Algae conspiracy theory

mar.deezy

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Algae conspiracy theory
Ok i have an algae conspiracy theory please give me some insight if any of this is even possible. Ok so algae has never been a huge problem for me in both of my tanks. I guess i was lucky. But in the past months i have had such a huge GHA and turf algae in my display problem and some cyano. Thick mats of what seemed to be a blanket of algae overtaking everything. My phosphate stayed around .03-.09 and my nitrates were steady under 10. The changes made most recent to the outbreak was i cleaned my new SM algae scrubber, and i added 2 aqua mags rock mag jrs. IS IT AT ALL POSSIBLE FOR A: during the cleaning of my scrubber some of the algae went into the display and spread (because the algae in the scrubber was very similar to the outbreak of algae in my display) and or B: the rock mag jrs are leaching into the water. Is this crazy or does this seem legit?
 
Read Forest Rohwer's "Coral Reefs in the Microbial Seas" (kindle ~$10, paperback ~$20). It's an excellent introduction to the roles of DOC and microbial processes on reefs. Among the various aspects he give a good description of how small pertubations to the equilibrium of a ecosystem can cause dramatic shifts. Some of the research refferenced shows how algae is antagonistic to corals and the positive fedback loops that can shift a from corals to algae. Besides the 100+ papers he refrences here's ome more recent ones further showing the antagonistc roles of algae, corals and the various types of DOC.

Indirect effects of algae on coral: algae‐mediated, microbe‐induced coral mortality
Coral seperated from algae with a .02 µm filter die. Treatment with aampicillan prevents death.

Influence of coral and algal exudates on microbially mediated reef metabolism.
Coral DOC improves oxygen (autotrophy), algae DOC reduces oxygen (heterotrophy).

Effects of Coral Reef Benthic Primary Producers on Dissolved Organic Carbon and Microbial Activity
Algae releases significantly more DOC into the water than coral.

Pathologies and mortality rates caused by organic carbon and nutrient stressors in three Caribbean coral species.
Starch and sugars (doc) caused coral death but not high nitrates, phosphates or ammonium.

Visualization of oxygen distribution patterns caused by coral and algae

Biological oxygen demand optode analysis of coral reef-associated microbial communities exposed to algal exudates
Exposure to exudates derived from turf algae stimulated higher oxygen drawdown by the coral-associated bacteria.

Microbial ecology: Algae feed a shift on coral reefs

Coral and macroalgal exudates vary in neutral sugar composition and differentially enrich reef bacterioplankton lineages.

Sugar enrichment provides evidence for a role of nitrogen fixation in coral bleaching

Elevated ammonium delays the impairment of the coral-dinoflagellate symbiosis during labile carbon pollution
(here's an argument for maintaining heavy fish loads if you're carbon dosing)

Excess labile carbon promotes the expression of virulence factors in coral reef bacterioplankton

Unseen players shape benthic competition on coral reefs.

Allelochemicals Produced by Brown Macroalgae of the Lobophora Genus Are Active against Coral Larvae and Associated Bacteria, Supporting Pathogenic Shifts to Vibrio Dominance.

Macroalgae decrease growth and alter microbial community structure of the reef-building coral, Porites astreoides.

Macroalgal extracts induce bacterial assemblage shifts and sublethal tissue stress in Caribbean corals.

Biophysical and physiological processes causing oxygen loss from coral reefs.

Global microbialization of coral reefs
DDAM Proven


Because sponges are essential players in the carbon, nitrogen and phosphorus cycle(s) on reefs here's some links to research done with them.

Element cycling on tropical coral reefs.
This is Jasper de Geoij's ground breaking research on reef sponges. (The introduction is in Dutch but the content is in English.)

Sponge symbionts and the marine P cycle

Phosphorus sequestration in the form of polyphosphate by microbial symbionts in marine sponges
(Chris Kenndall had a problem with low PO4 and had problems raising it with Neophos. Samples sent off showed phosphorus crystals developing in some of the sponges in his system accounting for at least some of his systems consumption.)

Differential recycling of coral and algal dissolved organic matter via the sponge loop.
Sponges treat DOC from algae differently than DOC from corals

Surviving in a Marine Desert The Sponge Loop Retains Resources Within Coral Reefs
Dissolved organic carbon and nitrogen are quickly processed by sponges and released back into the reef food web in hours as carbon and nitrogen rich detritus.

Natural Diet of Coral-Excavating Sponges Consists Mainly of Dissolved Organic Carbon (DOC)

The Role of Marine Sponges in Carbon and Nitrogen Cycles of COral Reefs and Nearshore Environments.

And since we're discussing favorable and not so favorable bacteria here's a paper looking at how different corals and polyps are influencing the bacteria in the water column.
Aura-biomes are present in the water layer above coral reef benthic macro-organisms

My recommendation is toss the ATS
 
I have read Forest Rohwer's "Coral Reefs in the Microbial Seas" and a number of the other studies provided by Tim. Experiments have shown that coral subjected to algae DOC can die as their own holobiont (bacteria, archaea, etc.) multiplies to such an extent that it uses up all the local oxygen. So basically the coral suffocates.

On the flip side, people have been using ATS's and Macro Algae in refugiums for ages and have been successful, so there's that.

IMO, it is likely that the negative outcome associated with algae DOCs in the studies is one of a significant quantity of DOC supplied within a relatively short time frame. When a system is slowly acclimated to increasing DOC levels (up to a point), I suspect that the coral holobiont has time to adjust and this is what makes the difference.

You mention a lot of algae similar to what is growing in your ATS. That would imply that there is a surplus of available nutrients in the system. Did you completely clean the ATS, or just scrape the top layers off? Did you have coral or other larger organisms die off either right before or after you cleaned the ATS?

Pics of the system would help, too.
 
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Read Forest Rohwer's "Coral Reefs in the Microbial Seas" (kindle ~$10, paperback ~$20). It's an excellent introduction to the roles of DOC and microbial processes on reefs. Among the various aspects he give a good description of how small pertubations to the equilibrium of a ecosystem can cause dramatic shifts. Some of the research refferenced shows how algae is antagonistic to corals and the positive fedback loops that can shift a from corals to algae. Besides the 100+ papers he refrences here's ome more recent ones further showing the antagonistc roles of algae, corals and the various types of DOC.

Indirect effects of algae on coral: algae‐mediated, microbe‐induced coral mortality
Coral seperated from algae with a .02 µm filter die. Treatment with aampicillan prevents death.

Influence of coral and algal exudates on microbially mediated reef metabolism.
Coral DOC improves oxygen (autotrophy), algae DOC reduces oxygen (heterotrophy).

Effects of Coral Reef Benthic Primary Producers on Dissolved Organic Carbon and Microbial Activity
Algae releases significantly more DOC into the water than coral.

Pathologies and mortality rates caused by organic carbon and nutrient stressors in three Caribbean coral species.
Starch and sugars (doc) caused coral death but not high nitrates, phosphates or ammonium.

Visualization of oxygen distribution patterns caused by coral and algae

Biological oxygen demand optode analysis of coral reef-associated microbial communities exposed to algal exudates
Exposure to exudates derived from turf algae stimulated higher oxygen drawdown by the coral-associated bacteria.

Microbial ecology: Algae feed a shift on coral reefs

Coral and macroalgal exudates vary in neutral sugar composition and differentially enrich reef bacterioplankton lineages.

Sugar enrichment provides evidence for a role of nitrogen fixation in coral bleaching

Elevated ammonium delays the impairment of the coral-dinoflagellate symbiosis during labile carbon pollution
(here's an argument for maintaining heavy fish loads if you're carbon dosing)

Excess labile carbon promotes the expression of virulence factors in coral reef bacterioplankton

Unseen players shape benthic competition on coral reefs.

Allelochemicals Produced by Brown Macroalgae of the Lobophora Genus Are Active against Coral Larvae and Associated Bacteria, Supporting Pathogenic Shifts to Vibrio Dominance.

Macroalgae decrease growth and alter microbial community structure of the reef-building coral, Porites astreoides.

Macroalgal extracts induce bacterial assemblage shifts and sublethal tissue stress in Caribbean corals.

Biophysical and physiological processes causing oxygen loss from coral reefs.

Global microbialization of coral reefs
DDAM Proven


Because sponges are essential players in the carbon, nitrogen and phosphorus cycle(s) on reefs here's some links to research done with them.

Element cycling on tropical coral reefs.
This is Jasper de Geoij's ground breaking research on reef sponges. (The introduction is in Dutch but the content is in English.)

Sponge symbionts and the marine P cycle

Phosphorus sequestration in the form of polyphosphate by microbial symbionts in marine sponges
(Chris Kenndall had a problem with low PO4 and had problems raising it with Neophos. Samples sent off showed phosphorus crystals developing in some of the sponges in his system accounting for at least some of his systems consumption.)

Differential recycling of coral and algal dissolved organic matter via the sponge loop.
Sponges treat DOC from algae differently than DOC from corals

Surviving in a Marine Desert The Sponge Loop Retains Resources Within Coral Reefs
Dissolved organic carbon and nitrogen are quickly processed by sponges and released back into the reef food web in hours as carbon and nitrogen rich detritus.

Natural Diet of Coral-Excavating Sponges Consists Mainly of Dissolved Organic Carbon (DOC)

The Role of Marine Sponges in Carbon and Nitrogen Cycles of COral Reefs and Nearshore Environments.

And since we're discussing favorable and not so favorable bacteria here's a paper looking at how different corals and polyps are influencing the bacteria in the water column.
Aura-biomes are present in the water layer above coral reef benthic macro-organisms

My recommendation is toss the ATS
Hey that’s a great post, I think im going to have some reading material there! Lol

It might take me a while but I’m going to check out all those links and thanks very much. I might need a few ‘refreshments’ to help me a long the way!
 
de Goeij's thesis (link is in my first post) shows cryptic sponges are a major mediator of labile DOC. With some sponges removing the labile DOC (carbon dosing) at 1000X faster than the bactrioplankton they play a critical role in the success of a reef. The maturing process we see in reef systems (as suggested by Nano Sapiens post) is certainly in part the cryptic sponges developing and growing and recycling more of the labile DOC. But the reasearch also shows cryptic sponges process labile DOC from corals and algae differently and can create feedback loops that favor algae over corals.

The drop in oxygen caused by an increase in heterotrophic bacteria in the coral holobiont certainly is a major factor in coral death. However, some of the research clearly shows increases in pathogens and "virulance factors" in the coral holobiont. When this research is considered with the research showing huge differences in the immune systems of corals at the genotype level it's not surprising some coral species genotypes are able to tolerate heavy pathogen loads in their holobiont. But it also shouldn't be surprising some coral species genotypes either do not thrive or die quickly when added to a system because they either do not have the immune system to deal with bacteria load of a new system or changes in a system. And age is factor too as contrary to common wisdom corals age (and to complicate this individual polyps in a colony can have different ages) Here's some links on coral genotype variations in immune ssytems and coral and polyp senescence:

Intraspecific differences in molecular stress responses and coral pathobiome contribute to mortality under bacterial challenge in Acropora millepora (genotype specific responses to pathogens)

Tissue age affects calcification in the scleractinian coral Madracis Mirabilis

Age-related deterioration of a physiological function in the branching coral Acropora palmata

Senescence and dying signals Stylophora pistillata

Do reef corals age? (this is a pretty thick one)

Another factor we need to take into account is corals have environmental memory. So just because speciman of a coral species/genotype does well in a system or location doesn't mean a second speciman of the same species/genotype will if it adapted to different conditions.

Bleaching patterns in corals

Decadal environmental memory

So, an overwhelming list of variables (and there's more but this seemed enough for now o_O). It's pretty obvious to me corals, algae and sponges (and fungii) are all actively manipulating their environment and we CAN NOT test or monitor what they are doing. It's also obvious we CAN NOT determine if a coral is healthy by any external factors. It seems to me then, if our intent is to keep systems and corals healthy for thier normal life expectancy (as we do for our pets) we should embrace the research showing what is beneficial and what is unhealthy both short term and long term.
 

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