Bellus Angel pairing

[TX_Punisher]

I’ve been Wanting a pair of dwarf angelfish for a while now. I found a fairly good deal on female bellus Angels and was wondering how two females would do in a 200 gallon display? What is the possibility of one changing to a male?

Still doing research on this species.

Any help or advice is appreciated

Thanks

 

[albano]

Almost guaranteed that 1 will change

 

[Sarah24!]

Hello,

Ahhhh if your thinking of the bellus angel I am and have just get a male and female. I tried two females in my 240 and it did not go well at all. I was lucky my lfs was able to catch the other one. I still have the same female but never went and bought the male even though they current have one. I will also say this is also the same thing as mixing tangs sometimes they do great and others it’s a bitter war. You could do two females but why risk it just get the male
And female at the same time. Besides the male is a lot cheaper than the female. (You know by color stripes) females are blue and males are orange stripes).

 

[nereefpat]

I think 2 females sounds like a good plan.

Bellus angels aren't dwarf angels.

Are male bellus angels cheaper? It's usually the other way around for Genicanthus.

 

[TX_Punisher]

The shop I’m looking at only has females currently but I suppose that could change. I’ll need to ask.

Thanks guys

 

[albano]

Male bellus are usually more expensive than females... if you can get two females, try to get 1 that is larger than the other, that should be the one that changes.
I have had 2 and 3 and 4 mixed genicanthus Females together, many times without problems

 

[Sarah24!]

Hello,

At my lfs a bellus angel is blue and they have it for about 150, and the male is orange striped and is only 79. Now the other lfs has a female bellus angel for 49.99 but it’s super tiny. They didn’t have any males but usually you can order them as mated pairs.

 

[albano]

Personally, I agree with your lfs... the female is much nicer and should sell for more than the male... I think the male usually sells for more because of its limited availability

 

[TX_Punisher]

Thanks for the replies. Gives me some food for thought.

My only other question would be regarding if,
Omg act, I’m able to pick up a male and female, what protocols in QT and display tank introduction should be followed? MLe first in display, female second? Both at the same time? QT separately?

Thanks

 

[Bpfor3]

Push. Same issue here. Bought female Bellus today and have male coming in Tuesday. I qt all my fish using ttm method. Any experience with this. My ttm tanks are 10 gal so may need to adjust that.

 

[OrionN]

I had two Female Watanabei, one change to male in about 6 months. I did not have any problem in a 320 gal tank, but I understand that sometime Genicanthus does not always change.

BTW, they are not dwarf angels. Bellus Angel maxed out at 7 inches, part of this is the trailer but till a large angel.

 

[ThRoewer]

There has been research done that suggests Genicanthus angels can change back and forth: females can become males and males can revert back to females.
My suggestion would be to start with 2 or more females as that is the less risky path.

BTW, they are not dwarf angels. Bellus Angel maxed out at 7 inches, part of this is the trailer but till a large angel.

From a genetic point of view, they may actually be dwarf angels - or some dwarf angels may actually not be dwarf angels:

 

[CindyKz]

I have 2 female Bellus in a 40B QT now. One is slightly larger than the other and definitely dominant. They've been quarantined together, both broke out with ich (or maybe velvet I never have been sure) but tolerated cupramine pretty easily. There have been no signs of disease since I treated them so I'll be moving them to my DT soon.

I plan/hope to add a 3rd at some point.

 

[MIKE NY]

I must have the exception my female Bellus is a terror. I had a pair females one larger than the other adding them at the same time thinking the larger would change, but it just bullied the smaller. So then I tried adding a large male and even after having it in an acclimation box for almost a week the female just bullied the male even after it started turning back to female. I just keep the one female now. Personally I think they’re prettier anyway...

 

[Bpfor3]

Well I am going to get a male on Tuesday and try to add it with a female who is
Currently in Qt. I guess we will see. Sounds like pairing is the same as with most fish and it is hit or miss. Time will tell.

 

[lebreef]

Genicanthus probably do not turn back to female, what happens is they revert to female coloration without a male in the tank but are still male. This is when the introduction of a male makes it turn quite aggressive. I would add the tiniest bellus female I could find rather than a male. Genicanthus sex change is usually quite rapid.

 

[Zionas]

Following this thread as I would love to get a pair or a trio for my tank. So if I dump in two or three females of the same species at the same time, what are the chances one will change to a male if they’re all about the same size?

How disease resistant is this genus? I’m considering Bellus, Spotbreast, Watanabei. If it’s Lamarck’ I’ll only get one as it’s the largest. The Red Sea Swallowtails are a bit harder to find.


I’m thinking either a male / female pair of a smaller species, a trio of one or two smaller species (1 male 2 female), or a Lamarck’s and a male / female pair of a smaller species.

Also does anyone have an idea on the lifespans of Genicanthus angels? Are they closer to the lifespans of Centropyge angels or are they really long-lived like the large-Large angels?

Due to space constraints running a separate QT system is not an option for me, unfortunately. The best I can do is to select healthy specimens and my LFS has said they can take my sick fish to their store for treatment.


You posted a study on the lifespan of Centropyge angels and it said that the larger ones like C. bicolor can live for up to 18 years. Since G. watanabei, G. Bellus, and G. melanospilos are the same size or a bit larger than C. Bicolor, would you expect these Genicanthus angels to have around the same or a longer lifespan than the larger Centropyge angels? @ThRoewer

If we go by size alone, Lamarck’s gets to 9”.


Or maybe my tank (180 gallons) is too small for a trio, that just a pair would be better?

 

[pcon]

Genicanthus probably do not turn back to female, what happens is they revert to female coloration without a male in the tank but are still male.

Do you have any source for this? Centropyge have been shown to fully turn back from male. Bidirectional sex change is more commonly seen in genicanthus so I see no reason why the genicanthus wouldn't also be able to fully revert to female as well.

 

[Haydn]

Genicanthus probably do not turn back to female, what happens is they revert to female coloration without a male in the tank but are still male. This is when the introduction of a male makes it turn quite aggressive. I would add the tiniest bellus female I could find rather than a male. Genicanthus sex change is usually quite rapid.

I understand what you are saying I can't see any genetic advantage for the species of a fish changing into female colours whilst maintaining male reproductive attributes. A number of non-fertile fish in a population would be disastrous to the species in a remote location.

The aggression may be due to 'leftover' male hormones, in the same way that a castrated bull needs time for the male hormones to fall to a level to make them more docile.

Edit: must type quicker @pcon

 

[Zionas]

In the worst case scenario, if I’m only able to purchase one and I have an established female, would it be safe to add another female or a male later down the line? How about a pair for a total of 2 females and 1 male?

Would also love to know whether my tank size (180 gallons, 6’) would be too small for a trio, that whether it’s better if I stick to a pair at most.