Beginner in need of help with a picoreef

[dedragon]

go with a hand held refractometer you wont regret it

 

[JackerVenom]

+one for the salinity! You need a refractometer asap, this could be the cause but like others have said the algae issue I would assume is from phosphate/water quality issues. that TDS meter should help with that. Whatever you do... do not get a hydrometer. They are not accurate. Hope you figure out the issue soon and enjoy the ride of reefing

 

[Sharkbait19]

It sounds like you are dealing with cyano algae, a type of pest algae that irritates corals. It occurs by sudden changes in nutrients/parameters, such as a water change in a tank that has not had one previously.

 

[Desperado Lucky]

+one for the salinity! You need a refractometer asap, this could be the cause but like others have said the algae issue I would assume is from phosphate/water quality issues. that TDS meter should help with that. Whatever you do... do not get a hydrometer. They are not accurate. Hope you figure out the issue soon and enjoy the ride of reefing

Do you mean only the 'swing-arm' style hydrometers? I really like the floating hydrometer - easier to stop the flow w/ feed timer and drop it in than it is for me to see the numbers on my refractometer.

 

[JosephM]

Do you mean only the 'swing-arm' style hydrometers? I really like the floating hydrometer - easier to stop the flow w/ feed timer and drop it in than it is for me to see the numbers on my refractometer.

Love my floating hydrometer. I use mine in a 500ml beaker. No calibration needed, maximum deviation of 0.0001 and just rinse with tap and store for next time

 

[Kaisentlaia]

Okay so I did some testing with my TDS meter:

- RODI 7ppm
- tap 140ppm
- tank water 1590ppm

Now I'm not used to work with TDS so I'm not sure if that's bad or what.

Let's see if I got the plan so far:
- get a refractometer asap (or a hydrometer? still not sure here)
- pick up some trochus or astrea snails
- buy a phosphate test
- get my water tested (salinity and phosphates)

Then after I know the current water parameters:
- 90% water change (matching salinity, dKh and temperature)
- sand vaccuming
- more algae scrubbing

Anything else?

@Tamberav your tank is stunning! I'd love to be able to turn mine into something like that some day.

@Sharkbait19 that might be it. Here's a pic of one of the thankfully still thriving mushrooms surrounded by algae:

 

[dedragon]

the refractometer is probably what more people on the forum trust over hydrometers, tds in the tank means nothing so no point in measuring that. I would change the filters in the ro di including the ro cartridge.

 

[dedragon]

your local fish store should be able to test salinity for you and should also have some premixed saltwater that can be diluted a bit if you need, at least for the moment to help start fixing the problem

 

[Kaisentlaia]

Sadly premixed saltwater is not an option right now, it's a long walk to the store and I can't lift weights at the moment. Mixing my own water will have to do until I'll be able to bring some water home or the lockdown ends, whichever comes first.

Hopefully with a refractometer/hydrometer I can at least match the current salinity for the next water change, should be easy enough.

RODI always tested a couple of ppms even when I just got it, I heard it's common with this system and such low quantities shouldn't be a problem. I'll look into replacement cartridges anyway.

 

[JosephM]

Any ppm of TDS in your RODI is bad. One of your filters likely needs to be replaced in it

 

[Kaisentlaia]

My system is an Askoll pro-blue, I will see if the store has any replacement cartridges. If they don't, I'll order them.

 

[58e970b2-3f88-4897-87ba-5]

Here’s my 2 gallon pico. I generally do a 75%+ water change each week (most picos do larger) and I will siphon visible detritus during the water changes. The only parameters I watch are salinity and temperature. The large water changes will ensure that other parameters stay inline (they won't move that far in a week).

I find the key things are:
- top off evaporation to keep salinity correct
- match salinity and temperature on water changes (should be around 35 ppt and 25C / 77F)
- turn of lights during water changes (can burn coral otherwise)
- watch how much food you throw in (a lot can get trapped in the rocks and out of sight)

Remember to use your salinity meter (refractometer / hydrometer / whatever) to check freshly mixed salt. The directions on the box are often inaccurate (more of a guideline).


I think it sounds like your water changes might have had the salinity off and shocked something. The resulting die off could be fueling the algae growth. Other possibility is that 7 tds in your ro water is feeding the algae.

I would start by getting a salinity meter of some sort and seeing what you are currently at.
Assuming that is off, I would then work to slowly bring things back in line. Try something like moving about 0.5 - 1 ppt every few hours to your desired salinity level. Don't rush. I had the lid on wrong during a vacation and came back to a salinity of 45 ppt. Everyone was fine with a slow change back to normal.

For algae I would work on manually removing the stuff near and on your coral. I would leave some algae out of the way though. The left behind algae will hopefully thrive in it's spot and help keep new growth off your coral. Once things are more stable (in weeks or months) you can work on removing that spot.
You may also want something like a turkey baster to stir up detritus (mostly on rocks) before a water change. Basically stir it up and then siphon it out with all the water.

Watch the sand bed. If it is really dirty a large disruption may cause further issues. There are threads around about how to clean it safely (I think they are often siphon a section of the sand out, rinse it clean, then put that sand back in).
The danger is a lot of your bacteria reside there and a lot of waste. Killing off to many of them will cause serious issues with your nitrogen cycle.

You can also use distilled water if needed. Steam distilled from the grocery store should have a tds of 0 (be sure to test it) (other distilled type may be 0 tds if filtered properly). I used that for a long time until I got a bigger tank and rodi unit.

My preferred salinity measuring tool is the Hanna Salinity Tester. It is fast and easy (also reads temp and adjusts measurements accordingly). It will need to recalibrated about once a month and rinsed / wiped dry after each use.
Some people here complain about issues with them falling out of calibration quickly. I can't comment on this, mine works great.

Also dKH is measuring alkalinity in a reef tank. SPS coral and coralline algae algae will use large quantities (along with calcium) to form their skeleton (when happy and growing well). Here is a good explanation of your core parameters:
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-05/rhf/
I would expect that your tank does not consume a lot of calcium or alkalinity each week based on what I am seeing in it. So ignoring this parameter and just assuming it is what is listed on the bag of salt should be safe.

It will take a bit to get things back in balance, but when they are it will be a beautiful and fun tank.
Also I love the shrimp!

 

[Tamberav]

I replace the cartridges every 6 months. TDS is always 0 but I doubt 7 is the problem here but I would try to get close to 0 as you can.

Please be careful when you clean the sand. Disturbing it too much when it has not been cleaned in a long time can cause issues. Some people remove the rocks to a bin with water... then remove and replace the sand entirely. Some clean it very slowly in sections.

Refractometer is what you want.

I never tested anything on my 5g pico except salinity... I just did weekly large % water changes which replenish alk/ca/mg/trace. It is not bad to test, it is just that small tanks can be run on just water changes.

 

[Rmckoy]

So many replies! Thank you everyone! I was worried about doing a big water change as well because as dedragon said the first one I did was the beginning of all the problems.

I'm pretty sure the Kh/Alkalinity reagent test that I'm using works fine, I use it for my softwater tanks as well and the readings are what I expect from my other tanks as well as tap water. The phosphates one is probably busted since it's so old.


I'm using this test for Kh/Alkalinity, but I do have a TDS meter and I can check with that one as well.


I do not, only Kh/Alkalinity and a TDS meter, but I can order one on Amazon.


I can't seem to find this one but I can get a new salifert reagent test (that brand is quite reliable). Oh and thanks for the advice on snails, I'll see if I can find some of those.

When you mixed your new saltwater for the large water change you did that started the downhill spiral .

not having a refractometer ,
How did you mix the salt ?
What’s the salinity in the tank now ?
being a small pico tank they will fluctuate a lot with Little evaporation .

 

[jarviz]

your friend is mean LOL. he threw a pico saltwater tank at you without letting you know how much work is involved, and now trying to save the tank is even more of a challenge.

I think everybody has said enough to slowly start the recovery process. I wouldn't worry too much about dosing in a tank that size. a water change with quality water and salt will do wonders for water chemistry. You also have relatively hardy corals that would do fine in wide range of parameters.

 

[homer1475]

When you mixed your new saltwater for the large water change you did that started the downhill spiral .

not having a refractometer ,
How did you mix the salt ?
What’s the salinity in the tank now ?
being a small pico tank they will fluctuate a lot with Little evaporation .

After reading the thread, this was my first concern also.

Everything died after the first water change made with RO/DI @ god knows what salinity. Not hard to put 2 and 2 together.

Op you need to get a refractometer, or at the very least a swing arm hydrometer. You can't run a salt tank without knowing what salinity your mixing up to. Your mix probably said 1/2C per gallon of water, but thtas just an estimate.

 

[Rmckoy]

After reading the thread, this was my first concern also.

Everything died after the first water change made with RO/DI @ god knows what salinity. Not hard to put 2 and 2 together.

Op you need to get a refractometer, or at the very least a swing arm hydrometer. You can't run a salt tank without knowing what salinity your mixing up to. Your mix probably said 1/2C per gallon of water, but thtas just an estimate.

From running for a long period of time with just top off most likely started water chafe from low salinity to who knows what after it was finished .

I know with my system just top off the salinity will eventually drop I believe what’s lost from the skimmer and replaced with rodi is where I’m losing . )

 

[JosephM]

From running for a long period of time with just top off most likely started water chafe from low salinity to who knows what after it was finished .

I know with my system just top off the salinity will eventually drop I believe what’s lost from the skimmer and replaced with rodi is where I’m losing . )

Yeah. When I first started I made that mistake and dropped a good 0.015 sg just from skimmer and taking water for tests. Now I add saltwater in occasionally to keep up with all that stuff

 

[Rmckoy]

Yeah. When I first started I made that mistake and dropped a good 0.015 sg just from skimmer and taking water for tests. Now I add saltwater in occasionally to keep up with all that stuff

My ato is fresh rodi water .
but sometimes after testing ill
Mix a small bucket of higher salinity water to add .
Being 230 gal .
5 gal top off doesn’t make much difference

 

[reeferKen]

"Large water changes in a pico are fine and even recommended" same here as Tam. Do 100% water changes here once a week on Pico reefs. Hanna salinity checker is super fast