Emergency power help

[Anthony Wood]

There's a long list of things to get for the tank and only seems so be getting bigger. Luckily I live in an area with reliable electricity supply far enough upstate new to avoid the worst of things like sandy. But my plans are to avoid the expense of an inverter generator through every other route available. I plan on getting a 10k watt generator (larger if needed). I'll have as many needed smaller DC to AC inverters or just one inverter (whichever comes out to be the cheapest) big enough to supply the power demands of the tank hooked up to a small battery bank. The battery bank will be getting continuously recharged by a battery charger hooked up to the generator. That way if what ever else is on the generator kicks on it doesn't effect the tank. If I kill a few truck batteries in the process of doing it this way then so be it haha losing a couple hundred dollars is better then losing $10k+ I have into the tank.

 

[Kungpaoshizi]

If I actually owned a house, I would setup several wind/solar solutions. A lot cheaper than fuel in various forms, and you can always expand the battery bank. In the Midwest it's common to get showed in, and that means proprane isn't as efficient and you're not going anywhere to get gas.

Though it would be really nice to get a semi-sized propane tank JUST for a nice big generator.. hehe

 

[Anthony Wood]

If you had a fridge kicking on and off that could also cause a problem with an inverter generator. It's a different issue when high inductive loads kick on (larger ac motors like a washing machine or fridge compressor). And I would have no problem at all connected a vortex pump directly to the outlet of a non inverter generator. If you think about it, the big utility generators are much more like that portable generator than they are an inverter generator. Almost all electronics are designed to work at both 60hz and 50hz so the rectifiers will maintain fairly stable DC voltages to the components even when the generator bogs down a little. The output of a non inverter generator is actually fairly clean power. The more rectifiers you add as load (which all electronics use) the more chopped the waveform gets due to harmonics. If the load gets too high the generators voltage regulator can no longer maintain a reasonable sine wave. Inverter generators themselves generate this type of chopped sine wave and so they have built in filters to help clean up the signal. Typically, non inverter generators don't have these filters hence the problem at higher electronic loads.

You would probably need a smaller generator than you think. A 3000 watt generator will typically power everything in a 2000 sqft house. The key is that most loads tend to be cyclical. If you started your microwave while brewing coffee and doing laundry you may have an issue. Otherwise, not so much. 15 amps at 120V is around 1800 watts. A 3000 watt generator will handle around 25A.

Thanks, learning something new everyday. You can disregard my previous response thinking I needed a 10k watt generator. Although if it's in the budget at the time I'm ready to invest into a generator then that's what I'll probably get. I would rather have too much available power then having not enough.

 

[jeremy.gosnell]

For me, there is only one Generator and that's Generac. I'm a partner at a large property management firm and we install a lot of home back-up generators. We get vicious winters here and it's not uncommon to lose power for several days or more. Generac is an innovator in the field and was one of the first generator companies to start monitoring and eliminating harmonic distortion in generator power. Harmonic distortion can destroy sensitive electronics, like those on our reef tanks. Generac also has a host of technology to interface the generator with your home.

My suggestion would be something along the lines of a Generac 5500 (about $700) and pair that with Generac's transfer switch (about $200 bucks). This will likely power both your tank and some of your house. The transfer switch will install by your panel box, with an outlet on the outside of the house where the generator will be connected. You can build a little structure to protect the generator or order a $30 cover from Amazon. If power goes out, you'll simply fire the generator up, plug it in to the exterior outlet, walk down to the transfer switch and switch from utility power to generator power. All told (with installation, you'll need an electrician) you'll have about $ 1,500 bucks in it.

 

[jeremy.gosnell]

If I actually owned a house, I would setup several wind/solar solutions. A lot cheaper than fuel in various forms, and you can always expand the battery bank. In the Midwest it's common to get showed in, and that means proprane isn't as efficient and you're not going anywhere to get gas.

Though it would be really nice to get a semi-sized propane tank JUST for a nice big generator.. hehe

Solar has come a long way, but it's still primarily useful only for part of a power load. It can do some water heating, or run an aquarium some of the time. However, you're still going to need a generator or utility power to make up the difference. You could go 100% solar, meaning a solar system to run the tank during daylight hours and a solar generator to charge battery banks that take over at night. However, you're looking at 30k or more in powering your tank. Considering the average reed tank costs about 960 bucks a year to run; it would take over 30 years to get a return on the investment.

 

[Anthony Wood]

If I actually owned a house, I would setup several wind/solar solutions. A lot cheaper than fuel in various forms, and you can always expand the battery bank. In the Midwest it's common to get showed in, and that means proprane isn't as efficient and you're not going anywhere to get gas.

Though it would be really nice to get a semi-sized propane tank JUST for a nice big generator.. hehe

If I owned the house I would invest into solar panels and a large high cap battery bank when the funds are there. But I don't own the house that's a possibility in the future lol it was be nice to go even 50% off the grid and stop having to pay these monopolies like NYSEG for my electric. That's off topic from the original post though so I'll end that conversion here.

 

[Brew12]

There's a long list of things to get for the tank and only seems so be getting bigger. Luckily I live in an area with reliable electricity supply far enough upstate new to avoid the worst of things like sandy. But my plans are to avoid the expense of an inverter generator through every other route available. I plan on getting a 10k watt generator (larger if needed). I'll have as many needed smaller DC to AC inverters or just one inverter (whichever comes out to be the cheapest) big enough to supply the power demands of the tank hooked up to a small battery bank. The battery bank will be getting continuously recharged by a battery charger hooked up to the generator. That way if what ever else is on the generator kicks on it doesn't effect the tank. If I kill a few truck batteries in the process of doing it this way then so be it haha losing a couple hundred dollars is better then losing $10k+ I have into the tank.

I figure that as long as I have my powerheads running during a power outage I should be ok. The live rock with circulation will provide ammonia removal and also oxygenate the water. The 2 MP40w's use less than 40 watts each. A $60 battery backup system from some place like Staples will keep those running, and my fish alive, for over 6 hrs. Probably over 10 since they won't run at max flow continuously.

 

[Paul B]

I put solar on my house about 9 years ago, but it doesn't work in a blackout (or night, or rain, or snow)

 

[RamsReef]

No! And please don't ever do this unless you know exactly what you are doing! Electrical linemen can be killed by people backfeeding the grid through their outlets. You may have a 120V generator but if you haven't opened the main breaker in your house that 120V can go back through your utilities transformer and get kicked up to 13,000 volts. Hopefully your generator would trip out as you try to feed the others in the neighborhood but if you are isolated because of storm damage it is very possible to energize a 13kV line from a 120V generator.

100%

 

[Joey waid]

I would say there is no such thing as a perfect sine wave, but I'm sure I'll get schooled on that too!!!

 

[RamsReef]

For me, there is only one Generator and that's Generac. I'm a partner at a large property management firm and we install a lot of home back-up generators. We get vicious winters here and it's not uncommon to lose power for several days or more. Generac is an innovator in the field and was one of the first generator companies to start monitoring and eliminating harmonic distortion in generator power. Harmonic distortion can destroy sensitive electronics, like those on our reef tanks. Generac also has a host of technology to interface the generator with your home.

My suggestion would be something along the lines of a Generac 5500 (about $700) and pair that with Generac's transfer switch (about $200 bucks). This will likely power both your tank and some of your house. The transfer switch will install by your panel box, with an outlet on the outside of the house where the generator will be connected. You can build a little structure to protect the generator or order a $30 cover from Amazon. If power goes out, you'll simply fire the generator up, plug it in to the exterior outlet, walk down to the transfer switch and switch from utility power to generator power. All told (with installation, you'll need an electrician) you'll have about $ 1,500 bucks in it.

You mean the harmonics produced by your electronics?

 

[Joey waid]

It's my belief that today electronics can handle most noise on a ac line. They have way better powers supply's and filter sections than they did years ago. In fact, again my belief is that today modern electronics create more noise than what is being made from generators. I have used all my I devices and computers on all kind of generators for years. A good isolation transformer or choke would be a good solution if noise is a issue. Again this is just my belief.

 

[RamsReef]

Harmonics are created by non-linear loads.

Electronics

 

[RamsReef]

What you are doing when you "filter" the "dirty power" is protecting the inductive loads on the circuit, mainly transformers.

These transformers are inside your AC/DC converter. You see that 50/60hz on there? Easy explanation is that is the frequency they perform best at. Frequencies outside of that or harmonics cause excess heating in them. This excess heating can lead to failure.

Enough of them from your house and others, starts to become a real headache for utilites as they have to oversize the equipment to handle the additional heating load, but not the additional actual load.

 

[McGee]

I am not so sure! I think the electronic are made to cheaply (got to save a dime or two for the stock holders).

 

[cj in sac ca]

Best thing is contact an electrician that does generator installs. A lot will do a free estimate to let you know how big of one you need.
I agree the multi fuel ones are the best. Being here in Florida and around hurricanes trust me gas desiel goes very quickly. There are some that hook up directly a natural gas line and come on right away when power goes off.
Like someone said more wattage the more you can run. Shop around and try not to settle on the first one.
Gentrac or something like that start around 1900 here for a smaller unit that is a standby that comes on when power is out, and hooked up to city natural gas line.

 

[Nickolya]

have a whole house generator works great

 

[Sharvey103]

Depends on what you are looking for. I installed a 22KW Generac whole house generator using natural gas. It is wired directly into the electrical panel and automatically starts after 6 second loss of power and loads within 30 seconds. It is sufficient to run the whole house including a 300, 70, and 40 gallon tanks. No load shedding required but have to watch it when both ACs are running and want to use the washer and dryer at the same time. Total installed price was $8K in 2015.

 

[tswanso3]

I had a 7500 watt Generac gasoline generator I used at the previous house and when we moved I had a 22kW Generac whole house generator installed for about the same as Sharvey.... Best thing I ever did.... even though it's been a year since it was installed and it hasn't had to actually take over due to a power loss.

 

[Bobby Larmer]

purchased Gererac and run on natural gas love it and has been a life saver as well allows me to not be concerned about power outages-had one last night lasted 4 hours generato kept whole house running and worked like a charm-tank didn't skip a beat!