Back at it! Peroxide vrs cyanobacteria

[john.m.cole3]

Will probably start this soon with a small dose and move up. I dont have cayno in the tank but the sump man its got a strong hold down there. No matter what I do it just wont go away. I thought it was from the vodka so I quit dosing removed all the cayno and its back. Thought about trying vinegar to see if maybe I can get a different bacteria strand to out compete it than I got with vodka but I have always liked my vodka and its hard to teach an old dog new tricks.

I like vodka too!

 

[john.m.cole3]

I have posted pics of cyanobacteria you can't miss it!
No there is no set plan until I get this put togethet.
Also yes.. this issue is so wide spread that it needed my attention.

and we thank you for it!

 

[john.m.cole3]

I've noticed some cyanobacteria with the bubbles in it for about 10 days now. I began dosing 1 ml per 10 gallons of 3% peroxide once a day for 2 days then twice a day for 3 more days. I didn't know about taking gfo offline or to reduce my white lights. I did vacuum the same bed on Saturday but the orange and red stuff came back on the rocks and on the sand worse than before. So I'm going to call tomorrow day 1. I have a fellow reefer (@brandon429 )coming over to help me clean the Rocks outside of the tank and to siphon the sand bed. I'll keep you posted on the progress while I maintain 1 ml to 10 gallon dose of 3% peroxide twice a day while lights are out and cut back on my light cycle. Here's a beginning pic.

 

[brandon429]

That pic did wonders for prep strategy John
Clear direction became apparent just now



The part that has me grinning is the specific tank start you chose, we needed that benefit right now.

Your sandbed pre rinse a month ago just made you have zero cycle possibility now, as we clean. If this was the typical transferred sandbed, any waste we would kick up cleaning a top invader would feed your targets cyclically as nutrient up well. Forcing more peroxide dosing in the water...but your take is opposite now. Less insult to your frags to be clean


***large portions of peroxide are chemically degraded quickly in a reef tank where organic reserves- detritus- is stored in the sandbed and among pores in the rock

Sinked detritus keepers will be adding more peroxide to get the same benefits that the clean tanker will not need (increasing risks to sensitives)




Organic molecules have an immediate and measurable effect on peroxide chemistry, that action is directly implicated in the ORP paradox listed in prior pages...won't be a problem here, your tank sinks no waste.

We can clean less in time as that tank matures

Your sandbed red areas needs to be top siphoned in the red areas into a bucket. Take an inch out if it comes, remove target is goal, won't take long. Then we clean the sand removed, and just set it back by hand you lose no sand you just lose target and tank looks new


don't need deep sandbed cleaning

the peroxide dose you are considering should be continued in the soon to be forced clean tank...and we chart only growback going off this one catchup clean. Then in a week a tiny portion shows up only in one spot...siphon out and repeat (hand guiding) and this will cease fast

 

[cowboy]

@john.m.cole3 hey man I know this off subject but seen your from lubbock. Was wandering if you knew what happened to the reef club there. I sign on every now and then and its like everyone left.

 

[brandon429]

It is alive and well he hosted reef club meeting at his house~ dang good food I won some stuff

Cowboy if you were from Lubbock that's neat I've only met one so far here

 

[BoneXriffic]

Impressive work twillard, and assistants. Has this shown any effect on some of the algaes? Asides from cyano bact and dinos?

 

[cowboy]

Im actually from Hobbs but lubbock is the closest reef club.

 

[cowboy]

Impressive work twillard, and assistants. Has this shown any effect on some of the algaes? Asides from cyano bact and dinos?

So it has shown effectiveness when in use on dinos and hair algae. Especially when used in conjunction with GFO. But it will strip the tank of Po4 atleast it did mine and that study is coming here soon.

 

[john.m.cole3]

That pic did wonders for prep strategy John
Clear direction became apparent just now



The part that has me grinning is the specific tank start you chose, we needed that benefit right now.

Your sandbed pre rinse a month ago just made you have zero cycle possibility now, as we clean. If this was the typical transferred sandbed, any waste we would kick up cleaning a top invader would feed your targets cyclically as nutrient up well. Forcing more peroxide dosing in the water...but your take is opposite now. Less insult to your frags to be clean


***large portions of peroxide are chemically degraded quickly in a reef tank where organic reserves- detritus- is stored in the sandbed and among pores in the rock

Sinked detritus keepers will be adding more peroxide to get the same benefits that the clean tanker will not need (increasing risks to sensitives)




Organic molecules have an immediate and measurable effect on peroxide chemistry, that action is directly implicated in the ORP paradox listed in prior pages...won't be a problem here, your tank sinks no waste.

We can clean less in time as that tank matures and takes on competing communities, but tomorrow is tank housecleaning and more hobby $ drone loss recovery counseling for me

Your sandbed red areas needs to be top siphoned in the red areas into a bucket. Take an inch out if it comes, remove target is goal, won't take long. Then we clean the sand removed, and just set it back by hand you lose no sand you just lose target and tank looks new


don't need deep sandbed cleaning

the peroxide dose you are considering should be continued in the soon to be forced clean tank...and we chart only growback going off this one catchup clean. Then in a week a tiny portion shows up only in one spot...siphon out and repeat (hand guiding) and this will cease fast

this response makes sense and I am ready to start the end of this unsightliness. Thanks to this thread and the responses by members, I feel that this can be managed for sure. Big thanks to @twillard once again for getting this ball rolling. I'm looking forward to the final write up!

 

[shollis2814]

OK, three progress pictures. The first one is misleading. As @twilliard explained to me, these bacteria switch their biochemical process in the absence of light. Because of that, and the fact that light energy is enough to free up that barely attached oxygen means that the lights off dosing of H2O2 is more effective and has a longer half life than the lights on dose. I upped the dose a bit because I am seeing no ill effects in my inverts. I am dosing 4.5 ml for a 36 gallon with ~5 gallon sump 2x a day-first thing in the morning, when I still have a few hours of lights off, and when I get home in the evening, when I have a few hours of light and then darkness. The first picture was shortly after lights came on, which means the peroxide has had the maximum effect.

The mats are thin, and you can see substrate under the red.
The next two pictures are at the same time on the following two days, after the mats have had light to re-establish. I am dosing into my sump. I am not sure why the one area seems to be the epicenter of die off, but I suspect when my return flow hits the front glass it gets directed to this area of the substrate.

Day 2

And last night

Looking at the last two, I am encouraged by the slow, steady progress I seem to be making.

 

[cowboy]

Day 4 no H2O2
Still have dino growth also thier is still no showing of cyano, the GHA is still dieing off bur at a slower rate than before. All livestock is showing no signs of discomfort.
Water quality
Ca 445
Mg 1480
Dkh 8.2
Po4 .3
No3 .2
Ammonia not detected
S.G 1.025
P.H 8.34

 

[DeniseAndy]

I have been dosing 2x daily at 1per10 for 5 days now or so. Finally seeing some of the sand clearing up. So far no gorgs or other creatures suffering.

 

[cowboy]

I have been dosing 2x daily at 1per10 for 5 days now or so. Finally seeing some of the sand clearing up. So far no gorgs or other creatures suffering.

I left the mats alone for 7 days before i siphoned them out. I recommend doing that sooner when the mats start to really die off the oder they leave is horrible.

 

[JPergamo]

A good indicator is O2 bubbles forming underneath the mats. Cyanobacteria produces oxygen

Would bubbles on top of the red clusters be an indicator? I'm 90% sure it is cyano that I have in my brand new 1 month old tank. What a bummer.

 

[BJ Corals]

Anyone know if it is good/bad to leave my chemipure elite in while dosing h2o2?

 

[shollis2814]

Anyone know if it is good/bad to leave my chemipure elite in while dosing h2o2?

I can't say for sure, but I am running some Purigen (similar?) and I am still seeing results.

 

[twilliard]

Would bubbles on top of the red clusters be an indicator? I'm 90% sure it is cyano that I have in my brand new 1 month old tank. What a bummer.

Yes those are O2 bubbles formed as a byproduct

 

[reefer1]

It looks like I might have a super-strain of cyanobacteria. it just doesn't want to go away. I have tried everything over 3-4 years that my tank has been running - chemiclean, lights out, and biopellets (ulns). All tank parameters are right on target. Silicates are 0. Nitartes 2.5ppm. The only thing that keeps it at bay is to siphon it out weekly. This is no fun. So, I started dosing 1ml/10 gallons 2x a day. After a couple of weeks I am up to 2ml/10 gallons 2x a day. And it's still there!
Here are some tank shots:

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[ridawg]

How big is your tank? Beacuse I had a really bad cyano problem and I only have a 20 gallon so I broke my whole tank down for a weak and then set it back up threw my sand and rock in recycled it and put my live stock back in and it looks great