Bean animal overflow for first time...please advise.

[Mattman1977]

gate valve with a T leading back to the sump has always been my go to thing. Free water movement in sump and dial in what gph you want thtoihh

Sorry for double post my fat fingers hit send.

Matt

 

[Mattman1977]

I’m getting my butt beat by my phone.
Free water movement in sump and dial in what gph you want through your dt

 

[cedwards04]

What is your total head height? As in, how many inches is it from the return pump to the return nozzle? Just the straight vertical height without accounting for any turns or pipe length? I used a sicce 2.0 on my 40 breeder and was seeing 10x turnover. I'd imagine that 2.0 is probably getting you somewhere in the 3-5x turnover rate, which is good. You dont necessarily need a huge turnover rate between the sump and the display. You need enough to feed the skimmer and keep the water warm, anything over that is unnecessary, although would provide slightly better mechanical filtration if you run filter socks or floss. Not really a big deal though.

 

[markysgirl]

You can use your larger pump and just use a ball valve/gate valve on the return line to dial it back. That's what I do.

I did try that, I had both ball valves on the return line closed almost all the way. But the previous pump was rated at 2500gph. Now that I think about it, that was waaaaay too much flow for my tank. Now I'm at 568gph and that's too low. I'm curious what gph flow you guys would recommend?
This is my first foray into the world of sump plumbing and I am clearly having a hard time figuring it out.

 

[MabuyaQ]

What is your total head height? As in, how many inches is it from the return pump to the return nozzle? Just the straight vertical height without accounting for any turns or pipe length? I used a sicce 2.0 on my 40 breeder and was seeing 10x turnover. I'd imagine that 2.0 is probably getting you somewhere in the 3-5x turnover rate, which is good. You dont necessarily need a huge turnover rate between the sump and the display. You need enough to feed the skimmer and keep the water warm, anything over that is unnecessary, although would provide slightly better mechanical filtration if you run filter socks or floss. Not really a big deal though.

True under the assumption that enough flow is provided in the display tank to keep particles suspended in the watercolumn so they reach the skimmer at some point. If not because the return is partly responsible for this you need that higher turnover in the sump.

 

[cedwards04]

I did try that, I had both ball valves on the return line closed almost all the way. But the previous pump was rated at 2500gph. Now that I think about it, that was waaaaay too much flow for my tank. Now I'm at 568gph and that's too low. I'm curious what gph flow you guys would recommend?
This is my first foray into the world of sump plumbing and I am clearly having a hard time figuring it out.

568gph on a 75g tank is a pretty good place to be in my opinion.

 

[zalick]

I did try that, I had both ball valves on the return line closed almost all the way. But the previous pump was rated at 2500gph. Now that I think about it, that was waaaaay too much flow for my tank. Now I'm at 568gph and that's too low. I'm curious what gph flow you guys would recommend?
This is my first foray into the world of sump plumbing and I am clearly having a hard time figuring it out.

There are kind of two schools of thought on this:
1. Use the return as part of your tank flow, and have kind of a fast moving sumo keeping everything suspended

2. Slow moving sump, rely on power heads for tank flow. Slow sumo allows detritus to settle in sump for easy cleaning.

I run #2. I like having everything settle in the sump.

My sump is 100g and I have my return at 800gph.

Edit: that ratio probably wouldn't worrk on your setup.

I'd look for about 600gph -700gph for you.

 

[markysgirl]

What is your total head height? As in, how many inches is it from the return pump to the return nozzle? Just the straight vertical height without accounting for any turns or pipe length? I used a sicce 2.0 on my 40 breeder and was seeing 10x turnover. I'd imagine that 2.0 is probably getting you somewhere in the 3-5x turnover rate, which is good. You dont necessarily need a huge turnover rate between the sump and the display. You need enough to feed the skimmer and keep the water warm, anything over that is unnecessary, although would provide slightly better mechanical filtration if you run filter socks or floss. Not really a big deal though.

It's about 3 feet from the return pump to the return in the tank right above it and the other return line is 3 feet over and 3 feet up.

 

[W1ngz]

Waitaminit...
You have two returns split off one pump? Not that there's anything wrong with that, but it's a detail that would have helped 3 pages ago...

 

[markysgirl]

Waitaminit...
You have two returns split off one pump? Not that there's anything wrong with that, but it's a detail that would have helped 3 pages ago...

Yikes.....sorry about that. yes.
The path from the return pump goes through a tee and then it travels to either side of the tank.

This photo has it with a piece missing but it has since been closed.

 

[cedwards04]

I dont see where two returns split from one pump makes any difference. I'd say at your head height, that 2.0 pump is good enough. I dont think you would gain anything whatsoever by going to yet another pump. If anything, use that money for additional powerheads in the display.

It appears you are necking down the main drain using a bushing into smaller pipe. I could see that being an issue as it could trap air, not to mention over time there is going to be a build up of junk there. I'd eliminate that. Probably not your current problem, but a potential future problem.

 

[zalick]

Edited for my error. Learn something new every day they say!

 

[cedwards04]

When you count head height you add up the total vertical feet of all the pipes. Horizontal doesn't matter. So for you current configuration, you have 6ft of head on the pump.

Why would you say 6ft? The pump is 3ft below the return. I dont think it matters that there are 2 pipes, but maybe it does. I would assume it is still pumping the same amount of gph, as there is no extra pressure, just split between 2 returns. I am no expert though, so feel free to educate me.

 

[zalick]

Deleted

 

[zalick]

Why would you say 6ft? The pump is 3ft below the return. I dont think it matters that there are 2 pipes, but maybe it does. I would assume it is still pumping the same amount of gph, as there is no extra pressure, just split between 2 returns. I am no expert though, so feel free to educate me.

Now you've got me questioning what I was taught! Would love to get a plumbing expert to chime in. Don't want to derail this thread though. I'm going to do some more research.

You are correct. I learned my previous statements from an old reefer years ago and I didn't question it. Turns out he was wrong and me now.

Just read up and head is calculated be vertical feet plus 1ft for every 10ft and 1ft for every 90deg bend.

 

[cedwards04]

It's entirely possible that I am wrong, as i am just restating what i have read somewhere else.

 

[W1ngz]

My reason for surprise at the dual returns was this comment:

I think this pump might be too small. I have it turned all the way up and I can barely feel anything coming out of the return in the tank at all. The sump doesn't even look like it's moving hardly at all.

If the flow from a slightly undersized pump is split, of course the flow from each is going to seem weak. Flow through the sump shouldn't be turbulent. Turbulent water is noisy and makes splashes and salt creep.

Unless you have trouble keeping the display temperature up, I'd just leave it as is and move on.

I do agree about that downsized pipe though. You should consider redoing that line and having the reducing fitting as close to the overflow box as you can get it. At the very least, get it onto the vertical stretch.

 

[markysgirl]

The downsized pipe info makes me sad...
I am having trouble keeping the temp up in the display and the fact that the flow is sooooo low makes sense. I think I'm going to try a pump one size up to get a little more flow through the system.
I'll keep you posted!
I feel like Goldilocks!!!

 

[W1ngz]

Before you go spending on another pump just for temperature, a few follow-up questions.
-Did you have a problem with the display tank temperature with the giant pump? (I'm specifically looking for a difference in temperature between the sump and the display).
-what are you using for heating?

 

[W1ngz]

For reference, my old 75 was run by a Sicce 3.0 and a pair of 150w heaters. I always had a small variation between the sump and tank temp but it was typically 0.5 deg C or 1 deg F, and probably just a small difference in calibration. I used two slightly undersized heaters together for redundancy, instead of going with just one 250w+ heater.