Can the toxins from zoas actually kill you?

[fishywishy]

My family is worried about me getting zoas because there toxic, can the toxins actually kill you?

 

[Tired]

There's no "spores" involved, so I don't know exactly what that article's on about there. But, yeah, vigorously scrubbing palythoas with a brush isn't the best idea. That's a good way to aerosolize the stuff.

 

[mfinn]

There's no "spores" involved, so I don't know exactly what that article's on about there. But, yeah, vigorously scrubbing palythoas with a brush isn't the best idea. That's a good way to aerosolize the stuff.

Yeah that was a weird one.
Plus the hazmat teams working 20 minute shifts.

Seemed like a attempt at making the issue more than it was.

 

[keef reeper]

Lots of good info here haha im new to reefing and i hope this isn't too stupid of a question but does anyone have a specific recommendation for gloves? Like will regular nitrile gloves be good or like dishwashing gloves? Im not trying to get all jacked up from anything lol some of these comments got me spooked dude

 

[mfinn]

Lots of good info here haha im new to reefing and i hope this isn't too stupid of a question but does anyone have a specific recommendation for gloves? Like will regular nitrile gloves be good or like dishwashing gloves? Im not trying to get all jacked up from anything lol some of these comments got me spooked dude

I'm sure nitrile gloves are plenty

 

[Tired]

I have a pair of elbow-length chemistry type gloves for outright handling live rock (sharp edges) and otherwise messing around in the tank, but if you just want to keep something off your skin, nitrile works fine.

 

[reefkeeper078]

My family is worried about me getting zoas because there toxic, can the toxins actually kill you?

I had never worn gloves when working in my tanks over 20 years, but last year I had a small cut on the back of my hand and brushed it against a rock with paly's...
I now wear gloves for any activities in the tank.

 

[vetteguy53081]

How do you even know which Zoas are toxic?
I've been fragging then for years with my bear hands with no issues.

The information and cases are out there. Not all zoas are toxic and often associated with mishandling and poor practices.
I too touch zoa and just unloaded an entire tank of which many were zoa colony. It was getting late and shame on me for not wearing my aqua gloves but I did scrub the heck out of my hands afterwards.

 

[Tired]

I had never worn gloves when working in my tanks over 20 years, but last year I had a small cut on the back of my hand and brushed it against a rock with paly's...
I now wear gloves for any activities in the tank.

Ouch. Is it just me, though, or does this look bacterial? Open cuts in a reef tank are bad news, particularly with /any/ coral. That sort of infection can go nasty real fast, and can risk life and limb if you get unlucky with the right/wrong strain.

 

[Kscope]

First I want to say I have had marine aquariums for over 40 years. Am I an expert? No, but I am experienced. Those that think palys do not have much toxin need to really re-think and do some more research. Palytoxin is one of the most toxic natural substances on the planet. The brown palys know as “button polyps” in most cases are extremely toxic. I myself have been bitten by them just from scrubbing one polyp off of a ecotech mp10 under a faucet. The running sink water was warm and just barely steaming on a cool day. As soon as I noticed the steam I turned the water off and walked away. I immediately called my daughter to let her know that I may have been exposed just in case I may have needed her help. Sure enough I was and only exposed to the steam for 5-10 seconds or so. My symptoms consisted of a severe non-stop cough and a fever which started about 2 hours after exposer. I drove myself to the hospital with a sample of the palys in a plastic bag. The checkin nurse rolled her eyes at me when I explained the situation and didn’t take it seriously. It was the height of Covid in 2020 so no available beds anyway. I went home. The next morning after hacking most of the night my cough was under control and fever was gone but I felt very run down. That lasted for several days after. Being careful is one thing but accidents happen. Being even more/extremely careful may prevent you from exposer. Like some of these articles have said, treat all zoas and palys as if they were a loaded gun with the safety off.

 

[Tired]

Yeah, those are the nasty ones. I don't think anyone's arguing that the brown button polyps aren't especially toxic- that refers to a lot of the smaller, more colorful zoas, which are an entirely different species.

 

[Kscope]

This is my point. Taken from:
https://www.sahealth.sa.gov.au/wps/...me/palytoxin+poisoning+marine+aquarium+safety
Species of Zoanthid coral (e.g. Palythoaspecies and Zoanthus species) can contain a highly toxic, naturally-occurring and potentially lethal substance known as Palytoxin.

Zoanthid corals are often recommended to new marine aquarium owners because they are considered to be relatively easy to keep.Health risks associated with keeping soft corals in home aquariums are often unrecognised or underestimated by aquarium enthusiasts and suppliers because there are limited cases documented to raise awareness.

How Do You Know If A Coral Is Poisonous?​

It is not possible to tell which Zoanthid corals contain Palytoxin when deciding whether to keep them in aquariums. While it is possible that people may not intend to buy Zoanthids – it is important to remember that other types of coral or any ‘live rock’ bought from aquarium suppliers may unintentionally contain Zoanthids.

Marine aquarium owners should always presume Palytoxin is present and take appropriate precautions when handling corals to avoid being exposed to this toxin.

 

[leo12345]

What other corals are toxic besides Zoas and platies

 

[Kscope]

What other corals are toxic besides Zoas and platies

This might be a good place to start.

Frontiers | Coral Venom Toxins

The phylum Cnidaria contains a wide variety of unique organisms that possess interesting adaptations evolved over many years to help them survive in a compet...

www.frontiersin.org

 

[Timfish]

I have spend hours looking for a confirmed case of an aquarist dying from palytoxin and haven't yet (that doesn't mean it hasn't happened and if anyone knows of any documentation please forward it to me). I have found cases of people dying from palytoxin after eating contaminated seafood at restaurants. Exposure from algae blooms along sea shores is also documented. . .

Here's an update and I'd like to thank @greenmandarin to passing on hte link to me.

Heartland man tragically dies of apparent palytoxin poisoning hours after cleaning aquarium

HEARTLAND, Texas — A Heartland man tragically died of apparent palytoxin poisoning hours after cleaning his household saltwater aquatic tank.

www.inforney.com

While it's only reported as an "apparent" palytoxin poisoning there also isn't anything reported regarding potentially compramising issues like a heart, resporitory or immune condition.

 

[Timfish]

What other corals are toxic besides Zoas and platies

Just about everything. It can accumilate in fish tissues hence the deaths associated with eating contaminated fish.

Distribution and sequestration of palytoxin in coral reef animals

In the reefs off the Colombian coast (Caribbean Sea) and around Lizard Island, Australia (Pacific), palytoxin (PTX), which has been detected in zoanth…

www.sciencedirect.com

 

[Rickster1334]

I was told a story in my city of a family that decided to clean their aquarium and scrubbed rocks. So the story goes is they all ended up being treated in hospital for paly poisoning.
True or not I don't know but I was told the story

Happened in Ottawa was on news

 

[Parsely]

I just stupidly, tried to remove some Xenia that was growing Inbetween some zoas with tweezers inside the tank. It looked liked an zoa emitted a puff of brown liquid while my hand was in there. I don’t have any cuts on my hands but am a bit worried, dumb to not be wearing gloves, I know. Is there any precautions I should be taking?

 

[olonmv]

I just stupidly, tried to remove some Xenia that was growing Inbetween some zoas with tweezers inside the tank. It looked liked an zoa emitted a puff of brown liquid while my hand was in there. I don’t have any cuts on my hands but am a bit worried, dumb to not be wearing gloves, I know. Is there any precautions I should be taking?

Read up on symptoms and monitor yourself but, seems like the most severe cases are from inhalation. A man in Dallas texas, several years ago, died from palytoxin poisoning but, if I remember correctly it was due to him boiling a rock with the coral on it and the vapor carried the toxin which he inhaled.

 

[Parsely]

Read up on symptoms and monitor yourself but, seems like the most severe cases are from inhalation. A man in Dallas texas, several years ago, died from palytoxin poisoning but, if I remember correctly it was due to him boiling a rock with the coral on it and the vapor carried the toxin which he inhaled.

Ya I’ve been reading, don’t really feel anything yet just super paranoid. I’m hoping cause it happened in the tank it can’t get airborne

 

[olonmv]

Ya I’ve been reading, don’t really feel anything yet just super paranoid. I’m hoping cause it happened in the tank it can’t get airborne

I wonder if the people who are more sensitive to allergic reaction are the ones who have the higher reactions to palytoxin. I, myself am lucky and suffer from no allergies that I know of and have rubbed up against my paly’s on numerous occasion without protection and no symptoms. I know a kid at my LFS who can’t put his bare hand in the tanks without getting a reaction that looks like eczema.