Ca and Alk in the same supplement? How does this work?

Hans-Werner · Oct 28, 2019

I am not sure but you can give it a try. Please take into consideration the magnesium concentration.

Bpp124987 · Oct 28, 2019

@Hans-Werner I’m running into high calcium while just dosing all for reef. What should I dose to increase the alk without pushing up calcium? Soda ash?

Hans-Werner · Oct 29, 2019

You can use baking soda or soda ash to increase alkalinity. I would prefer baking soda.

Randy Holmes-Farley · Oct 29, 2019

recci said:
Ok, thanks for detailed explanation. I have another question:

I have some old red sea magnesium liquid thats going out of date. Could I mix that in the carbocalcium without causing issues? I know it's not one of your products but just wondering if you know.

normal magnesium supplements do not go bad with age and should be able to be mixed with calcium formate formulations.

Randy Holmes-Farley · Oct 29, 2019

Bpp124987 said:
@Hans-Werner I’m running into high calcium while just dosing all for reef. What should I dose to increase the alk without pushing up calcium? Soda ash?

sodium bicarbonate or sodium carbonate are the way to raise alk only. If you want a big pH boost as well you can use sodium hydroxide (add it slowly and more diluted than the others).

Hans-Werner · Oct 29, 2019

Randy Holmes-Farley said:
normal magnesium supplements do not go bad with age and should be able to be mixed with calcium formate

Addition of magnesium supplements to calcium formate may be limited by sulfate in the magnesium supplement. This may form calcium sulfate precipitates if it exceeds a low concentration. In this regard there is no difference between Bio-Magnesium and other magnesium supplements. This is why I recommend to add the magnesium supplement carefully and only to a small proportion.

Bramzor · Nov 11, 2019

Hans-Werner said:
@recci: Pro-Coral Mineral is not exactly the same as K+ and A- Elements. Pro-Coral Mineral contains all 70 trace elements of the Tropic Marine sea salts in the same proportions as the sea salts. This means Pro-Coral Mineral contains more trace elements and in somewhat different proportions compared to K+ and A- Elements.

The application is similar as K+ and A- Elements combined but I yet have to try whether Pro-Coral Mineral can be mixed with Carbo-Calcium and calculate the proper amount. Some components of Pro-Coral Mineral may form insoluble precipitates with Carbo-Calcium. We recently have done and are still doing adjustings to increase the solubility and compatibility of some of our products. Pro-Coral Mineral is one of these products.

K+ and A- Elements contains the trace elements with known biological functions in the proportions as they are consumed by growth of corals and coralline algae.

@all: Yes, the difference between Carbo-Calcium and All-For-Reef is that All-For-Reef contains magnesium and the trace elements of the K+ and A- Elements.
The amount of calcium and trace elements in Bio-Magnesium is very small and does not influence the calculation substantially.

Thought I was going crazy but found the video that said Pro-Coral Mineral was K+ and A- combined:
Would have liked an all powdered recipe for all for reef though.

LARedstickreefer · Nov 14, 2019

How quickly does All For Reef convert into alkalinity? If a dosing pump failed and doses a large amount, I wonder how bad the alk spike would be?

jschultzbass · Nov 14, 2019

LARedstickreefer said:
How quickly does All For Reef convert into alkalinity? If a dosing pump failed and doses a large amount, I wonder how bad the alk spike would be?

That's my question as well. Mainly for testing purposes.

Drneil · Nov 15, 2019

Just want to confirm, has all for reef changed to include k+ elements?

I'm sure when I bought previously it stated k+ was separate. I have a bottle of k+ I'm manually dosing but threw the bottle of all for reef away when I put it in my dosing container.

Thinking of the carbocalcium with elements mixed as the next route.

Randy Holmes-Farley · Nov 16, 2019

LARedstickreefer said:
How quickly does All For Reef convert into alkalinity? If a dosing pump failed and doses a large amount, I wonder how bad the alk spike would be?

I do not know, but I expect hours. Still too fast.

LARedstickreefer · Nov 16, 2019

Randy Holmes-Farley said:
I do not know, but I expect hours. Still too fast.

So it may not help in the case of an OD, but would seem to be a more gentle way of dosing alkalinity since it takes time to convert, no?

Randy Holmes-Farley · Nov 16, 2019

LARedstickreefer said:
So it may not help in the case of an OD, but would seem to be a more gentle way of dosing alkalinity since it takes time to convert, no?

It will rise more slowly in a rapid overdose. I'm not sure if that is important not. It will also drop O2 in an overdose, which may be bad.

The Opinionated Reefer · Nov 22, 2019

I'm having real trouble dissolving 6 level scoops of carbocalcium in 1 litre of RO water. I end up with around 1300ml to get it all dissolved. Is this normal or should I heat the water up or something? It says 6 scoops to 1 litre on the tub.

The Opinionated Reefer · Feb 9, 2020

Can I confirm that the trace elements A and k contain iodine and strontium?

bluprntguy · Feb 9, 2020

recci said:
Can I confirm that the trace elements A and k contain iodine and strontium?

Pro-Coral A- Trace 1 Contains:

Bromine
Fluorine
Iodine
Lithium
Molybdenum
Selenium
Vanadium

Pro-Coral K+ Trace 2 Contains:

Barium
Boron
Chrome
Cobalt
Iron
Copper
Manganese
Nickel
Strontium
Zinc

bluprntguy · Feb 9, 2020

recci said:
I'm having real trouble dissolving 6 level scoops of carbocalcium in 1 litre of RO water. I end up with around 1300ml to get it all dissolved. Is this normal or should I heat the water up or something? It says 6 scoops to 1 litre on the tub.

Directions on BRS’ website note “ Room temp water is ok, but warm water will help dissolve the powder more quickly”

I purchase the premixed “all for reef” for my nano, but I have noticed occasionally there is a small amount of particulate in the bottom of the bottle. I think Tropic Marin has pegged the amount to be right at the saturation level. I’ve never noticed any issues when there is a little bit of particulate.

GMay · Feb 9, 2020

Hans-Werner said:
You can take 140 g of Carbocalcium Powder fill it up with R/O water to 800 ml and dissolve as much as can be dissolved. Then add 100 ml of each, A- and K+ Elements, and dissolve the remaining Carbocalcium Powder completely. At last add 12 g of Bio-Magnesium and dissolve it. This solution comes closest to our All-For-Reef and will add all major, minor and trace elements necessary for good coral growth.
Of course you can also premix 140 g of Carbocalcium Powder and 12 g of Bio-Magnesium.
The 12 g is an empiric quantity. We added more Bio-Magnesium at first and noticed increasing magnesium concentrations in the tanks. So we reduced the magnesium concentration. However magnesium consumption may vary for example with coralline algal growth.

I have been using this formulation on a 60 gallon tank for the past 6 months. The tank is mostly LPS corals so the consumption is not that had to keep up with. In that 6 months I have had to correct for calcium once to bring it from 400 ppm to 420 ppm. My system was already running as a ULNS so I have had to feed more heavily, but otherwise I have been happy with the switch from other calcium and alkalinity methods.

The Opinionated Reefer · Feb 16, 2020

I am surprised no other companies offer calcium formate. It's such a good and simple way of dosing I don't see why it doesn't make two part obsolete. I would buy this stuff in bulk of I could.