Alk question driving me nuts

[MA Reefer]

My relativity small tank is consuming what seems to be huge amounts of alk and I still cant get my alk to stay in a goal range of 8-9.....

40 gal display, 20gal long sump....id estimate overall water vol to be ~50gal.

1.5lbs of live rock per gal, fairly rock heavy.

Right now dosing 120ml / day of baked arm & hammer 2 cups per gal rodi.

Ph pretty steady at 8.2

Ca hovers 380-410 dosing 120ml/day of Seachem Ca powder 2 cups/gal rodi.

My alk is 7.7-8.4 but i really struggle to keep it over 8.

Reading threads folks dose fractions of what i do in tanks 2x the size. My neighbor has a 70gal red sea display plus sump and he does like 20ml per day!

Is this normal? Seems like soo much alk im putting in. Its a mixed reef with bigger lps, some encrusting and branching montis, some acros but nothing real big except a hydronophora. My acros are small and not really growing or happy. Lps seems happy and growing.

No CaCO3 deposits on anything...a little bit on the heater. Maybe all the live rock coraline is sucking it up?

Is this normal? Alk goes in every hour and ca goes in 15 min later. Any ideas?

I attached a pic of the display if that helps

 

[sorloe]

What salt are you using? I have the same problem using tropic Marin salt but the back of my aquarium was growing a lot of coralline. I removed it and will test alk again tomorrow.

 

[Pistondog]

Hard to see in the pic, but coralline will consume a lot of alk.

 

[MA Reefer]

What salt are you using? I have the same problem using tropic Marin salt but the back of my aquarium was growing a lot of coralline. I removed it and will test alk again tomorrow.

Reef crystals

 

[lazy josh]

Im not an expert on it being that im new to reefing but all the threads i have been reading says that magnesium plays a big roll in keeping cal/stable

test that and see what you come up with

Also dont do anything else until some one with more experience gives you some advice but it cant hurt to test magnesium level

 

[lazy josh]

Im not an expert on it being that im new to reefing but all the threads i have been reading says that magnesium plays a big roll in keeping cal/stable

test that and see what you come up with

Also dont do anything else until some one with more experience gives you some advice but it cant hurt to test magnesium level

Ment to say cal/alk stable

sorry about that

 

[MA Reefer]

Im not an expert on it being that im new to reefing but all the threads i have been reading says that magnesium plays a big roll in keeping cal/stable

test that and see what you come up with

Also dont do anything else until some one with more experience gives you some advice but it cant hurt to test magnesium level

Rock steady mag 1400-1500

 

[lazy josh]

Rock steady mag 1400-1500

Im interested in seeing what you find out is the reason hopefully someone can help

The tank looks good by the way=]

 

[Mastiffsrule]

Evening,

I have a few thought. I think you are using Randy’s recipe #1. In that it should be 2.5 cups I believe for 1 gallon.

If you are dosing close to the same amount calcium and alk that is the way it should be. You may have coraline or just some corals sucking it up you don’t realize.

Do you have a doser or routine, that may help since it look like the average of your range on the graph puts you where you need to be.

Your numbers are balanced, just need to be raised. A Alk of around 8 should have a Ca of around 415. I would start by determining you daily or weekly consumption and dividing by seven and setting up a dosing schedule.

Hope that helps.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php

 

[MA Reefer]

Im interested in seeing what you find out is the reason hopefully someone can help

The tank looks good by the way=]

Thx its about 14 mos old....maybe it just is what it is. But when i read folks with like a 150 gal tank dosing 60ml/day makes me think something isnt right.

I want a 125 but id be dosing like a liter a day at this rate

 

[Mastiffsrule]

What coral do you have, any softies/leathers?

 

[MA Reefer]

Evening,

I have a few thought. I think you are using Randy’s recipe #1. In that it should be 2.5 cups I believe for 1 gallon.

If you are dosing close to the same amount calcium and alk that is the way it should be. You may have coraline or just some corals sucking it up you don’t realize.

Do you have a doser or routine, that may help since it look like the average of your range on the graph puts you where you need to be.

Your numbers are balanced, just need to be raised. A Alk of around 8 should have a Ca of around 415. I would start by determining you daily or weekly consumption and dividing by seven and setting up a dosing schedule.

Hope that helps.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php

The spikes are likely over corrections...i get nervous when it gets in the 7s. I have admittedly neglected my co2 scrubber, changed the media and alk shot up to 12, dosed 2ml of vinegar to bring it down and here we are back at 7.7 :0

 

[MA Reefer]

What coral do you have, any softies/leathers?

Full list:
Trumpet
3 hammers different colors (purple, green-puple tip, orange)
Purple velvet torch
Blastomusa
Assort zoas
Pocilapora
Pink spotted monti (spreading well)
Neon green hydronophora
Purple nana acro- had it a year still size of a quarter
Bubble tip nem
Green trachyphyllia
Assorted lobophyllia
Yellow branching monti
Asd milipora (my favorite looks unwell, no polyo extension)
Small birds nest (growing nice)
2 small red plating montis
Meteor shower cyphastrea (spreading like crazy)
Pulsing xenia
Red spotted shroom
Ricordia

 

[MA Reefer]

The spikes are likely over corrections...i get nervous when it gets in the 7s. I have admittedly neglected my co2 scrubber, changed the media and alk shot up to 12, dosed 2ml of vinegar to bring it down and here we are back at 7.7 :0

I use redsea pro test kits, but for ph a crummy api kit i had was thinking maybe ph is moving more than api will detect. Thats why the scrubber related spike....but 2 days later im right back to where i started struggling to keep 8s

 

[MA Reefer]

Evening,

I have a few thought. I think you are using Randy’s recipe #1. In that it should be 2.5 cups I believe for 1 gallon.

If you are dosing close to the same amount calcium and alk that is the way it should be. You may have coraline or just some corals sucking it up you don’t realize.

Do you have a doser or routine, that may help since it look like the average of your range on the graph puts you where you need to be.

Your numbers are balanced, just need to be raised. A Alk of around 8 should have a Ca of around 415. I would start by determining you daily or weekly consumption and dividing by seven and setting up a dosing schedule.

Hope that helps.

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-02/rhf/index.php

Interesting, could try to bump up the mix. If 2.5 cups will fully dissolve that would help. I use a jaebo dosing pump that dumps right on top of my return pump

 

[X-37B]

You may have precip in your sand if its on your heater.
1400-1500 is a pretty big swing and not rock steady, imo.
My mag is 1350 all the time.
Your higher, but not a problem, mag is from RC's.

I agree your alk appears to be all over the place.
If it stays at 7.7 to 8.4 just leave it their.
Stability is more important than a number.

I run 7-7.5 alk with no issues.
Average ocean alk is 6.5 -7.

What is your WC schedule?

 

[MA Reefer]

You may have precip in your sand if its on your heater.
1400-1500 is a pretty big swing and not rock steady, imo.
My mag is 1350 all the time.
Your higher, but not a problem, mag is from RC's.

I agree your alk appears to be all over the place.
If it stays at 7.7 to 8.4 just leave it their.
Stability is more important than a number.

I run 7-7.5 alk with no issues.
Average ocean alk is 6.5 -7.

What is your WC schedule?

Yeah, reef crystals keep mag up....i rarely dose mg....only if it goes under 1400.

I never tested mag to the 50mg....100 pt swing too much?

I was doing 10 gal/week....but recently i cutting it back to every other, maybe less.

I also run a gfo reactor for ~4hrs per day.
Phos 0.02-0.04

Salinity 1.024-1.025

 

[The Opinionated Reefer]

I have found much the same thing when trying to dose these two and three-part systems in smaller tanks. I found much better success when I switched to an all in one balanced solution. Kalkwasser then carbo-calcium , All-for-reef (which is the same thing with trace) and now I use a calcium reactor. All produced much more stable and better results for me than two-part. I cannot believe how stable my tank is with a calcium reactor. It is the only way I will ever run a reef tank from now on.

 

[Andy Macro]

Do you have a refugium? Photosynthesis in macros and some corals consumes bicarbonate as a CO2 source. My tank only has macroalgae and a couple of soft corals and I have to dose a lot of alkalinity daily

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Always refer to dosing issues in dKH per day. mL per day just forces people do get out a calculator and determine if you are dosing an appropriate amount for your size tank or not.

Is the 2 cups measured before or after baking?

Assuming you made my DIY Recipe 1 correctly, then you are dosing 3.4 dKH per day. That is quite a bit. Perhaps not necessarily too much, but its on the high end.


I would back off on the alkalinity (maintaining ~7 dKH), and switch to the unbaked version to lower pH, and see what effect that has on demand.

Dose to a very high flow area, and possibly more slowly.

If that substantially lowers the demand but corals seem OK, then we can go from there.