Factors that explain why new tanks (<1yr) typically cannot support SPS

[chrismelb]

Do we know what specific factors explain why new tanks (i.e., less than a year) cannot typically support SPS. Is it due to:

a) the instability of water parameters caused by boom and bust algae and bacteria cycles that may strip certain elements from the water,

b) alleopathy/toxins from from these cycles,

c)extreme nutrient shifts that may also be related to these cycles, or

d) a lack of established biodiversity e.g., sponges, coralline, zooplankton etc.

It may very well be a combination of all or some of the above but I find it interesting that most people tend to have issues with SPS in new tanks but other corals like LPS and softies dont seem to be affected. Interested to better understand these factors.

Chris

 

[BestMomEver]

I don’t know really..... as many people that have trouble with acros in a new tank, there are just as many that put corals in a brand new tank without problems (myself included). It may have more to do with the experience of the reefer more than the age of the tank.

 

[DarkSky]

I'm not quite sure, but I do have a picture that might show something about rock maturity.

The rock on the left and background has been wet for just over a year - I started curing it in March of 2018, after three months of curing it went into my display tank with no lighting for three months - July 2018 through October 2018. I had fish the entire time.

In October of 2018 I added an 8 bulb ATI Powermodule.

The rock on the right came from my previous tank, but was in the sump where it received 0 light. I used it for biodiversity, it had 0 coraline on it when we started. Coraline was introduced from trochus snail shells around July 2018.

You can see the difference in growth between the two surfaces quite clearly. There is something going on between s rock that is <1 year old vs one that is 1+.

 

[jda]

It is a fairly new phenonomen most associated with lack of real live rock, human intervention with reactors, media and chemical and also LEDs. A decade ago, you could keep acropora very well as soon as the coralline came in, which was just about after the cycle... some people still can, but not many. The dry/dead rock thing is well known, but people also want to use some media or chemicals to skip an ugly phase and this seems to set the tank back more than it helps. Some of the extra algae, diatoms, dinos, etc. are caused by the lack of real live rock too. Corals lit under the highest quality light can withstand more stress than those that are not - this is also a recent phenonomen.

 

[TheHarold]

I would disagree with your thesis though.... I always put in SPS into tanks within a month of adding water. And that’s with dry rock and dry sand.

 

[Waters]

I think it is just due to stabilization....both with water chemistry and equipment.

 

[sticksreef]

I put in my acros 2 weeks after setting up my tank with new water and dried rocks, no sand. Its working.

 

[brandon429]

we can pack any pico reef with sps in week one and make it grow until it becomes problematic.

by using already cured live rock as the base.
pico reefs don't follow anyones rules they make their own. top shelf sps too, check out Maritza vase reef nowadays on youtube, vase is worth about 3 thou


the reason for sps issues is the dry rock phenom. even that is overcome by today's nano jedis but its still the biggest factor for the masses.

score deep purple live rock, in ten steps you go from freshater to sps aquarist I have the messages we enjoy the new rules approach

having a tank too large to access every substrate, and the whole water volume, is part of the reason the masses have issues with sps. its not about uber precise params and tedious salinity controls, we show they're pretty forgiving. Maritza is using JF-quality stuff, bright as emeralds year after year in a gallon all packed in.

its easier to grow sps in a fishbowl than it is in a square reef apparently.

 

[jda]

This is the key point to most tank issues... there are exceptions to every rule, but more people fail trying to be the exception when they would be better off trying to be the rule.

 

[Foothill Corals]

There is no reason to wait a year. When the ugly stuff is gone add a cheap SPS and see what happens.


IME the last two tanks that I have set up (dry rock) had no issue keeping SPS at 5 months old. Back in the days of old school Fiji live rock (long time ago) I would add SPS at 1 or 2 months.

 

[reefwiser]

The word stability is the most important. New aquariums are not a stable environment. A new hobbyist with a new tank will be hard pressed to provide that stable environment. One can say well I did it once but it is not something you want to suggest to a new hobbyist that you want to keep in the aquarium keeping hobby. It just creates a failure factor mentality that causes a hobbyist to drop out of the hobby. This hobby has a super high churn rate in the first place.

 

[FlyPenFly]

It's entirely up to the skill and experience level of the gardener.

I would replace the phrase "new tanks" with "new reefer"

 

[Dlealrious]

I disagree with that, when I first started reefing a few years ago I started with dry rock and kept sps after a month or so. Nothing died but it didnt grow like crazy, I did get really good colours though. I just re done me scape with dry rock again and now I have better lighting and more experience growth has been seen from the start.

 

[BankeiZen]

Not to diverge from the topic, but I'd still be very curious to know why the aged rock grows Coraline so much better than new rock.

 

[Dr. Dendrostein]

It is a fairly new phenonomen most associated with lack of real live rock, human intervention with reactors, media and chemical and also LEDs. A decade ago, you could keep acropora very well as soon as the coralline came in, which was just about after the cycle... some people still can, but not many. The dry/dead rock thing is well known, but people also want to use some media or chemicals to skip an ugly phase and this seems to set the tank back more than it helps. Some of the extra algae, diatoms, dinos, etc. are caused by the lack of real live rock too. Corals lit under the highest quality light can withstand more stress than those that are not - this is also a recent phenonomen.

I've been back to Reef keeping started 10/2017 and I do notice a lot more dry Rock to cycle a tank than live rock now, I know live rock is expensive but I do notice that. I'm guessing but I think the majority of tanks is being started with dry Rock. Just my observation, probably wrong

 

[SOCOM]

I disagree with that, when I first started reefing a few years ago I started with dry rock and kept sps after a month or so. Nothing died but it didnt grow like crazy, I did get really good colours though. I just re done me scape with dry rock again and now I have better lighting and more experience growth has been seen from the start.

I also started day 1 with sps with no issues. I know alot of people that added sps day 1 and are very successful.

 

[brewandreef]

I tried within 6 weeks, I failed [emoji846].

I think it was partially due to:
1. Lack of superior lighting.
2. I was too focused on maintaining very low nutrients. I already suffered low pH with two very large breed dogs in my living room, but I decided to dose nopox, and sps had a bad reaction. Which eventually led to...
3. Use of dry rock and low phosphate levels led to dinoflagellates. Tried increasing nutrients, uv, etc., and did not have luck. I dosed dino-x and eventually got rid of them, but killed my sps as well.

I 100% listen to the old school reefers advice now. They absolutely know what they are doing. Listen to Mike Paletta, the bare bottom tank he started with dry rock had so many issues he had to seed it with old live rock from another tank. Once I seeded my tank with a piece from the lfs (although I have hydroids now) it's doing ok. And I now know my tank nearly inside out with all of the previous issues I've had.
I've also recently switched to MH, bought an acro, and am having good success this far.

IMO, wait a good 7 months before even trying acros in a tank, unless you like wasting money. Montis are ok.

...Or you could be luckier than me. A lot of people are, it's just a risk.

 

[MnFish1]

Do we know what specific factors explain why new tanks (i.e., less than a year) cannot typically support SPS. Is it due to:

a) the instability of water parameters caused by boom and bust algae and bacteria cycles that may strip certain elements from the water,

b) alleopathy/toxins from from these cycles,

c)extreme nutrient shifts that may also be related to these cycles, or

d) a lack of established biodiversity e.g., sponges, coralline, zooplankton etc.

It may very well be a combination of all or some of the above but I find it interesting that most people tend to have issues with SPS in new tanks but other corals like LPS and softies dont seem to be affected. Interested to better understand these factors.

Chris

Here is something to think about - when a fish store sets up a frag tank - they dont wait a year - and they dont turn the corals over every week (at the LFS I go to they just put up a new frag tank - and some of the larger corals are still in the tank - and they did it over a couple week period. There are also a couple threads that have tried to set up a tank within a short period - that seemed to have worked.

Here are my answers: 1. People that are setting up a new tank don't know what they are doing. (ie testing, responding to test results (ie adjusting things quickly), etc.
2. The tank doesnt have enough nitrifiers to manage waste.
3. See # 1. To me there is no magic - unless the coral REQUIRES certain bacteria, etc in the water. I dont think its chemical - - in other words - so if a tank is 9 months old - why is it different than 1 year old. etc etc

 

[MnFish1]

Not to diverge from the topic, but I'd still be very curious to know why the aged rock grows Coraline so much better than new rock.

Does it? Corraline grows on my glass - certainly not 'natural'.

 

[MnFish1]

The word stability is the most important. New aquariums are not a stable environment. A new hobbyist with a new tank will be hard pressed to provide that stable environment. One can say well I did it once but it is not something you want to suggest to a new hobbyist that you want to keep in the aquarium keeping hobby. It just creates a failure factor mentality that causes a hobbyist to drop out of the hobby. This hobby has a super high churn rate in the first place.

This makes sense - but how about an experienced hobbyist and a new tank. I think the key is the experience of the owner.