Bean Animal Help

[LiquidFunk]

I am doing a tank swap soon due to a leaking seal on my 8yo aquarium Obsessed tank. I am changing from internal to external overflow and from Herbie to Bean Animal drains.

My sump is 30 horizontally from the tank and I have only 2 drain pipes. The primary drain starts at 1.5" and goes to 3" for the horizontal run. The other pipe is 1.5" the whole way. The 3" pipe has a 1/4" airline tube coming off the highest point attached to the sump pump which sucks all the air out of the line (since it goes from 1.5"-3")making it really move a lot of water and be very quiet.

I want to switch to a bean because I hate adjusting the gate valve.

The question: does anyone for see issues combining the 2nd and 3rd drains together in the stand? I figure there will be noise coming up the pipe and escaping the open 3rd drain so I'll use a durso on it to keep the sound under water. Any other concerns??

How should I plumb the two together to avoid noise? I figured a sanitizing T would be best to sweep the water across. Other thoughts?

 

[LiquidFunk]

Please don't send me to RC for help, certainly someone here has some insight who has run a Bean animal and knows if combining these two drains will be a problem?
Pretty please?

 

[hybridazn]

I wouldn't combine the full siphon drain with any other. The vented drain and the emergency drain I could see being combined without any problems. I suggest leaving the full siphon on its own because once its going the vented drain isnt used very much, if at all.

To combine the pipes I would just use a street Wye connected to cut down on any restriction that could cause more noise.

 

[mmnich]

Most of the experts recommend you don't combine any of them. It defeats the failsafe redundancy and automatic balancing.

 

[LiquidFunk]

I will not be combining the main line with any other. Mmnich I fail to see how combining drains 2-3 well below the tank (like 5' below the drains) will defeat the fail safe and automatic balancing? Can you elaborate?

 

[hybridazn]

It shouldnt interfere. The only time the emergency pipe will be in use is if the other 2 fail. So tech they won't be working at the same time anyway

 

[mmnich]

I will not be combining the main line with any other. Mmnich I fail to see how combining drains 2-3 well below the tank (like 5' below the drains) will defeat the fail safe and automatic balancing? Can you elaborate?

My info is from the LONG thread on RC, which you said above you don't want to read!...

 

[LiquidFunk]

I have read a good portion of it, just prefer R2R for many reasons!

 

[LiquidFunk]

The way I see it is going from my current Herbie to proposed solution just adds another bulkhead which is only going to make it safer than my current situation, we all know the most likely place for a clog is going to be at the top of the pipe, the extra bulkhead negates this. My bigger concern is sound from drain 2 coming up drain 3 and even with the pipe under water it may be too noisy. But, I can always cut and cap it and turn it back into a Herbie.

 

[pbauec]

If you join the Dry emergency and the Open channel you lose your failsafe. The Open channel needs to be able to siphon if your Full siphon clogs. The Dry emergency should have nothing in it and the Open channel should only have a trickle of flow through it (not enough to make any noise). There will not be any noise in a BeanAnimal. If there is noise, it is not set up properly.

 

[LiquidFunk]

The open channel can still full siphon, the won't join until 5-6 feet down. Good point on the "trickle" factor. If I understand if there is much more than a trickle the gate valve needs opening.

 

[LiquidFunk]

It's really just a Herbie with a good method of fail safe full siphon and an additional extended safety of a 3rd drain. So going from my current Herbie to my plan I am only adding failsafes even if not 100% ideal with 3 full pipes to the sump. Which as a reminder is 30' away and through 2 walls which is why I can't add a third. It's all covered in tile and just isn't reasonable given the likelyhood of a 3 bulkhead clog. If I have a 3 bulkhead clog I fail as a hobbyist....

 

[pbauec]

Good Luck. I would recommend a backyard test with flex hose. Just to be sure. There are worse things than failing as a hobbyist. Explaing to the wife is worse.
And If you think its just a Herbie with an extra pipe, you havent read enough about it.

 

[Eckolancer]

If you join the Dry emergency and the Open channel you lose your failsafe. The Open channel needs to be able to siphon if your Full siphon clogs. The Dry emergency should have nothing in it and the Open channel should only have a trickle of flow through it (not enough to make any noise). There will not be any noise in a BeanAnimal. If there is noise, it is not set up properly.

This

 

[LiquidFunk]

Good Luck. I would recommend a backyard test with flex hose. Just to be sure. There are worse things than failing as a hobbyist. Explaing to the wife is worse.
And If you think its just a Herbie with an extra pipe, you havent read enough about it.

Ok, if you are telling me it's more than a Herbie, with a potential full siphon 2nd drain and an additional 3rd E drain, you tell me how I'm wrong?

Take a Herbie (I've got one) add a airline to create a full siphon to the backup drain (should water be at a high enough level to plug a durso air hole, creating full siphon) add an OH S+%t drain and you have a Bean. Am I wrong?

I flooded my floor 10 years ago and don't plan to do it again. Hundreds if not thousands of people have been using the Herbie for half a decade or longer. Pretty sure simply adding an airline hose and second drain isn't going to increase my chance of a flood. And turning it into a bean is not going to make me explain anything to my wife.
Now a leaking point of sale aquarium Obsessed tank on the other hand, that's another question. Lucky for me, while out of town my wife implemented the 3 cargo straps hold that thing together method. I call it the my-tank-is-funk!-wrap-it-in-straps method. Keeps the water off the floor (and out of the room below) till the new tank arrives.

I am more looking for insight to make it as quiet as possible and thoughts on connecting the two drains, as I don't have a "backyard flex test" desire or option. Not to mention that is the furthest thing from reality in the reefer world. Anyone who has been doing this a while knows the unforeseen is the real fear, not the back yard proof of theory. A snail finding its way into a hole you didn't know existed, now that is a real reefers problem.

Sorry if I don't sound gracious for the advise, I just think this advice is way off base.

My goal: creative thoughts for combining drains 2 and 3 together well below the tank (this negates the siphon factors involved) while not allowing the sound of drain 2 to permeate the room. I feel like I have a good thought, but would certainly be humbled by a clear explanation of why my thoughts are flawed, or ideas on improving my situation given my constraints. I have 2 pipes, I cannot run a 3rd. There is a 30 foot horizontal run through two walls to reach my sump, covered by tile, it just isn't reasonable to add another.

 

[LiquidFunk]

This

"This" Is wrong, since they won't be joined until 5' below the overflow, allowing full siphon to occur regardless of them being joined at the location of a normal tanks sump.

 

[Bryan47]

If the second drain goes full syphon then gets blocked above the joining point it should have no problem going full syphon. Syphon is created by lack of anything (vacuum) except water. I believe you can email bean and he will respond and I would advise asking him. I run the bean animal but it is simply a bean animal I've dumped 5 gallons in my 72 gallon tank at once and I don't think the third went full syphon but with 3 drain pipes it had NO problem quickly draining the excess water. If my understanding of your plan is correct as you stated let's say a snail blocks the first two for some reason, you will still have a third drain to take over, the question I'm unsure of is if it will go full syphon because there will be an air opening above where it joins. If your really concerned get a water sensor and have a small tube tied to a pump that activates if anything gets wet. Everyone told me bean animal was overkill but it has worked wonderfully for me and I highly recommend it. Another trick would be to put a cover on the over flow so nothing the size of the overflow tubes could clog them. Just fashion a piece of acrylic to sit on top. I also have not done this and am just theorizing.

 

[pbauec]

I didn't bother to read your response as you didn't read mine.
1) horizontal runs do not purge air and create siphon easily.

2)the siphon on the open channel won't start when the drain pipe is exposed to air (dry emergency)

3)if you won't read 400 pages why should anyone who did care?

4) if you are going to do it regardless, why ask?

5) stay with the herbie. You will be happier. A frankenstein Bean will not work and you will blame the design. A bean will work amazing IF it is made as designed. ANY frankensteining of it and you are on your own.

 

[LiquidFunk]

1) you didn't read that I had a airline attached to my sump pump sucking all air from the line.
2) false- the siphon will start when I have 5 feet of drain pipe below it before it is "exposed to air"
3)I read enough to understand. I have been a professional aquarist for 10 years, I was only looking for guidance given 4).
4) I am going to do it, given the restraints in my first post, I am looking for the best collaborative way to do it within my constraints: IE 3 drains with 5 feet of head, combining only drains 2 and 3 as quiet as possible at the BOTTOM of 5' of head. This is more head/siphon pressure than most hobbyist have on a normal system. Difference: mine combine into a pipe not a sump, until further down the line.

Not looking for an argument, nor am I looking for 500 pages of questions that don't apply.

 

[LiquidFunk]

If the second drain goes full syphon then gets blocked above the joining point it should have no problem going full syphon. Syphon is created by lack of anything (vacuum) except water. I believe you can email bean and he will respond and I would advise asking him. I run the bean animal but it is simply a bean animal I've dumped 5 gallons in my 72 gallon tank at once and I don't think the third went full syphon but with 3 drain pipes it had NO problem quickly draining the excess water. If my understanding of your plan is correct as you stated let's say a snail blocks the first two for some reason, you will still have a third drain to take over, the question I'm unsure of is if it will go full syphon because there will be an air opening above where it joins. If your really concerned get a water sensor and have a small tube tied to a pump that activates if anything gets wet. Everyone told me bean animal was overkill but it has worked wonderfully for me and I highly recommend it. Another trick would be to put a cover on the over flow so nothing the size of the overflow tubes could clog them. Just fashion a piece of acrylic to sit on top. I also have not done this and am just theorizing.

Thanks Bryan, I agree a cover on the overflow is critical, given your thoughts I think I may weigh mine to be sure a snail can't lift it. Only way in at that point is through egg crate, which should be fairly safe with 3 drains