BRS 6 stage plus for drinking? New to salt question

[James Kanouff]

 

[James Kanouff]

above is The 100 gallon storage bin, the 55 gallon plastic drums. the inside 100 gallon rodi system and the side of one of the acrylic boxes. And the crazy outside garage rodi system i have constructed around a core spectra pure system, this is where my 550 set up lives and QT and frags tanks are. I have added two old bladder tanks, which u can see above the RODI, to increase pressure on my auto flush cycle, which IMO keeps my membrane well flushed. and stabilizes the line pressure a bit when normal house stuff happens while my system is making water, like family members taking showers n stuff.

My pressure is 55-60 psi, incoming, tds is 155 ish, no chloramines from my supply, average silica levels. I get about 1500 gallons out of my max cap and unknown out of my DI resin stages i just change the first one out and move second one to first position once a year when i change my carbon and pr filter stages, but they always say 0 in and out. and have never obviously failed. I do see my max cap expire with my simple typical tds meters. which i say i don't fully trust. but i have come to know what to expect where and they confirm my

I want more life from my max cap, so i have added 3/8 line to my sort of long length "15 feet ish to out side" flush circuit and I religiously flush the system before the DI stages now when start it up for a few minutes because i have noticed a huge run of TDS into the DI stages when i first start up the system to begin making water.

 

[AZDesertRat]

DI bypass flushing has value, flush kits on the waste line do not. Try to find a documented third party study showing otherwise, I have never found one.

 

[Purpule Tang]

DI bypass flushing has value, flush kits on the waste line do not. Try to find a documented third party study showing otherwise, I have never found one.

Dear AzDesertRat.
I Read you told that flush kit not important and don't need for our ro di water it waste our money.
Also my resin very soon soaked?how can I fixing this problem?

 

[AZDesertRat]

To answer that I need to know what system you have, what filters you use, your replacement schedule, your tap, RO only and final RO/DI TDS, your exact measured waste ratio, water temperature and water pressure and if you are using softened water or if not your calcium carbonate hardness. Also how you have the system configured, how often you make water and how much you make at a time.
All of the above have an impact on DI life. It is also important to know the source of your DI, it's age and how it is stored. DI has a shelf life and I do not recommend bulk resins as they lose their strength.

 

[Purpule Tang]

To answer that I need to know what system you have, what filters you use, your replacement schedule, your tap, RO only and final RO/DI TDS, your exact measured waste ratio, water temperature and water pressure and if you are using softened water or if not your calcium carbonate hardness. Also how you have the system configured, how often you make water and how much you make at a time.
All of the above have an impact on DI life. It is also important to know the source of your DI, it's age and how it is stored. DI has a shelf life and I do not recommend bulk resins as they lose their strength.

I have a 3 pre filter sediment,carbon and carbon block.
After it membrane and then going to post carbon filter and then last final stage is mineral filter for drinking.
I use for two purpose drinking and my tank.
Also I have a pressure tank.
My schedule for change pre filters is 6 months.
My tap water tds is about 360 ppm and after that my ro tds is 80 ppm.
My di tds is same with my ro tds.
Also about my waste water I still not measuring it but it's flow rate is 300.

 

[West1]

Wow, lots of water James. Thx for the tips!

You linked to a drinking water RO system, not a reef RO/DI system. Get the refurbished reef system from Spectrapure for $112 and the drinking water kit from Purelyh2o for $70 and you will have a better system for less money. Don't waste your money on flush kits, they have absolutely no proven documented value other than lightening your wallet. If you were making DI water manually I would suggest a DI bypass valve but isolating the pressure tank from the DI pretty much takes care of TDS creep.

No a salinity meter will not work for testing the TDS in RO/DI or distilled water, the range is way too high and you want extreme low end accuracy, not at 32,000 TDS. If you want the best TDS meter for the hobbyist trade the HM Digital COM-100 is it, I love mine. They read down to tenths of a ppm TDS as well as being able to be used in three different modes.

We had our drinking water RO hooked to my first and second MaxCap systems as well as the AWI Typhoon III before that, probably 20 years. As long as you isolate it with the check valve it will be perfect for your use. I even went so far as to install a 14 gallon pressure tank to cut down on the cycling.
Today I have the MaxCap UHE-100 which will not work for drinking so have a separate RO for drinking, otherwise it would still be a single system.

AZD, ok I'll grab the links you've provided. When you mention DI bypass flushing, its just a basic T between the RO and DI with an on/off valve at the end? Basically run the RO for a few seconds prior to using for drinking or DI right?
HM Digital COM-100 will be ordered on my next amazon purchase

 

[Purpule Tang]

To answer that I need to know what system you have, what filters you use, your replacement schedule, your tap, RO only and final RO/DI TDS, your exact measured waste ratio, water temperature and water pressure and if you are using softened water or if not your calcium carbonate hardness. Also how you have the system configured, how often you make water and how much you make at a time.
All of the above have an impact on DI life. It is also important to know the source of your DI, it's age and how it is stored. DI has a shelf life and I do not recommend bulk resins as they lose their strength.

Dear Azdesertrat.
What's different between Bulk resin and other ?
I have a this kind resin mix bed.

 

[TaylorPilot]

Wow, lots of water James. Thx for the tips!

AZD, ok I'll grab the links you've provided. When you mention DI bypass flushing, its just a basic T between the RO and DI with an on/off valve at the end? Basically run the RO for a few seconds prior to using for drinking or DI right?
HM Digital COM-100 will be ordered on my next amazon purchase

I wouldn't worry about it for drinking water. Just let it run. For DI, you want to throw out the first few minutes worth of RO water before running the DI.

 

[AZDesertRat]

Bulk resin is normal mixed bed resins but in larger quantities. One issue is it dries out and loses its cation and anion electrical properties before you get a chance to use it all so the value just isn't there.
If you use bulk resins it is best to divide it up in 20 oz portions and vacuum seal it with a seal a meal type vacuum food sealer device then store the bags in the refrigerator so they stay, cool, moist and out of bright direct lighting. If you don't do that the life of the resin can be as little as weeks to a couple months, under perfect conditions it's about 6 months.
I found it was far less expensive and I got much better treated water quality and resin life by switching to Spectrapure MaxCap and A SilicaBuster DI cartridges which last me about a year (1000 gals) and 3 years (3,000 gals) respectively. I could never get more than 150 gallons out of any bulk resin no matter where I purchased it or how well I packaged and stored it. Huge cost savings and much less resin in the trash.

 

[TaylorPilot]

Bulk resin is normal mixed bed resins but in larger quantities. One issue is it dries out and loses its cation and anion electrical properties before you get a chance to use it all so the value just isn't there.
If you use bulk resins it is best to divide it up in 20 oz portions and vacuum seal it with a seal a meal type vacuum food sealer device then store the bags in the refrigerator so they stay, cool, moist and out of bright direct lighting. If you don't do that the life of the resin can be as little as weeks to a couple months, under perfect conditions it's about 6 months.
I found it was far less expensive and I got much better treated water quality and resin life by switching to Spectrapure MaxCap and A SilicaBuster DI cartridges which last me about a year (1000 gals) and 3 years (3,000 gals) respectively. I could never get more than 150 gallons out of any bulk resin no matter where I purchased it or how well I packaged and stored it. Huge cost savings and much less resin in the trash.

I can vouch for that. I had been using BRS bulk resin for years and I was able to produce about 200 gallons out of a cartridge. I switched to the cartridges @AZDesertRat is talking about and I have made about 400 gallons and am still getting 0 TDI. Also, the color change on the 2nd cartridge hasn't even began to change, so I don't think it has even started breaking through the 1st one yet. I don't check in between them, but I need to put a tee and a valve to check in between each one. They are more expensive, but I think they will end up being half the price considering the added capacity. Never mind that I don't have to jack with it as much. I am starting to become a true believer that you need to spend twice as much on your RODI as you want and it will end up costing you half as much in the long run....I don't even make that much water. I can't imagine the savings for someone who has a 300 gallon tank. I am slowly converting my system over to all Spectrapure. I only have the membrane left, which should double the life of the DI again!

 

[JMM744]

Glad to have found this post. Having trouble getting any life out of my resin. Got 30 gallon out of my first canister before the tds started to read. Have to get a meter and find out what my ongoing water is. Will look into the filters suggested.
Thanks, Jim

 

[RobBaglieri]

You linked to a drinking water RO system, not a reef RO/DI system. Get the refurbished reef system from Spectrapure for $112 and the drinking water kit from Purelyh2o for $70 and you will have a better system for less money. Don't waste your money on flush kits, they have absolutely no proven documented value other than lightening your wallet. If you were making DI water manually I would suggest a DI bypass valve but isolating the pressure tank from the DI pretty much takes care of TDS creep.

No a salinity meter will not work for testing the TDS in RO/DI or distilled water, the range is way too high and you want extreme low end accuracy, not at 32,000 TDS. If you want the best TDS meter for the hobbyist trade the HM Digital COM-100 is it, I love mine. They read down to tenths of a ppm TDS as well as being able to be used in three different modes.

We had our drinking water RO hooked to my first and second MaxCap systems as well as the AWI Typhoon III before that, probably 20 years. As long as you isolate it with the check valve it will be perfect for your use. I even went so far as to install a 14 gallon pressure tank to cut down on the cycling.
Today I have the MaxCap UHE-100 which will not work for drinking so have a separate RO for drinking, otherwise it would still be a single system.

Im trying to understand the difference between a drinking water RO system, and a reef RO/DI system. What is the differences? My home is plumbed with a Kinetico K5 RO unit that draws from softened well water. Is this sufficient?

 

[AZDesertRat]

In general, a drinking water system usually uses higher micron, lower quality and lower capacity sediment and carbon filters, often granular carbon versus extruded carbon blocks. The result is lower water quality, shorter membrane life since it is having to trap what the higher micron filters let pass through and generally higher operating cost due to more frequent replacements of filters, membrane and resin. TDS isn't as important with a drinking water system since it is the TDS that gives the water its flavor, but it eats DI resin much quicker since it now has to make up for what the other components do not filter out. The DI if it has one is often a little 9-12oz horizontal hollow tube that channels and short circuits so provides poor treatment.

A reef quality system, at least from reputable vendors, will have low micron sometimes absolute or near absolute rated sediment filters, a low micron carbon block capable of treating 12,000 to 20,000 gallons of water before replacement provided it is protected by a good sediment filter and a high rejection rate RO membrane. They will include a full size vertical refillable DI canister which holds about 20 oz of DI resin which due to its vertical bottom up fill design forces all water and resin to come into contact with each other for maximum treatment and DI life. They will usually include an inline pressure gauge used in troubleshooting sediment and carbon filter condition. You will often pay a little more up front for a reef RO/DI system but it will save you money in operating costs so is almost always the better value over time.

It is easy and inexpensive to add a check valve and drinking water kit to a reef RO/DI system. The cost and effort to convert a drinking water system to a reef ystem is much more as it can involve not only a better sediment and carbon block filter but a better high rejection rate RO membrane, a matched flow restrictor, a new 20 oz vertical DI canister and cartridge, a check valve to isolate the pressurized RO from the DI and an inline pressure gauge.

I am not familiar with the Kinetico K5 RO but will research it.

 

[West1]

Today I have the MaxCap UHE-100 which will not work for drinking so have a separate RO for drinking, otherwise it would still be a single system.

Where do you buy replacement filters? From spectrapure or third party site?

 

[AZDesertRat]

I only buy from Spectrapure. I have found some of the major vendors sell kits with Spectrapure resins but their own sediment and carbon and I don't think they have done the same research, development and testing as Spectrapure. You really do get what you pay for.

 

[West1]

I only buy from Spectrapure. I have found some of the major vendors sell kits with Spectrapure resins but their own sediment and carbon and I don't think they have done the same research, development and testing as Spectrapure. You really do get what you pay for.

Got it.
I emailed one of the reps and was told the .5 micron last longer than the 1 micron given they see the exact same amount of water in a test.
Whats your thought on this?
I cant seem to receive that information but nothing more than a sales pitch. Smaller microns would get clogged faster so I am not sure how they would last longer.

 

[West1]

Spectrapure and everyone else recommends removing the membrane and DI cartridges and storing them on sealed bags with moisture in them if it will be down for more than 20-30 days or so.

I think I will use my DI once a month, would you recommend storing the cartridge or leaving it set up?
I could not set up the system under the sink or anywhere in a dark area, I think I might paint each housing black since they are all clean.

 

[gemini9]

I know it's not recommended, but for than past 8 months I have stopped using Rodi water. I haul my own water from a spring down the road. That spring water usually tests around 10ppm or 5 ppm for nitrates but my fish all seem perfectly fine and I have no problems whatsoever.