A year in, and uglier than ever…help!

[hannernanner]

Hello all,
I am at a loss. My Waterbox 130.4 has been up almost a year (Dec 2020) and it’s never looked worse. I’m looking for a light at the end of the tunnel here. I’ve had brown goop algae cover everything for 5 months now (see photo) and nothing seems to beat it back. The sand is the worst, since the algae is impossible to separate from the sand with a siphon. I’ve tried:
- removing it manually every two weeks with a toothbrush and siphon
- doing less frequent water changes (20% once a month) and dosing both Nitrates and Phosphates to get nutrients up
- waiting to see if something else comes along to outcompete it
- A tuxedo urchin

meanwhile I can’t seem to keep even the most basic corals. I killed a DUNCAN. Slowly. My toadstool is grumpy, Zoas barely open. I’ll list below parameters and what I’ve been doing. Any input/ ideas/ encouragement welcome. I don’t know how much longer I can stare at a tank of brown goop.

- Nitrates between 1ppm (before I dosed) to steady 5-7ppm (now)
- Phosphate up from .01 (before I dosed) to .03-.04 (now)
- dKH 8.0-8.3
- Calcium, magnesium and pH are all within recommended range. I test these weekly, I test the 3 above parameters every 2-3 days!
- dose phytoplankton every other day
- run small bag of carbon changed 1x month
- other inhabitants are 5 small fish and a handful of other corals that are far from thriving but technically still alive.
- water comes from home RODI w/ TDS 0

Thanks in advance!

 

[BeltedCoyote]

@ReefSquad

In the meantime, what does your source water look like as far as tds?

if you’re using an RODI, do the cartridges need changing?

what does your nutrient export look like?

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

@ReefSquad

In the meantime, what does your source water look like as far as tds?

if you’re using an RODI, do the cartridges need changing?

what does your nutrient export look like?

With 0 tds on the output, that should show the RODI is in working order.

@hannernanner have you confirmed what Type of algea or bacteria you are dealing with?

What is deferent between the left and right side of the tank? The left side looks great and the right side looks bad.

What sort and how many lights are up there?

 

[BeltedCoyote]

With 0 tds on the output, that should show the RODI is in working order.

@hannernanner have you confirmed what Type of algea or bacteria you are dealing with?

What is deferent between the left and right side of the tank? The left side looks great and the right side looks bad.

What sort and how many lights are up there?

good call. Missed where tds was mentioned. Sorry OP

 

[hannernanner]

With 0 tds on the output, that should show the RODI is in working order.

@hannernanner have you confirmed what Type of algea or bacteria you are dealing with?

What is deferent between the left and right side of the tank? The left side looks great and the right side looks bad.

What sort and how many lights are up there?

Thanks for the quick reply! For lack of a microscope I have not confirmed the species. I suspect I’ll have to do that as a next step.

In the photo, I had just spent 1.5 hours scrubbing rocks with a toothbrush, and stirring & siphoning sand (left side). Lost about a handful of sand in the process. Right side is 2 weeks growth from the last time I deep cleaned.

Lights are (2) gen 3 Radion Pros running the “soft coral & lps” schedule from eco tech at about 64% intensity.

 

[Billldg]

What are you using to test P04?

Trust me, your tank looks great compared to mine. I went thru a big battle with Dino's, and now I am dealing with some sort of LHA, not sure if its green or brown, and, it still may be a all together different type of algae. The point is, you are not alone.

 

[hannernanner]

What are you using to test P04?

Trust me, your tank looks great compared to mine. I went thru a big battle with Dino's, and now I am dealing with some sort of LHA, not sure if its green or brown, and, it still may be a all together different type of algae. The point is, you are not alone.

@Billldg I'm using Tropic Marin phosphate test. I also sent an ICP sample about two weeks ago, as a check for all my test kits, but it appears they lost the sample, they claim to have not received it yet...and it's good to know I'm not alone, but I'm sad for us both!

 

[Idech]

I’m no expert but I would think dosing plankton might be causing at least part of it. I noticed when I dose plankton too often or too much, it doesn’t take long that the algae sets in.

Try going without plankton for a while, then try dosing a lot less.

 

[Billldg]

@Billldg I'm using Tropic Marin phosphate test. I also sent an ICP sample about two weeks ago, as a check for all my test kits, but it appears they lost the sample, they claim to have not received it yet...and it's good to know I'm not alone, but I'm sad for us both!

Not really sure on that test kit. I have used the Red Sea test kit and now use a Hanna. I would not trust that reading if it is anywhere near to the margin of error. When my Hanna ULR reads .03, I will dose as the margin of error for a Hanna ULR is .03.

Like I said, you are not alone. I am currently going thru a battle of some sort of algae myself, AFTER, dealing with Dino's. The fact that their is always a solution to any problem keeps me moving forward. I will win my battle, I say this because I KNOW YOU WILL ALSO!!! Never be sad for us both, AS, we both will get thru this and become smarter down the road.

As far as ICP test, I use Triton.

 

[hannernanner]

@ReefSquad

In the meantime, what does your source water look like as far as tds?

if you’re using an RODI, do the cartridges need changing?

what does your nutrient export look like?

Oh and nutrient export is a reef octo skimmer, set on "eco" mode (DC pump, so it's on a lower mode because I figure nutrients are too low rather than too high.

 

[attiland]

Hello all,
I am at a loss. My Waterbox 130.4 has been up almost a year (Dec 2020) and it’s never looked worse. I’m looking for a light at the end of the tunnel here. I’ve had brown goop algae cover everything for 5 months now (see photo) and nothing seems to beat it back. The sand is the worst, since the algae is impossible to separate from the sand with a siphon. I’ve tried:
- removing it manually every two weeks with a toothbrush and siphon
- doing less frequent water changes (20% once a month) and dosing both Nitrates and Phosphates to get nutrients up
- waiting to see if something else comes along to outcompete it
- A tuxedo urchin

meanwhile I can’t seem to keep even the most basic corals. I killed a DUNCAN. Slowly. My toadstool is grumpy, Zoas barely open. I’ll list below parameters and what I’ve been doing. Any input/ ideas/ encouragement welcome. I don’t know how much longer I can stare at a tank of brown goop.

- Nitrates between 1ppm (before I dosed) to steady 5-7ppm (now)
- Phosphate up from .01 (before I dosed) to .03-.04 (now)
- dKH 8.0-8.3
- Calcium, magnesium and pH are all within recommended range. I test these weekly, I test the 3 above parameters every 2-3 days!
- dose phytoplankton every other day
- run small bag of carbon changed 1x month
- other inhabitants are 5 small fish and a handful of other corals that are far from thriving but technically still alive.
- water comes from home RODI w/ TDS 0

Thanks in advance!

First get a microscope that stuff on the sand could be cyano or Dino.
Based on the corals are grumpy I suspect Dinos but my eyes are not microscope. Cost you £30 for a used on eBay.

based on your findings you can make a move.


in the meantime if you not already have activated carbon running get some you can’t go wrong


that phosphate is too low for LPS and Zoas . I would go 0.05-0.1ppm set your nitrates to 5-10ppm.

Slow down with phytoplankton too. Those few corals need less.

 

[takitaj]

I was in the same boat a few months ago. I tried every method under the sun until I watched a video by Melev's reef and he was talking about Reef Enhance by Reef Brite. I tried the Reef Rock Enhance and it worked to clear the rocks of the crud, cyano and dinos (Amphidinium) slowly disappeared. I'm sure you can imagine the satisfaction watching it all melt away. Shortly after coraline finally starting popping up all over. It took 2 doses a week apart. Tank was almost completely clear after the 2nd week. Still clear 3 months later. It was like $20 and I'd say the best 20 bux I ever spent. lol I got it from BRS but you have to search for it specifically.

*I'm not an affiliate just a happy customer.

 

[pochaxoo]

I had a very similar look on my sandbed and that looks like Dinos on the right. I know exactly what you mean about it clumping in the sand bed. I am curious on the ICP test did it come back with elevated silicates? I found my TDS meter doesn't appear to be picking that up and changed my filters on my RODI. I would definitely stop the phyto dosing and keep working on the phosphate dosing. Your nitrates are good enough but monitor a couple times a week until you are sure the nitrates and phosphates stay up. I would recommend staying on whatever water change schedule you have as well.

Another thing I did was to siphon the surface part of the sandbed that had the clumped dinos or algae. This was removing plenty of sand which I captured and moved to my refugium. After a week or two in the refugium it was white again. (alternatively lowing lights might have same effect).

 

[hannernanner]

I had a very similar look on my sandbed and that looks like Dinos on the right. I know exactly what you mean about it clumping in the sand bed. I am curious on the ICP test did it come back with elevated silicates? I found my TDS meter doesn't appear to be picking that up and changed my filters on my RODI. I would definitely stop the phyto dosing and keep working on the phosphate dosing. Your nitrates are good enough but monitor a couple times a week until you are sure the nitrates and phosphates stay up. I would recommend staying on whatever water change schedule you have as well.

Another thing I did was to siphon the surface part of the sandbed that had the clumped dinos or algae. This was removing plenty of sand which I captured and moved to my refugium. After a week or two in the refugium it was white again. (alternatively lowing lights might have same effect).

Once I actually get the ICP test I'll be sure and keep that in mind. They lost my sample I'm guessing, since it's been almost 2 weeks and they say they haven't received it yet...good tip about moving sand to the sump, thanks!

 

[Streetlamp]

I went through similar, a tank covered in cyano and hair algae, around the year mark for a good few months. I tried all sorts. The good news what worked for me was quite simple. I backed my lights down to 5% blue only for a week or more and then slowly ramped them back up. From then the tank is looking much much better. Give it a shot

 

[sixty_reefer]

Have you tried the black out yet?

 

[Not an IT guy]

How’s your water movement??

 

[hannernanner]

Have you tried the black out yet?

I haven't, that may be my next step. Just worried that if I don't identify the underlying cause, that it will just come back post-blackout..

 

[hannernanner]

How’s your water movement??

Nothing crazy since I just have softies and a couple LPS at the moment, but it's decent. MP40 on one side and a gyre on the other. The algae (?) seems to grow equally well on the rock right in front of the gyre (high flow) as it does on rocks in less flow.

 

[Lavey29]

I honestly don't think your tank is in that bad of shape. I'm 7 months in and sort of similar to yours now. Your parameters aren't bad. I run radions also but at 50% schedule so 40% intensity. Maybe get a sand sifting starfish who has been cleaning mine well. You have a LOT of open space for him to work. It just takes time for these tanks to stabilize. I dose phytoplankton daily. Microbacter clean once a week. Carbon in the sump and a skimmer. Finally seeing coraline and sand has been slowly clearing up. I think you stay the course with maybe minor tweaks here and there. Try cutting light intensity by a third.

Why do you run a gyre on one side and ecotech on the other? If I'm seeing right, maybe your flow is not consistent and balanced?