Copper Resistance Ick

lagatbezan · Jul 30, 2018

Had a racoon butterfly in qt for over 3 months with the same exact symptoms. Poor guy had every medicine/treatment thrown at him including CP, ttm, hypo, trifecta, copper, prazipro, GC, metroplex and formalin and still was not able to stop the flashing. Fresh water dips didn't show any flukes either. Unfortunately I wasn not able to cure it from whatever the issue was and lost him after 4 months in qt

Hope you have positive results!!

Huskymaniac · Jul 31, 2018

Not sure what else I can do. Right now I have 3 QT tanks running (55 gallon 2, 20 Gallon Long). The fish in the 20 Longs are due to hit the display tank on 8/22. In the 55 gallon I have the following:

Purple Tang
Kamohara Blenny
Green Chromis
Lyertail Anthias
Skunk Clown
Yellow Coris

The only fish still showing symptoms is the Yellow Coris. Everyone else seems to be okay except for the Purple Tang who started showings signs of HLLE. Hypo seemed to stop whatever was ailing the Blenny. I am not sure what the next step should be? Stay in hypo? Treat antibiotics in hypo? Try general cure in hypo? Raise salinity back up? Etc.

@Humblefish any thoughts?

Humblefish · Jul 31, 2018

@Huskymaniac Can you give the Yellow Coris a 5 min FW dip to rule out flukes (even though hypo should have eliminated any)?

Also, any sand in the QT for the Yellow Coris? A sand burrowing wrasse will sometimes scratch, yawn, flash after emerging from a sand bed because it is trying to dislodge sand stuck to it's skin + gills.

Huskymaniac · Aug 2, 2018

@Humblefish the wrasse finally stopped flashing at the 2 week mark. Maybe some residual flukes? However now the Purple Tang has about a dozen spots on the body. If I didn’t know this fish was just treated with two 30 days rounds of copper I would be 100% sure this was ick. How is the possible and what else can I do. I started raising the salinity in the tank and it’s back up to 1.012. Trying to get back up to normal sea water levels as the tang started to get HLLE in he hypo.

Humblefish · Aug 3, 2018

Huskymaniac said:
@Humblefish the wrasse finally stopped flashing at the 2 week mark. Maybe some residual flukes? However now the Purple Tang has about a dozen spots on the body. If I didn’t know this fish was just treated with two 30 days rounds of copper I would be 100% sure this was ick. How is the possible and what else can I do. I started raising the salinity in the tank and it’s back up to 1.012. Trying to get back up to normal sea water levels as the tang started to get HLLE in he hypo.

Can you post a pic of the PT showing the spots?

Huskymaniac · Aug 3, 2018

@Humblefish Couldnt get a good **** of the other side which has a lot more. Take a look at the circled area. A few spots there.

Humblefish · Aug 3, 2018

@Huskymaniac I can't tell for sure from the photo.

How long have the spots been there? Do they move at all or remain stationary? If you look closely, do they appear to be on top or just below the epithelium (outer skin layer)?

Huskymaniac · Aug 3, 2018

@Humblefish Started appearing yesterday. Looking from a head on angle it looks like its on the skin and and not under it. Tough to tell.

Humblefish · Aug 3, 2018

Huskymaniac said:
@Humblefish Started appearing yesterday. Looking from a head on angle it looks like its on the skin and and not under it. Tough to tell.

On top of the skin could be flukes, a bacterial/viral lesion, or a "surface" parasite such as velvet/brook.

Ich trophonts burrow in under the epithelium.

4FordFamily · Aug 3, 2018

HotRocks said:
Uronema will definitely cause scratching, Head twitching etc. If you have a chromis that had a red sore very likely uronema was present.

To add to this, it seems like butterflies and chromis are most affected by uronema but I’m starting to wonder if it’s hitting other fish more aggressively based on @HotRocks, @Humblefish and I’s observation recently. Anecdotal as of yet.

It could easily be nasty infections as well...

Huskymaniac · Aug 3, 2018

I am at a loss here since this has been a quarantine process from hell. Well past 60 days now. Whatever is going on can survive hypo and copper. You think i should give cp a whirl? Antibiotics maybe? What about my other fish in the other 2 qt tanks. They were all together at 1 point but only this 1 tank is having issues.

Huskymaniac · Aug 3, 2018

@Humblefish is this photo better?

Huskymaniac · Aug 4, 2018

@Humblefish here is another one looking tail on. I really think this is ick somehow. Is it possible that the ick strain is lasting more than 30 days in the cyst form and then reinfecting the fish once the copper is out? Interesting this started after I started raising the salinity and taking them out of hypo.

Huskymaniac · Aug 29, 2018

So far I have lost the following fish:

Pygmy Hawk
Spot Cardinal
2 Margarita Cardinals
Blue Flasher Wrasse

Still have no idea what I am dealing with. No treatment copper, fwd, cp, hyposalinity, formalin has any effect on this long term. Symptoms are always back a week after treatment. At this point I am going to likely cut my losses and disinfect my QT tanks. Checking to see if some other reefer wants the remaining fish to try and save them.

lagatbezan · Oct 10, 2018

just wondering how you made out @Huskymaniac

Huskymaniac · Oct 10, 2018

What i did was reintroduce copper into the qt tank. At 10 days I then moved the fish back into the display and so far so good. Basically did a tank transfer. I am 99% positive I had a strain of ich that had a life cycle more than 30 days.