chasing stability, can’t find it.

[FragOut]

So I’m getting close to giving up. It’s supposed to be easy but it’s beginning to be the hardest thing for me to achieve. Stability.
I’m not chasing numbers mind you, I’m chasing STABILITY. Stability which evades me quite easily. So here’s the rundown.
I have a Red Sea 525. I dose 2 little fishes 2 part, A and B. I have a bio pellet reactor currently running. I’m also running purigen to keep the tank water clear and that will stop Tuesday once my carbon reactor gets here.

So my ph has been low. Stable but low, so I ran some marine buffer which I know raises dkh by 1. Ph was hovering around 7.7. 7.6 on my nightly swing. I tried everything to raise it slowly, opening windows etc. Running marine buffer raised it by .2. So I’m running at 7.9 peak with 7.8 being my low. I’m okay with this. I did marine buffer a week ago and I’ve stopped using it since it raised up a little higher. It’s stayed stable.

My calcium and alkalinity however have not since I’ve started dosing.. My dkh ranges on any given day between 10.5 and 12.9. Calcium never really moves but when it does it’s either 440-530. I tested today at about 30 minutes ago and I’m at 530. Alk today is 12.2.

So here’s the tests.

Mind you I’ve never done a water change, nor have I dosed since I couldn’t keep it stable. Over 2 weeks ago. So I don’t understand where the high alk is coming from.

Here’s calcium.

Magnesium is at 1470.

Temp 77.8
Salinity 1.025
Phosphate .01
Nitrates 0
Nitrite 0
Ammonia 0

If there’s anything I missed please let me know. I just want my sps happy as I cannot keep them. It’s getting overly frustrating.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I’m not sure how much you are dosing each day, but the calcium bounces are probably testing issues, not instability.

 

[FragOut]

I’m not sure how much you are dosing each day, but the calcium bounces are probably testing issues, not instability.

I agree as I’m using a Hanna checker with lab grade water, but, I’ve not dosed in 2 weeks and my levels have risen. I’ve got roughly 60-70 frags in my tank currently so I don’t see how it’s possible.

 

[FragOut]

Also, when I was dosing, I was dosing 12ml of each part.

 

[cracker]

I'd like to know more on this topic.

 

[sghera64]

The way I achieve stability is to do the same thing as frequently as reasonable. And that means I don’t react to things. I just follow my regiment.

It helps to not measure things for a while as measuring tempts one to adjust from the regiment.

Note: this will give you stable readings, but you might not like what they are. If your specimens are happy, then those numbers might be okay in the short term.

Ex. I drain/refill my Ca(OH)2 reactor every Saturday morning. I add 130 mL ATO through that reactor e/o hour. Lights keep the same spectrum and time schedule. Feeding is done consistently each day. PO4 and NO3 are added at the same times every day.

I don’t like my numbers, but they are very stable:
Ca: 350 to 360
dKH: 6.8 - 7.0
pH: 7.9 - 8.2


Now that they are stable, I plan to slowly increase the hourly addition of ATO through the Neilson reactor (CaO reactor), and the drip rate through the CO2 reactor. I also feed outside air into my skimmer and a separate air stone.

Your home CO2 levels can fluctuate and affect pH.

 

[sghera64]

Your dKH and Alk numbers are getting up there. It might be a good thing you have pH on the low end.

I wonder if it would be worth considering cutting your two part doses in half to achieve stability.

I like to approach stability from the low side (under add).

 

[FragOut]

Your dKH and Alk numbers are getting up there. It might be a good thing you have pH on the low end.

I wonder if it would be worth considering cutting your two part doses in half to achieve stability.

I like to approach stability from the low side (under add).

The thing is I’ve not dosed in 2 weeks. Yet my calcium and alkalinity have risen.

 

[sghera64]

The thing is I’ve not dosed in 2 weeks. Yet my calcium and alkalinity have risen.

Which Alk kit are you using?

 

[FragOut]

Which Alk kit are you using?

Hanna.

 

[sghera64]

Hanna.

Oh. I have high confidence in Hanna’a Alk meter readings.


Their calcium meter is sensitive to any calcium in the water you use to Q.S. up to the 10mL mark.

 

[FragOut]

Oh. I have high confidence in Hanna’a Alk meter readings.


Their calcium meter is sensitive to any calcium in the water you use to Q.S. up to the 10mL mark.

I use lab grade water for my tests to try and alleviate that problem. I could go tomorrow to grab a better tester.

 

[Paul B]

I think you should stop testing. Sea water is very stable as long as you don't mess with it. Those small differences are normal.
Just add seawater and your calc and alk. Then go out to dinner and forget about it. Try the Merlot. Your reactors, bio pellets, carbon and Purigen are messing with you and will never be stable as long as you keep adding or removing stuff. All the tank needs is water.

 

[mcarroll]

Phosphate .01
Nitrates 0

Lack of nutrients is the only potential problem that stands out to me. Usage of all the extra filtration explains at least most of the lack.

Everything but a skimmer should be optional at this point.

Disable all the other stuff and watch for improvement. If corals still languish you may have to add some nitrate and phosphate fertilizer.

 

[BigJohnny]

So I’m getting close to giving up. It’s supposed to be easy but it’s beginning to be the hardest thing for me to achieve. Stability.
I’m not chasing numbers mind you, I’m chasing STABILITY. Stability which evades me quite easily. So here’s the rundown.
I have a Red Sea 525. I dose 2 little fishes 2 part, A and B. I have a bio pellet reactor currently running. I’m also running purigen to keep the tank water clear and that will stop Tuesday once my carbon reactor gets here.

So my ph has been low. Stable but low, so I ran some marine buffer which I know raises dkh by 1. Ph was hovering around 7.7. 7.6 on my nightly swing. I tried everything to raise it slowly, opening windows etc. Running marine buffer raised it by .2. So I’m running at 7.9 peak with 7.8 being my low. I’m okay with this. I did marine buffer a week ago and I’ve stopped using it since it raised up a little higher. It’s stayed stable.

My calcium and alkalinity however have not since I’ve started dosing.. My dkh ranges on any given day between 10.5 and 12.9. Calcium never really moves but when it does it’s either 440-530. I tested today at about 30 minutes ago and I’m at 530. Alk today is 12.2.

So here’s the tests.

Mind you I’ve never done a water change, nor have I dosed since I couldn’t keep it stable. Over 2 weeks ago. So I don’t understand where the high alk is coming from.

Here’s calcium.

Magnesium is at 1470.

Temp 77.8
Salinity 1.025
Phosphate .01
Nitrates 0
Nitrite 0
Ammonia 0

If there’s anything I missed please let me know. I just want my sps happy as I cannot keep them. It’s getting overly frustrating.

Your dosing so that's where the high alk and calcium is coming from. It's rising over the month of june. Reduce your dose of two part until it's stable. Test more frequently, saw you tested every 2 days then 2 weeks. You should test daily while your dialing in your dose and then at least weekly to check if you need adjustments. I tested daily until I got an alk monitor which tests 4x a day.

 

[FragOut]

Your dosing so that's where the high alk and calcium is coming from. It's rising over the month of june. Reduce your dose of two part until it's stable. Test more frequently, saw you tested every 2 days then 2 weeks. You should test daily while your dialing in your dose and then at least weekly to check if you need adjustments. I tested daily until I got an alk monitor which tests 4x a day.

Dosing has stopped for close to 2 weeks now and and I stopped my biopellet reactor yesterday. Quite marine buffer a week ago and pulled out the purigen yesterday as well. I’m hoping to get my nitrates up slightly if possible. They are currently undetectable along with phosphates. I had a massive hair algae outbreak earlier in the month and was doing what I could to lower phos and nitrates. Apparently I went after it too hard, as the algae turned white and ultimately disappeared. I’m just concerned for the corals at this point as I have roughly 2k worth of frags in the tank as of now and I would be absolutely devastated if I lost them. What would you suggest as a nitrate phos supplement??

 

[BigJohnny]

marine buffer is a useless product as it just raises alkalinity which briefly raises ph.

I think you need to focus on dialing in your alk and Cal. Let it fall naturally and then dial in your dose. Nitrate/phosphate dosing is advanced I would not try that until your tank is stable (even then I don't recommend you do). Your nitrate and phosphate will go back up anyway since you removed biopellets. Even if they dont testably go up, you obviously had enough without pellets because you had a massive hair algae outbreak. Testable nitrate and phosphate don't tell the whole picture.

You are trying to do way too much, Paul b got that part right. You also say you aren't chasing numbers but your trying to raise your nitrate and phosphate due to test results, not coral symptoms.

 

[FragOut]

marine buffer is a useless product as it just raises alkalinity which briefly raises ph.

I think you need to focus on dialing in your alk and Cal. Let it fall naturally and then dial in your dose. Nitrate/phosphate dosing is advanced I would not try that until your tank is stable (even then I don't recommend you do). Your nitrate and phosphate will go back up anyway since you removed biopellets. Even if they dont testably go up, you obviously had enough without pellets because you had a massive hair algae outbreak. Testable nitrate and phosphate don't tell the whole picture.

You are trying to do way too much, Paul b got that part right. You also say you aren't chasing numbers but your trying to raise your nitrate and phosphate due to test results, not coral symptoms.

The hair algae outbreak was prior to me using biopellets. They actually helped getting rid of it I’m assuming through stripping the water of nitrates. I’m attempting to raise nitrates and phosphates for my corals as I have a few chalices and acros that are not happy at the moment. In a perfect world I would love to do nothing more than just that, nothing. No changes I’m making am I trying to make them sudden. As far as chasing stability I’m speaking of alkalinity. But I know some things need to be in line and I obviously need to make that happen. You can’t do that without change.

 

[FragOut]

Again, dosing in itself is something new to me. I’m still learning of reef chemistry and how each element plays its part. I’ve read where numbers need to be and I’m trying to get there. But with my alk not dropping and calcium rising WITHOUT dosing it’s becoming frustrating so I’m posting to figure that out. I’ve not gotten an answer to that yet. I’m told to do nothing, which I have for the past 14 days aside from marine buffer. Alkalinity and calcium still on the rise. I just want to know why it’s rising without dosing.

 

[BigJohnny]

The hair algae outbreak was prior to me using biopellets. They actually helped getting rid of it I’m assuming through stripping the water of nitrates. I’m attempting to raise nitrates and phosphates for my corals as I have a few chalices and acros that are not happy at the moment. In a perfect world I would love to do nothing more than just that, nothing. No changes I’m making am I trying to make them sudden. As far as chasing stability I’m speaking of alkalinity. But I know some things need to be in line and I obviously need to make that happen. You can’t do that without change.

My advice:

Alk:
Let alkalinity drop back to 9.x on its own (or whatever you had it at before it jumped up). During that time test consistently so you know on average how much alk your tank is consuming a day. Use that info to calculate your new dose and resuming dosing 2 part to maintain your params once it gets there. Test alk.once a week minimum, daily initially and when adjusting your dose in the future.

Nutrients:
I know the hair algae waa before the pellets, thats my point. You had plenty of nutrients when you weren't running biopellets, and since you just took them offline recently, your nutrients will rise back up on their own. If you are concerned you can feed heavier and dose amino acids and coral foods in the meantime. You could also run your skimmer less. There is no need for you to start dosing nitrate and phosphate, and if you can't handle two part dosing yet you will likely run into issues. It is more complicated and the testing is harder.