All for Reef frustration—Help?

[Lyss]

I’m getting very frustrated with AFR, to the point where I’m not sure I see a benefit to using this product.

Im trying to set up my dosing on a pump, but am still hand dosing b/c I can’t get the AFR to work for me where I don’t need to supplement Calcium and Magnesium.

I dose 1ml AFR in my 20g daily. After 5 days since last testing, my Alk has risen by .3, Cal has dropped by 10, and Mag has dropped by 30. This is just not sustainable for me b/c I need to buy AFR plus Cal and Mag alone to supplement. So then what is the point of the AFR? I do have calcifying macroalgae in my tank in addition to corals that uses up a lot of calcium and grows like a weed.

Aside from pointing at possible testing errors, which could alway be but this type of result is consistent for me so hence my frustration, I’m wondering if anyone else using this product has some thoughts or advice to share. How did you get it dialed in so you can truly just be dosing AFR?

 

[happyhourhero]

It took a couple weeks for me but a higher dose and more corals somehow made my experience as advertised. I dose 9ml a day in my 25 and only have to dose some extra mg here and there.

I also really only care about alk so as long as calcium stayed in an acceptable range when I first started, I was ok. I never had to dose cal.

 

[Woodyman]

I’m getting very frustrated with AFR, to the point where I’m not sure I see a benefit to using this product.

Im trying to set up my dosing on a pump, but am still hand dosing b/c I can’t get the AFR to work for me where I don’t need to supplement Calcium and Magnesium.

I dose 1ml AFR in my 20g daily. After 5 days since last testing, my Alk has risen by .3, Cal has dropped by 10, and Mag has dropped by 30. This is just not sustainable for me b/c I need to buy AFR plus Cal and Mag alone to supplement. So then what is the point of the AFR? I do have calcifying macroalgae in my tank in addition to corals that uses up a lot of calcium and grows like a weed.

Aside from pointing at possible testing errors, which could alway be but this type of result is consistent for me so hence my frustration, I’m wondering if anyone else using this product has some thoughts or advice to share. How did you get it dialed in so you can truly just be dosing AFR?

It may not be a testing error, but keep in mind the accuracy range of your test kits. You Can test kit may only be accurate to +/-10ppm (could be higher or lower, depending on the specific kit).

So you may not be testing incorrectly it could just be the natural bias of the kit being used.

 

[Woodyman]

It took a couple weeks for me but a higher dose and more corals somehow made my experience as advertised. I dose 9ml a day in my 25 and only have to dose some extra mg here and there.

I also really only care about alk so as long as calcium stayed in an acceptable range when I first started, I was ok. I never had to dose cal.

AFR should be dosed based on Ca vs ALK, the alk in AFR is bound up different then traditional dosing and doesn't immediately register as alk on testing kits.

All should obviously still be monitored, but don't dose AFR based on ALK values alone.

 

[Lyss]

AFR should be dosed based on Ca vs ALK, the alk in AFR is bound up different then traditional dosing and doesn't immediately register as alk on testing kits.

All should obviously still be monitored, but don't dose AFR based on ALK values alone.

Right, but if I do that my alk always shoots up way worse than I’ve listed here, and my corals are not happy. I’ve lost corals b/c of alk spikes. I am really at the end of my rope w/this.

 

[Doug6952]

My calcium and magnesium went high when I started dosing AFR. I was dosing quite a bit more than what you're dosing in a 20 gallon tank to maintain alk.

 

[Lyss]

It may not be a testing error, but keep in mind the accuracy range of your test kits. You Can test kit may only be accurate to +/-10ppm (could be higher or lower, depending on the specific kit).

So you may not be testing incorrectly it could just be the natural bias of the kit being used.

I’m using hanna for alk, Salifert for cal/mag.

 

[Woodyman]

Right, but if I do that my alk always shoots up way worse than I’ve listed here, and my corals are not happy. I’ve lost corals b/c of alk spikes. I am really at the end of my rope w/this.

The calcified algae probably leads to some imbalance of uptake I imagine since AFR was designed around coral consumption. I'm not sure, just a guess.

 

[Lyss]

So based on a few replies should I be dosing more to get calcium in line and ignoring the alk going up?

 

[Lyss]

The calcified algae probably leads to some imbalance of uptake I imagine since AFR was designed around coral consumption. I'm not sure, just a guess.

Yep I’m wondering the same. Might need to pull it.

 

[Woodyman]

So based on a few replies should I be dosing more to get calcium in line and ignoring the alk going up?

Should be dosed based on Ca. You can use the tropic Marin balling part A+B to adjust Ca/alk independently as needed.

I would use parts A+B to get both all and Ca to your desired range, then continue dosing your AFR and monitor Ca and adjust AFR dosage from there based on Ca consumption. As needed supplement more part A or B for alk/Ca.

@Lou Ekus might have some ideas about the calcified algae.

 

[Acros]

AFR takes a few weeks or more to dial it in. I am still trying to. Are you using kalk or any other kind of supplementation? If not, your tank should be consuming 0 alk.

 

[Lyss]

AFR takes a few weeks or more to dial it in. I am still trying to. Are you using kalk or any other kind of supplementation? If not, your tank should be consuming 0 alk.

I’ve not been adding anything but AFR, and some Cal and Mag to supplement when those drop too low.

Tank does use a very small amount of alk daily, b/c it will drop about .1/.2 per day if I don’t dose. But the calcium consumption is high, and magnesium i would say is fairly high as well.

 

[Stevesreef225]

I dose AFR based on alk and my ca and mg always stay in acceptable range. It’s a 50 gallon packed with coral and i dose 40ml a day. 1 ml of afr is almost nothing and Those variants in your #s are so small I’d imagine you would get the same results if you weren’t dosing anything at all.

 

[Acros]

I have a 25 lagoon (~18 gallon effective water volume) and have observed that 1ml of AFR corresponds to about 0.1dkh increase in alk. I am a little surprised that you observed 0.3dkh increase after dosing 1ml for 3 days. Do you know what your effective water volume might be?

When I dial in AFR, I go by 1ml increments. My current consumption is about 0.7dkh.

Do you test every day at the same time?

Edit: I dose AFR based on alk.

 

[Lyss]

I have a 25 lagoon (~18 gallon effective water volume) and have observed that 1ml of AFR corresponds to about 0.1dkh increase in alk. I am a little surprised that you observed 0.3dkh increase after dosing 1ml for 3 days. Do you know what your effective water volume might be?

When I dial in AFR, I go by 1ml increments. My current consumption is about 0.7dkh.

Do you test every day at the same time?

Edit: I dose AFR based on alk.

I’m also wondering if I’m actually keeping the alk pretty steady b/c doesn’t hanna have a .2 margin of error? I might try increasing the dose to fit w/cal consumption and see where that gets me. I do think the calcifying algae could be an issue, and I also have a lot of inverts that are growing (maybe too lol) well and I’m assuming using calcium, too.

 

[Acros]

Every tank is different, they don’t always consume alk and cal in a ratio. What are your current alk, cal and mag levels at? Sorry if you mentioned that already.

Depending on were those levels are, you could try dosing 1ml a day, at the same time each day and test at the same time each day for a week. That will give you a better idea of you tank consumption. I you dose in the morning, test in the evening.

 

[Lyss]

Every tank is different, they don’t always consume alk and cal in a ratio. What are your current alk, cal and mag levels at? Sorry if you mentioned that already.

Depending on were those levels are, you could try dosing 1ml a day, at the same time each day and test at the same time each day for a week. That will give you a better idea of you tank consumption. I you dose in the morning, test in the evening.

These are the numbers from last three tests, which happen to be 4 days apart each. Actually, looking at it like this now it’s pretty steady. I haven’t tested salinity yet today and now I’m wondering if there was a slight salinity drop.

Either way I’d like my cal and Mag to be a little higher than the highest readings here:


1/21/22
Alk: 9
Cal: 410-415
Mag: 1305
Salinity: 35ppt

1/25/22
Alk: 8.9
Cal: 410
Mag: 1305
Salinity: 34-35 ppt

1/29/22
Alk: 9.2
Cal: 400
Mag: 1275

 

[Acros]

That doesn’t look bad. Why do you suspect a salinity drop? Do you top off manually?

 

[Lyss]

That doesn’t look bad. Why do you suspect a salinity drop? Do you top off manually?

I have a max nano and am still using the little ATO box it comes with, which needs to be topped up every night. I skim pretty wet b/c I carbon dose so I need to add saltwater in about a 2 Rodi/1saltwater ratio when I refill or the salinity starts to drop.

I just checked that and it was in the same 34/35 ppt range it usually is in tho.