Controller - do I really need one? Not liking the Apex reviews

[Crashjack]

I’m handicapped and couldn’t have gotten back into the hobby after 15+ years without a controller. I looked at them all and decided on Reef Angel. If you understand programming, it really isn’t hard, especially if you use the Webwizard. The new Star controller has an led touchscreen so you can turn on/off relays, view parameters, run modes (feeding, lights on, etc.), and clear timeouts, all from the touch screen. Now, I operate from my PC or phone 99% of the time. However, the led touchscreen is a great failsafe in the event my internet goes down. The Reef Angel does notifications and likely anything any other controller can do (probably more since it runs open source code). The water level expansion module is great for auto top-off. It is a simple pressure sensor that gives you a water-level readout as well as manages your ATO. If you keep most parameters outside the code (reading it from the cloud instead of hard-coding parameters), you can easily adjust the water level in your sump via your PC or phone without touching the sensor. In my experience, Roberto, the owner, does a good job of responding to emails and forum posts and makes good on any equipment problems.

All controllers have their pros and cons, and though often overlooked, the Reef Angel is a very legitimate option.

 

[elisa h]

I'm just waiting for one thats not ridiculously overpriced yet a bit more advanced than the reefer keeper. There definitely tons of horror stories about the apex out there that'll make you question spending $700 plus just for the baseline unit. Then of course there will be the people who spent that money and want to justify there purchase and say the apex is just the best thing over and they couldn't live without it. That being said, I probably would get something like the apex if I had a huge system worth thousands. I wouldn't use it for things like dosing that could go horribly wrong but for redundancy. (does anybody know of a leak detector that will notify via phone besides the apex module?)

 

[Crashjack]

I'm just waiting for one thats not ridiculously overpriced yet a bit more advanced than the reefer keeper. There definitely tons of horror stories about the apex out there that'll make you question spending $700 plus just for the baseline unit. Then of course there will be the people who spent that money and want to justify there purchase and say the apex is just the best thing over and they couldn't live without it. That being said, I probably would get something like the apex if I had a huge system worth thousands. I wouldn't use it for things like dosing that could go horribly wrong but for redundancy. (does anybody know of a leak detector that will notify via phone besides the apex module?)

I’m not sure what the aversion is to dosing with a controller unless maybe someone is running a doser based on something like pH and the probe goes bad. Redundancy requires a little ingenuity. A controller helps, but there is more to redundancy than just running standalone heaters from a controller.

 

[elisa h]

I’m not sure what the aversion is to dosing with a controller unless maybe someone is running a doser based on something like pH and the probe goes bad. Redundancy requires a little ingenuity. A controller helps, but there is more to redundancy than just running standalone heaters from a controller.

I’ve read threads where a controller has dumped a ton of alk into somebody’s tank killing fish and corals. I was just saying I personally wouldn’t give a controller too much power because technology malfunctions every day. And by redundancy I meant anything from heaters, sensing power and equipment failures, leak detection, etc. It would be worth it to me if I had a very expensive system to be able to check up on those things when I’m away from home.

 

[Lasse]

The chance that my Profilux should overdose its probably below 0.1 % - and if it does – its probably because a fault I did by myself.

The chance that I should forget to dose a day or two its 100 %. The question is not if – it’s a question of when!

Sincerely Lasse

 

[nhlives]

The peace if mind using a controller plus cameras while traveling is priceless.

I have the Apex Fusion and love it. Depending on your WIFI situation you might experience issues with network connectivity. There are work-around so don't let they deter you...and yes they are expensive and overpriced like everything else in this hobby.

I use mine for dosing, feeding, leak detection, etc..

 

[Greybeard]

I have the Apex Fusion and love it. Depending on your WIFI situation you might experience issues with network connectivity.

I'm a bit curious about that... I've heard several people talk about network problems with Apex. I was expecting that I might have an issue when I installed my Apex last month. Apex Classic, mounted where there are no available network ports. I didn't want to run a cable, so I hooked up a 10 year old Amped wifi extender I had. Used to use it on one of my kids video game systems. So... Incoming internet, through my home router, then to a wifi AP, wifi to the Amped device, and cabled to my Apex. Worked great the minute I hooked it up, and according to Fusion, hasn't lost connection since. TCP/IP routing is transparent to the end device... The Apex 'calls home', so you don't need it to be accessible from outside... I'm curious why people have so many problems with Apex connections?

 

[gcrawford]

Get an older apex full version - they run about $300 on here and other forums. I would never have a reef tank without one. Mine controls my Kessils, my cal reactor Co2, hood fans, T-5s, heaters, Jebao pumps, Vortec Pumps, gives me readings through the day via my phone..... Nuff said!

(AND Mine is hard wired for network connectivity through a switch and modem/router)

 

[saltyhog]

I'm a bit curious about that... I've heard several people talk about network problems with Apex. I was expecting that I might have an issue when I installed my Apex last month. Apex Classic, mounted where there are no available network ports. I didn't want to run a cable, so I hooked up a 10 year old Amped wifi extender I had. Used to use it on one of my kids video game systems. So... Incoming internet, through my home router, then to a wifi AP, wifi to the Amped device, and cabled to my Apex. Worked great the minute I hooked it up, and according to Fusion, hasn't lost connection since. TCP/IP routing is transparent to the end device... The Apex 'calls home', so you don't need it to be accessible from outside... I'm curious why people have so many problems with Apex connections?

When I moved my tank was on a concrete slab so I couldn't run a direct connection from my router. I ran my Apex for about 9 months with a gaming WiFi adapter. It did not work well and frequently disconnected and had to be reset. When my router went out and had to be replaced, I bought a nodal router and placed one node next to the tank and was able to hard wire to my Apex again. Works like a charm and no disconnections any longer!

 

[Crashjack]

I’ve read threads where a controller has dumped a ton of alk into somebody’s tank killing fish and corals. I was just saying I personally wouldn’t give a controller too much power because technology malfunctions every day. And by redundancy I meant anything from heaters, sensing power and equipment failures, leak detection, etc. It would be worth it to me if I had a very expensive system to be able to check up on those things when I’m away from home.

Whether you are using a timer or a smart dosing pump (utilizing its own controller), failure is no less likely than running from a controller. The beauty of a controller is that it adds a level of redundancy plus you can program additional failsafes. Even if someone doses manually, the more he doses the more likely human error becomes a factor.

 

[Blue Carbon Reefing]

My opinion is you can have a thriving tank without an APEX. However, I have an APEX classic and have been using it for years and I can't imagine reefing without it. It gives me piece of mind in a lot of areas. It sends me text messages with early warning signs or things are failing. Temp is too high or low, water levels are too high or low, salinity is out of wack. It can shut off lights, pumps, ATO, anything when things fail. However, just like a computer it is only as good as the person using it. You do have to be careful on what you are doing with it. Don't change too much too fast which holds true in the hobby in general. I would not say you would be wasting a single penny by purchasing an APEX but my suggestion is to start slow and use it for little stuff first like monitoring PH, Temp, ORP, Salinity. Start with controlling things that can't already be controlled by the reef link. I Also have a Reeflink and 5 X MP40s, 4 X Radion XR30 Gen3 Pros, 2 X M1 Vectras. All of these are connected to my Reeflink with little control through the APEX. I think only one M1 pump is plugged into the APEX. Hope hearing all of these opinions will help you make a decision. Good luck!

 

[DHill6]

I love the Apex, it's peace of mind to cut off a heater before boiling a tank, to turn on the fan before the tank gains in temp. Runs other equipment also along with the probes. I have it connected to both laptop and phone, alerts can save alot of heartache. This is my second, which is the 2016 Apex, the previous Apex was also problem free and it was sold. They stand behind their products, easy to put in a ticket and fast to reply if you should encounter a problem or simply have a question, my experience.

 

[mike werner]

what's an apex?lol I've never found a need for one with my life style.

 

[ReefTeacher]

I have been a long time Neptune User. I had a ACJr more than 10 years ago. When you hear of bad reviews, and disappointment with consumer service, there is a distinction to be made. I have found the Neptune Controllers: AcJr, ACIII and now the Apex Classic, very reliable over the course of years. I have no experience with the new Apex; some complain of reliability issues.

Now I have not had the same experience with Neptune peripherals. Many have found the WAV pumps simply die after about 2 years. I had 2 go out on me. Also many have had trouble with the flimsy AFS. So I recommend getting the Apex controller as a barebones system, then getting higher end peripherals, like Tunze pumps with 5 year warrantees, to round out your system. I have found my tank to be rock solid with such a hybrid system.

 

[AtlCPA]

Ok, I think you guys have convinced. I’m keeping apex in the budget although I do anticipate running my mp40’s and radions through reef link. Maybe the return pump too. That way a system failure does shut down the tank until Neptune can send me a new unit.

 

[Lasse]

There has been issues with overdosing from dosing pumps - but all I know abut its caused of the fact that the outlet is lower than the inlet. If the impeller will stop in the wrong position - you will get a siphon effect in that case.

Sincerely Lasse

 

[TinyChocobo]

I love my Apex classic (got it when it was “The” Apex) and my Apex 2016.

I have my new one doing all kinds of neat stuff. It controls my two heaters. One is primary and the second only comes on if the primary can’t keep up or if it fails.

If my skimmer cup gets full it emails me. If my primary heater fails it emails me. If mu secondary heater fails it emails me. If both heaters fail it emails me. If my return pump fails or stops for any reason it emails me and shuts off my heaters. It controls the flow through my algae reactor. It controls my lights. It controls my Vortechs.

I have a feed mode and an acclimation mode set up.

I monitor temp, ph, salinity, orp.

Overall I love the system. Nothing is perfect but I’ve had no major issues.

That said when I did reach out to Neptune about a small bug I found they responded in a few hours.

 

[TinyChocobo]

There has been issues with overdosing from dosing pumps - but all I know abut its caused of the fact that the outlet is lower than the inlet. If the impeller will stop in the wrong position - you will get a siphon effect in that case.

Sincerely Lasse

Imho the pump should be designed so that no matter how it stops - flow stops. Seems a poor design otherwise no?

 

[Lasse]

The normal dose pumps have 3 wings in order to press the tube. I think there is around 2 % risk that you will have a siphon effect. With 4 wings the risk will be near 0 but the capacity will be lower and more expensive.

Sincerely Lasse

 

[TinyChocobo]

The normal dose pumps have 3 wings in order to press the tube. I think there is around 2 % risk that you will have a siphon effect. With 4 wings the risk will be near 0 but the capacity will be lower and more expensive.

Sincerely Lasse

I would think that just wrapping the dosing line around the pump head more would alleviate it. It will still move the same amount of fluid as it’s determined by the speed of the turn and the distance between the “wings”. So long as at least one is always blocking the tube you _should_ be good to go I would think