comparing cheap vs high end powerhead

I don't know if I would use the $20 no-name powerheads. I would lean toward a brand like Jebao, which is more in the $50 range for their entry-level powerhead. I wouldn't necessarily call Jebao a "brand name," but they're at least a known entity. As to whether it's "worth it" to buy a $50 Jebao as opposed to a $250 MP10, that's a personal choice. I would personally buy the Jebao every time. I got a used MP10 and it work just fine, but I also have two Jebao PP-4s which have been running for 9 months and 18 months without issue.

There's no doubt an MP10 is higher quality than the equivalent Jebao (at 5 times the price, it better be higher quality). The MP10 will probably last longer as well. To me though, those are intangible "feel good" qualities. Ecotech has a reputation for quality, but how does that translate into real-world reliability? At the end of the day, Ecotech offers a one year warranty on their pumps. If your Vortech fails outside that one year warranty, you're hosed. Do many Ecotech pumps last longer than one year? Sure. Is that a guarantee? No way. To me, it doesn't matter that many people believe that "Ecotech" is a byword for quality: Ecotech tells me the longest that they're willing to guarantee their pumps is one year. That's too short for me, especially when they cost 5 times as much as the competing bargain pump.

Let's say your Jebao pump fails in 6 months and you have to buy another. You've still only spent $100 total ($50 on the first pump, $50 on the second), as opposed to the MP10 which cost $250. If we're pessimistic and assume the MP10 fails after one year, you would have come out ahead buying the Jebaos as opposed to the Vortechs. Let's assume that the MP10 has a more reasonable life of three years. Let's also assume the Jebao pumps have a relatively poor lifespan of 6 months. In three years, you will have bought 6 Jebaos for a total of $300. So even if your MP10 has a relatively good service life of three years and the Jebaos have a relatively bad service life of 6 months, you're still about breaking even by buying the Jebaos. And that's assuming that absolutely nothing goes wrong with your Vortech. If it does, the math is skewed even more in favor of the Jebaos. Plus, Jebaos seem to be hit or miss. If it fails, it'll fail in the first 6 months or so. If it doesn't, it will last a few years. So while you may get a dud that dies after 6 months, you might get one of the good ones that lasts a few years.

To each his own. At the end of the day, this is a hobby, and if aesthetics are incredibly important to you, then Vortechs might make the most sense. For me personally, value is the top priority. Every dollar I don't spend on equipment I can spend on livestock (or one of my other non-reefing hobbies). If Vortech pumps were guaranteed to last three years, the math would work out in their favor and I might never buy a Jebao again. Unfortunately, the longest they're guaranteed to last is one year. When you consider their cost and the cost of Jebaos, I can't justify the price of Ecotech pumps.

What you're forgetting to mention is that the motor isn't in the water. That plays a huge factor in reliability. Not to mention that most problems occur on the wet side of the pump, which is easily replaced at a much cheaper price.

Then there's the MUCH easier maintenance on the pumps. You don't need to undo your cord management to remove the entire pump.

There's more than just aesthetics involved.
 
I had regular pumps in my first tank but simply did not like how it looked in addition to removing the entire pump to perform maintenance and to clean the cord. I also don’t like seeing the cords inside the tank. So I swapped out to echotech pumps and that’s what I’ve used on later builds. Simply my preference and I’ve been very happy with them.
 
I’m liking where the RFG nozzles are getting at. Upping your return pump and having no wavemakers in the tank. That’s the ultimate setup if we wanted to get away from pumps altogether in the DT. Anyone running this style?
 
I’m liking where the RFG nozzles are getting at. Upping your return pump and having no wavemakers in the tank. That’s the ultimate setup if we wanted to get away from pumps altogether in the DT. Anyone running this style?
I had that setup from vivid creative aquatics and it was nice, very cheap for random flow. I got a mp10 for the nano and have not been disappointed.

Ive had many cheap power heads(aqueon, hydor) before and none have failed me yet with a good cleaning but there just something about vortechs not having cords in the water, a heavy duty motor, and their reliability that impressed me.

I have never seen that much polyp extension before with the other pumps.
 
What you're forgetting to mention is that the motor isn't in the water. That plays a huge factor in reliability. Not to mention that most problems occur on the wet side of the pump, which is easily replaced at a much cheaper price.

Then there's the MUCH easier maintenance on the pumps. You don't need to undo your cord management to remove the entire pump.

There's more than just aesthetics involved.

Can't disagree more with the first point. Vortech powerheads are still the only flow solution where the motor is outside the tank (the other option is HOB filters or closed loops with an external pump, but that's outside the scope of this discussion). All other major brands (Tunze, Hydor, etc) don't have any problems with reliability because they have motors in-tank.

Also disagree with your second point. It's cheaper to replace a wetside than it is to buy a whole new Vortech pump, true. But an MP10 wet side is $62 on BRS. A Jebao OW10 is $60. Even if we assume your Vortech fails and only needs a new wetside, it's still cheaper to go with the Jebao and just replace the whole thing.

Your final point is subjective. If cable management is truly so difficult in your situation that you absolutely have to use a pump with the moving parts all inside the tank, that's your experience and I can't argue with it. I personally don't think it's worth paying five times as much for a pump simply so that I don't have to unbuckle a cable clip once a month. But, everyone has their own opinion of what "worth" means.
 
Personally, I look at what I wish to acheive with a bit of kit.
I look at the spec to see if it at least meets those requirements.
I look at price.
With respect to reliability, I look at warrenty length and spares availabilty.
Asthetics is my last deciding factor.

IME just because something is more expensive doese not mean its more reliable. Especially with regards a pump. Its not rocket science. Its just a motor a shaft and some plastic blades. Most electronics including windings for motors are mas produce in factories for a number of different companies.

As far as I am aware EcoTech only assemble the pumps not machine them. I got this impression from there company info. So I can not state that as fact.

I like the ethos of EcoTech and their support for the hobby, I also like the asthetics and innovative design.

However I have a familly and could not seriuosly defend spending that amount of money on my hobby for one bit of kit. Would be nice to see specification comparisons on this discussion. So we can make a more informed decision. Maybe a poll on price, spec, product model and reliabilty after 12 months warrenty period.
 
i have read though everyone comments, that would make alots of sense to me, sometimes that abit pricy for one piece of powerhead that accelerated the tank.

I do own mp10qd for half a years and it still working fine while on other hand i also own a 20$ hydor mini that been runing for almost 2 years without any problem either. To me both provide the same quality and what i need.
 
IME just because something is more expensive doese not mean its more reliable. Especially with regards a pump. Its not rocket science. Its just a motor a shaft and some plastic blades. Most electronics including windings for motors are mas produce in factories for a number of different companies. As far as I am aware EcoTech only assemble the pumps not machine them. I got this impression from there company info. So I can not state that as fact.

Correct that paying more does not mean more reliable. It's not rocket science, but it is pump science; and the vortech attempts an engineering feat that no other pump attempts. Coupling the pump across glass/acrylic introduces an uncontrollable (to ETM) element to implementations and opens the pump up to all sorts of user error. It is no coincidence, I think, that companies with casual disregard for IP like Jebao have not copied vortech. If you run them properly, I have personally found the vortech to be quite acceptable in terms of reliability. As I've said, they're worth it to me, but I grant that not all would make the same calculation.
 
Correct that paying more does not mean more reliable. It's not rocket science, but it is pump science; and the vortech attempts an engineering feat that no other pump attempts. Coupling the pump across glass/acrylic introduces an uncontrollable (to ETM) element to implementations and opens the pump up to all sorts of user error. It is no coincidence, I think, that companies with casual disregard for IP like Jebao have not copied vortech. If you run them properly, I have personally found the vortech to be quite acceptable in terms of reliability. As I've said, they're worth it to me, but I grant that not all would make the same calculation.

Hi Ca1ore, I totally agree, it is the innovative design that makes the pump stand out. I would also think its this unconventional design that makes the componants much more expensive.

I also agree that is probably why no one else has tried to copy the design.

As an engineer myself I would always ask. Why would I want to complicate things and make them more expensive. If the design improved performance, then would the improvement , if any, justify the increased production costs? Surely the only major differance between these and other pumps is your cable runs along the outside the tank instead of inside. If anything the design would suggest that the pumps are less efficient. They will be a greater loss per watt across the divide.

If the pumps where part of some proffesional competition, like racing cars, then even the smallest advantage could be worth greatly increasing your budget, depending on the prize. But these are fish tanks. They are not usually classed as financial investments.

Honestly, I get it, It is down to asthetics. If you really prefer the look and can afford it then by all means go for it.

I always find it strange though that so many reefers seem to think nothing of paying hundreds of pounds on one bit of kit. But find it impossible to justify paying a little more for a more sustainably sourced animal. After all surely without the animals themselves we don't have a hobby.

If one has the cash maybe one can have both, but I believe the majority of us have to make budget desicions. I say, spend ones money wisely. If one has any spare, send it to a relevant conservation organisation. Or buy some more lovely corals. That would be my choice, ha ha.

Happy Reefing.
 
I like the cross flow...Jecod/Jebao cp-40 $85. Just my choice,
Screenshot_20180413-232828.png
on my budget.
Do you think two of these on a 180 would do. these are more my budget then the maxspect.
 
Can't disagree more with the first point. Vortech powerheads are still the only flow solution where the motor is outside the tank (the other option is HOB filters or closed loops with an external pump, but that's outside the scope of this discussion). All other major brands (Tunze, Hydor, etc) don't have any problems with reliability because they have motors in-tank.

Also disagree with your second point. It's cheaper to replace a wetside than it is to buy a whole new Vortech pump, true. But an MP10 wet side is $62 on BRS. A Jebao OW10 is $60. Even if we assume your Vortech fails and only needs a new wetside, it's still cheaper to go with the Jebao and just replace the whole thing.

Your final point is subjective. If cable management is truly so difficult in your situation that you absolutely have to use a pump with the moving parts all inside the tank, that's your experience and I can't argue with it. I personally don't think it's worth paying five times as much for a pump simply so that I don't have to unbuckle a cable clip once a month. But, everyone has their own opinion of what "worth" means.

Cheap powerheads, or Chinese gear in general, also run a higher risk of stray voltage as well. They're simply not built with as strict QC oversight, if any. This is my own experience, which is why I use higher end electrical equipment in the water.

I'm not saying that the Jebao units won't get the job done for people. I'm simply saying that you have a higher likelihood of issues or failure. They may work fine for 75% of the units sold, but I won't take the chance of being in the 25% of units that do have problems, some of which can go unnoticed until serious issues occur.

Cord management is a personal preference. I'm disabled, so getting down and untangling multiple powerhead cords is a pain for me. Even having the wires zip-tied, they always get tangled somehow.

And then there's my pet peave. I don't like copyright infringement and will not directly support any Chinese product. Yes, many products or components are made or sourced from China, but certain products are made and sold by the Chinese. It's these products I don't willingly support. I would rather pay the extra cost for a better quality, made in the USA product over some Chinese brand. You also usually have a difficult time with warranty support if a product has to be mailed back to China.

Just my feelings on the matter, along with what I previously stated.
 
Cheap powerheads, or Chinese gear in general, also run a higher risk of stray voltage as well. They're simply not built with as strict QC oversight, if any. This is my own experience, which is why I use higher end electrical equipment in the water.

I'm not saying that the Jebao units won't get the job done for people. I'm simply saying that you have a higher likelihood of issues or failure. They may work fine for 75% of the units sold, but I won't take the chance of being in the 25% of units that do have problems, some of which can go unnoticed until serious issues occur.

Cord management is a personal preference. I'm disabled, so getting down and untangling multiple powerhead cords is a pain for me. Even having the wires zip-tied, they always get tangled somehow.

And then there's my pet peave. I don't like copyright infringement and will not directly support any Chinese product. Yes, many products or components are made or sourced from China, but certain products are made and sold by the Chinese. It's these products I don't willingly support. I would rather pay the extra cost for a better quality, made in the USA product over some Chinese brand. You also usually have a difficult time with warranty support if a product has to be mailed back to China.

Just my feelings on the matter, along with what I previously stated.
If you're concerned with stray voltage, make sure your equipment is either UL or ETL Listed. Get a GFCI for your electrical receptacle. Make sure your circuit is grounded properly and life will be fine...cheap pumps included.
 
If you are buying cheap and you fell like it will last that is fine. But if you have the attitude I can buy 5 for the price of one, our land fills are filling up fast and we do not need to add to the carbon emissions by keep making things that do not last. My vote would go to a 120v Tunze that only cost me $60 years ago, is it controllable no but it moves a bunch of water, has lasted a long time, and doesn't leak current in to my tank.
 
The other issue with the 'could buy 5 for the price of the 1' logic is the potential for collateral damage. Perhaps not as much with power-heads, but I would never cheap out on a return pump for fear that it would crap out on me when I was out of town which would be a problem. Livestock losses quickly change the cost equation.
 

IF YOU HAD TO TAKE A REEFING EXAM, WOULD YOU PASS?

  • Yes!

    Votes: 32 45.7%
  • Not yet, but I have one that I want to buy in mind!

    Votes: 9 12.9%
  • No.

    Votes: 26 37.1%
  • Other (please explain).

    Votes: 3 4.3%
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