Copper Resistance Ick

[Huskymaniac]

Does it exist? No spots but all fish scraping gills on plastic decorations and pvc pipes. This is the second round dealing with this. Thinking about bailing on copper and running hyposalinity instead. Thoughts?

 

[cmcoker]

Sure its ich? Have you ruled out flukes?

 

[Humblefish]

It is theoretically possible for any pathogen to develop a resistance to any medication/chemical used to treat/eradicate it; if said medication/chemical is used improperly e.g. at a subtherapeutic level.

 

[Huskymaniac]

Sure its ich? Have you ruled out flukes?

Treated with 3 rounds of prazi. Could be prazi resistant flukes.

 

[Huskymaniac]

It is theoretically possible for any pathogen to develop a resistance to any medication/chemical used to treat/eradicate it; if said medication/chemical is used improperly e.g. at a subtherapeutic level.

First t I'll me treated with coppersafe at 2.0. Now using copper power at 2.5. All confirmed with Hanna Checker. I am 10 days into the copper power with no sign of the flashing stopping.

 

[Humblefish]

Treated with 3 rounds of prazi. Could be prazi resistant flukes.

Very possible. I've encountered 3 separate strains of prazi resistant flukes since April. Two were eliminated via hyposalinity; one was resistant even to hypo so I had to use formalin.

 

[Humblefish]

First t I'll me treated with coppersafe at 2.0. Now using copper power at 2.5. All confirmed with Hanna Checker. I am 10 days into the copper power with no sign of the flashing stopping.

A lot of things can make a fish scratch. Parasites, worms, a bacterial infection, Lympho (virus).... even "healing" from where trophonts had been feeding.

 

[Huskymaniac]

Just a quick update. The fish were scratching throughout and after copper treatment. I put them in hypo 3 days ago and the flashing has finally stopped. I didn’t fw dip but I am assuming it was likely flukes.

 

[4FordFamily]

@HotRocks QT is experiencing the same thing. No flukes upon FW dip, however.

Makes me think it’s fish healing from injury from the distribution systems.

 

[Huskymaniac]

I am not so sure about that. The flashing was intense. Constantly going at the gills. My kamohara blenny would literally flash for 10 minutes straight every hour.

 

[4FordFamily]

I am not so sure about that. The flashing was intense. Constantly going at the gills. My kamohara blenny would literally flash for 10 minutes straight every hour.

Who knows. Copper isn’t to blame IMO. I suspect you would have probably had far more serious issues that would have taken over in its absense. At least it’s over now!

 

[HotRocks]

I just finished FW dips on 3 fish. I'm on day 6 of therapeutic copper (using copper power at 1.75ppm).

Absolutely no flukes. Fish just started scratching yesterday. Achilles tang spending a bit of time in front of powerhead which is what was alarming to me. I have seen occasional scratching etc throughout my last several batches of copper QT (fish always came out ich/velvet free).

I have basically narrowed it down to fish healing from trophonts. Or possible Brook/uronema.

 

[Huskymaniac]

Who knows. Copper isn’t to blame IMO. I suspect you would have probably had far more serious issues that would have taken over in its absense. At least it’s over now!

Agreed. Just not sure how long to keep them in hypo for. Not really sure what in the world I was treating but atleast I am confident its impossible to be ick or velvet.

 

[Huskymaniac]

Spoke to soon. My yellow coris wrasse is flashing again , head shaking, and yawning. I am at a loss. No way any of those fish are going within 10 feet of my display tank. Honestly thinking of just cutting my losses and humanely putting everyone in that QT down and starting over after disinfecting it. Totally sucks.

 

[Huskymaniac]

@HotRocks what are you going to end up doing? My fish have actually been in QT for over 80 days. They have been through 2 rounds of copper and now 7 days of hypo. If this were Brook or Uronema I can’t imagine it would take this long to come out. Not sure what else to do. I am going to start increasing the salinity over the next week and try general cure. If that doesn’t work what am I left with CP or Formalin?

 

[HotRocks]

@HotRocks what are you going to end up doing? My fish have actually been in QT for over 80 days. They have been through 2 rounds of copper and now 7 days of hypo. If this were Brook or Uronema I can’t imagine it would take this long to come out. Not sure what else to do. I am going to start increasing the salinity over the next week and try general cure. If that doesn’t work what am I left with CP or Formalin?

You are probably left with a Formalin bath.

My symptoms came on so quickly, and during therapeutic copper, so I have one of three things going on. Gram negative bacterial infection again, fish we're so heavily afflicted with velvet trophonts that the damage was already done, or lastly something that isn't treated with copper like Brook or uronema. I lost 3 fish already over the weekend.

 

[Huskymaniac]

Do you think all the fish in the tank need to go through formalin baths or just the ones showing symptoms? I got figure this out soon as my skunk clown stopped eating in hypo and my Purple Tang developed mild HLLE from the copper and hypo. Prior to the hypo my Kamohara Blenny was the worst but it hasn’t flashed since the salinity hit 1.009. The yellow coris wrasse is the only one head shaking, yawning, and flashing.

 

[Huskymaniac]

@HotRocks Does uronema cause fish to scratch out of curiosity? Reason I ask is that I have a chromis in the tank that had a sore on its side that I thought it was an infection related to an injury. Treated with a week of kanaplex and metro through foods and it went away. Uronema wouldn’t stay silent for 2 months would it?

 

[HotRocks]

@HotRocks Does uronema cause fish to scratch out of curiosity? Reason I ask is that I have a chromis in the tank that had a sore on its side that I thought it was an infection related to an injury. Treated with a week of kanaplex and metro through foods and it went away. Uronema wouldn’t stay silent for 2 months would it?

Uronema will definitely cause scratching, Head twitching etc. If you have a chromis that had a red sore very likely uronema was present.

 

[Huskymaniac]

@HotRocks do you think I should get fish out of hypo and start dosing metro in the water? I can also treat metro in the hypo as well while I gradually increase salinity. An also do a round of CP.