For some reason I've never been able to keep xenia or gsp either, so perhaps chemical warfare plays a part in all this? Every now and then almost all lps shrivel for no reason for about an hour or 2 and are then back to normal again. Maybe related as well? I have no idea how chemical warfare exactly works though.

 

[Saltyreef]

GAC and dosing carbon are two very different things and serve two different purposes. I float GAC almost 24/7. Taking it out only periodically.

 

[Terry Mattson]

Do you feed your zoas? Although they are photocynthetc I tofeed them along with all the rest of my corals. Reef roids sprayed right on them from a feeder tube with current off. Ro you have flow in tank?

 

[Bars]

GAC and dosing carbon are two very different things and serve two different purposes. I float GAC almost 24/7. Taking it out only periodically.

Ah, sorry, in that case I meant GAC.

Do you feed your zoas? Although they are photocynthetc I tofeed them along with all the rest of my corals. Reef roids sprayed right on them from a feeder tube with current off. Ro you have flow in tank?

I spray a good bit of reef roids on them every week. Though I do notice they barely react to it, compared to some hitchhiking palythoas and the 2 frags I picked up yesterday.

Going to pick up some GAC either tomorrow or monday and start using that as well.

 

[Bars]

Well, this is kinda weird.
Had to move a couple of corals around and as a result moved the lotr frag as well. He's now a tiny bit lower in the tank and in a very low flow area.

Took this picture just now. No more stretching and looking really good. 2 hours after I moved it.

Only thing that I can think of now is that the neighbouring candy canes or Blastomussas bothered it.

 

[Bars]

Yay! Growth!
The orange zoa frag has significantly grown in size and they've grown a baby. The rasta frag still looks a bit sad, but they've grown a teeny tiny polyp as well.

Not sure if it's the carbon, one of the other changes I've done or a combination, but at least they finally seem happy The carbon definitely seems to have a positive effect on all corals though.

 

[jeffchapok]

Just removed the plugs from the liverock for a closer look. Unfortunately I don't have a magnifying glass so couldn't really see anything.

Just FYI, I have a magnifying app on my phone that allows me to get an ultra up close view of my corals, without even removing them from the tank. I've found a couple of aiptasia on frags with it and was able to deal with them before they became a problem. You might look for one for your phone too.

Here's an example of what it can do: