Emperor and Bicolor Angels sick

[Aronsaquarium]

Hi,
I actually had another chat on this that was cut short because of some infighting, so if I can please get some more civil answers

i got 2 new angeles 3 days ago.
They both got sick after my tank got upended a little.
My Emperor wasn’t eating until today but has started to eat a decent amount throughout the day.. he eats only a few pieces at a time but I think collectively he’s ok.
But his fins at the back seem to be disintegrating?
He also has some patches on him

and the Bicolor hasn’t eaten any real food since I got him. Just taking a peck or 2 at the Rocks.
He has a section of him that his scales are open, I think I can see his red flesh behind it. I think it’s gotten a little smaller today but I can also see seeping in the smaller section today. So I’m not sure if that means a it’s healing or getting worse.. it’s hard to catch a clear pic of him but this is the only blemish I can see on him..

How can I help them?
I can’t do a QT. So I’ve gotta treat the DT, but it’s fish only.

 

[bruno3047]

If you want to try to tap water bath I’m still here. Let me know.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hi,
I actually had another these on this that was cut short because of some infighting, so if I can please get some more civil answers

i got 2 new angeles 3 days ago.
They both got sick after my tank got upended a little.
My Emperor wasn’t eating until today but has started to eat a decent amount throughout the day.. he eats only a few pieces at a time but I think collectively he’s ok.
But his fins at the back seem to be disintegrating?
He also has some patches on him

and the Bicolor hasn’t eaten any real food since I got him. Just taking a peck or 2 at the Rocks.
He has a section of him that his scales are open, I think I can see his red flesh behind it. I think it’s gotten a little smaller today but I can also see seeping in the smaller section today. So I’m not sure if that means a it’s healing or getting worse.. it’s hard to catch a clear pic of him but this is the only blemish I can see on him..

How can I help them?
I can’t do a QT. So I’ve gotta treat the DT, but it’s fish only.

Yes- quarantine first thing.
Bicolor especially a challenging fish- often starve and get viral diseases. These fish do best in a very mature and stable tank. I mentioned earlier - affected by water quality.
API test kits are notorious for false reading and have let down many reefers hence the low price for a test kit. I suspect your readings are higher.
For quarantine, a starter tank kit will suffice.
If fish are eating, treatment will be seachem metroplex and Focus as a binder to the food. If not, seachem Kanaplex or Ruby Rally pro.
Also increase oxygen with an air pump and air stone.

Lastly, take a water sample to a trusted LFS that does NOT use API kits nd see what they come up with for Ammonia-ph-nitrate

Some preventative measures are :
-Separating the fish that is aggressive to prevent further damage
-Maintaining a proper environment (i.e. clean water) for your fish to live in.
Providing good diet supplemented by immunity boosters such as garlic extract and vitamin boosters for stamina such as selcon vitamins.

 

[Aronsaquarium]

Hey Thank you so much!

ok so the Emperor has been eating more as the day has gone on so if the fins didn’t have that issue I wouldn’t be worried.
I only Worry about his fins showing what looks like decay, but maybe if it was ammonia burn or something like that then what’s done is done and it won’t get worse? It’s hard to tell

the bicolor isn’t eating at all and obviously has those open scales looking thing

I’m terms of treatment.
I had copper in there for ich that I had a couple months ago in the tank. I was pulling it out but pulled the plug on that with the new fish to hopefully prevent them getting it. So there’s not a full dose in there anymore but there is still some.

PraziPro was a stupid recommendation my LFS told me to put in the tank when I showed them these pics.
Then I realized it made no sense and I turned to R2R.
So yes I have medications for no reason it would seem.. but it may be preventative during this issue

regarding the water dip, I do hear the logic there.. my only concern is that the LFS is blaming me for washing the new rocks I got in tap water, and is saying that’s what caused me to loose 2 fish, and ruin the water balance which caused this..

so I’m freaked out about that, but if it makes the most sense I can do it.
It’ll be a real stress though as I’ll have to move around the rocks to have any chance of catching the Bicolor..

the maracyn two sounds good too.
I just need something I can put in the DT that won’t kill the beneficial bacteria, and won’t clash with the medications already in there..

 

[bruno3047]

Hey Thank you so much!

ok so the Emperor has been eating more as the day has gone on so if the fins didn’t have that issue I wouldn’t be worried.
I only Worry about his fins showing what looks like decay, but maybe if it was ammonia burn or something like that then what’s done is done and it won’t get worse? It’s hard to tell

the bicolor isn’t eating at all and obviously has those open scales looking thing

I’m terms of treatment.
I had copper in there for ich that I had a couple months ago in the tank. I was pulling it out but pulled the plug on that with the new fish to hopefully prevent them getting it. So there’s not a full dose in there anymore but there is still some.

PraziPro was a stupid recommendation my LFS told me to put in the tank when I showed them these pics.
Then I realized it made no sense and I turned to R2R.
So yes I have medications for no reason it would seem.. but it may be preventative during this issue

regarding the water dip, I do hear the logic there.. my only concern is that the LFS is blaming me for washing the new rocks I got in tap water, and is saying that’s what caused me to loose 2 fish, and ruin the water balance which caused this..

so I’m freaked out about that, but if it makes the most sense I can do it.
It’ll be a real stress though as I’ll have to move around the rocks to have any chance of catching the Bicolor..

the maracyn two sounds good too.
I just need something I can put in the DT that won’t kill the beneficial bacteria, and won’t clash with the medications already in there..

You’re LFS lied to you about your rocks. I wash my rocks off in tapwater all the time when I’m cleaning algae off them. And I pop them right back into my tank after they are clean. Do I see a white spot on the side of your emperor? Naturally, I don’t do ALL of the rocks, only the ones on the top of my aqua scape that get algae growth. You can see my tank in my avatar.

 

[Aronsaquarium]

That’s what I thought but then that means there was something in the rocks that caused it, as adding them is what messed up my clear system before that…

Would you say moving rocks and upending the tank is going to make things worse? Or putting something in like maracyn two or kanaplex is the way to go

 

[Aronsaquarium]

Oh and the white in the pic is food or something
The more grey below the side fin I’d what he has a bunch of on the other side

 

[bruno3047]

TBH I don’t think your Bicolor is a candidate for the tapwater dip. But I think your Emperor is. The fresh water bath, with or without chlorine, is stressful. The key is for the fish to be strong enough to sustain the stress, and then replenish his energy by eating.

 

[bruno3047]

Oh and the white in the pic is food or something
The more grey below the side fin I’d what he has a bunch of on the other side

Does the emperor have any white/gray splotches on his body like the Bicolor?

 

[bruno3047]

Oh and the white in the pic is food or something
The more grey below the side fin I’d what he has a bunch of on the other side

Does the emperor have any white splotches on his body like the Bicolor?

That’s what I thought but then that means there was something in the rocks that caused it, as adding them is what messed up my clear system before that…

Would you say moving rocks and upending the tank is going to make things worse? Or putting something in like maracyn two or kanaplex is the way to go

Do you have the Kanaplex and Maracyn 2 in-house right now?

 

[moz71]

The emperor looks exactly like one I got not long ago. I started with kanaplex and actually cleared a lot of it and did not impact biological bacteria at all however due to my panic I messed up and thought maybe flukes and switched to prazi Big mistake came back and he died. He was eating great right up to last day. I wished I just stuck with the kanaplex. Hope this helps

 

[Aronsaquarium]

Thank you!
So I don’t have either medicine at hand, but I can go as soon as the shops open tomorrow

and regarding the FW bath, because I did a dip on the emperor today I probably shouldn’t do another for a day or so?

and the Bicolor yeah I’m not sure what to do there..

 

[Aronsaquarium]

I can order Kanaplex on Amazon and have it Saturday

I’d assume the LFS would have it tomorrow though..

is it safe with prazi in the tank?

man’s barely traceable Cupramine? Probably 0.1 ppm

 

[Aronsaquarium]

Lights off, I can really see his flesh..
The white fluff has actually calmed down a little but now I’m seeing the real damage

 

[bruno3047]

How big is your tank, how long has it been up, and what type of filtration do you have? Please respond promptly if you want to take care of this issue.

 

[Aronsaquarium]

75g
4 months
Canister

 

[bruno3047]

75g
4 months
Canister

How much live rock that wasn’t washed with tapwater? Do you have an ammonia test kit?

 

[Aronsaquarium]

Original Live rock was probably 5 or so points. Plus 60lbs live sand originally.
I also put in 30-40 pounds of dead rock originally.

in terms of the new rock just added yesterday to give the new fish more homes etc,
Probably another 30lbs

 

[Aronsaquarium]

It’s the last 30lbs that caused the issue.
I added new live bacteria to the tank over the last couple days. To help correct the issue.
Now now Nitrite and Ammonia is 0.
Just checked

 

[bruno3047]

OK. How big of a water change could you do?