Fish Kill Off

[Crazieveggie]

got a fishing pole?

Actually... That's how I got the 2 triggers out in June when I realized they were not going to work. LOL.. Took of the barb and went fishing... !

 

[melypr1985]

Actually... That's how I got the 2 triggers out in June when I realized they were not going to work. LOL.. Took of the barb and went fishing... !

I say get to it. Of course you can always try trapping them. If you fish them out, see if you can get it on video!

 

[Crazieveggie]

I say get to it. Of course you can always try trapping them. If you fish them out, see if you can get it on video!

There is zero chance of catching 2 Flame wrasses without taking out all of the rock. They are skittish eaters anyway.

 

[melypr1985]

There is zero chance of catching 2 Flame wrasses without taking out all of the rock. They are skittish eaters anyway.

I wish I had proof of this, but I caught two flame wrasses by feeding, then standing back a little with a net ready. I waited for them to come up to eat and just scooped them out with the net. I was pretty shocked and squealed loud enough to have customers looking my way - they just didn't get it. But for the most part, yeah.... he'll probably have to take the rocks apart.

 

[Crazieveggie]

Is velvet the only thing this could be? Can Velvet come in on a coral and would it survive a Bayer dip?

 

[Brew12]

Is velvet the only thing this could be? Can Velvet come in on a coral and would it survive a Bayer dip?

Not sure if it is the only thing it could be, but I think it is the most likely.

Yes, velvet goes into a cyst type stage on any available hard surface where it is resistant to just about every treatment. It can stay that way for up to a few weeks before it releases its new batch of parasites.

 

[melypr1985]

Is velvet the only thing this could be? Can Velvet come in on a coral and would it survive a Bayer dip?

It could be a disease we know nothing about I suppose. It could be a combo of ick and velvet. Coral dips - even bayer- will not kill the tomont stage of ick or velvet that we know of. Not even copper can do that.

 

[Crazieveggie]

Thursday November 10th would be the last time I put corals in. Does that fit the time frame for Fish to start Dying on the 24th?

 

[Brew12]

Thursday November 10th would be the last time I put corals in. Does that fit the time frame for Fish to start Dying on the 24th?

The math would work. If you had a single velvet tomont on the coral it could complete it's lifecycle in 4 to 20 days by releasing an average of 200 daughters. You probably wouldn't notice that. However, if those 200 daughters each spawned 200 more around 7 days later you can see how rapidly this parasite can overwhelm a fish.

 

[melypr1985]

The math would work. If you had a single velvet tomont on the coral it could complete it's lifecycle in 4 to 20 days by releasing an average of 200 daughters. You probably wouldn't notice that. However, if those 200 daughters each spawned 200 more around 7 days later you can see how rapidly this parasite can overwhelm a fish.

I"m glad you can do the math! ^ +1

 

[Crazieveggie]

It could be a disease we know nothing about I suppose. It could be a combo of ick and velvet. Coral dips - even bayer- will not kill the tomont stage of ick or velvet that we know of. Not even copper can do that.

I forgot why I got out of this hobby in the first place...

I guess I need to QT Fish and corals...

 

[Brew12]

I forgot why I got out of this hobby in the first place...

I guess I need to QT Fish and corals...

This hobby can be very unforgiving. Sometimes we forget that death and disease run rampant in the oceans. Mammals tend to focus energy on fighting diseases and we have advanced immune systems. Fish have taken a different route. They rely on massive reproduction to make up for their higher mortality rate and weaker immune systems.

The most reliable way we can keep healthy fish is to provide them with as sterile a start as possible. Quarantining is the most effective way to do this. As a back up plan, we need to feed them as well as possible, and give them high quality water, so that if something does get through their immune systems have a chance.

I'm really sorry you are going through this. I hope you find enjoyment again once you make it through this rough patch!

 

[Leslie Tabor]

This is just a terrible situation! I don't really have any ideas being very new...I may NEVER leave my house longer than to go to work again. This is just a random thought and I apologize if anyone already mentioned it, would stray voltage from a pump, or something causing a jolt of electricity cause something like this? I worry about being electrocuted all the time, only reason I think of it! I am so sorry for your losses.

 

[Brew12]

This is just a terrible situation! I don't really have any ideas being very new...I may NEVER leave my house longer than to go to work again. This is just a random thought and I apologize if anyone already mentioned it, would stray voltage from a pump, or something causing a jolt of electricity cause something like this? I worry about being electrocuted all the time, only reason I think of it! I am so sorry for your losses.

Your fish are much less likely to be electrocuted than you are. Unless an electrical component releases toxins into the water the electricity will only have a minor impact on fish.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

They rely on massive reproduction to make up for their higher mortality rate and weaker immune systems.

as sterile a start as possible

i dis agree.
their immune systems are billions of years old. ours are only millions. they reproduce in larger numbers because they get eaten more because there is no apex predator in the ocean only on land. its a web in the seas. everything eats everything.

our precautions for disease are because we put them in a box and weaken them in trying domesticate them. its a sad truth.

Qt is partly conditioning to reduce stressors, thus the use of low light. meds insure few aggressive diseases enter our animals environment(dt) as the animals there dont have the wild immune system to withstand a wild parasite or disese.. same as us getting inoculated while traveling and why we cant eat some local foods.

for the OP, im so sorry for your loss. Ive lost a few and have never figured out why.

 

[melypr1985]

our precautions for disease are because we put them in a box and weaken them in trying domesticate them. its a sad truth.

True. In the wild these fish can leave an area that has a high concentration of ick, but in your tank they are stuck in a small box that quickly gets overrun. In the wild, a tang can get a few trophonts of velvet on him and swim for miles. they drop off the fish but he keeps swimming and they don't have the chance to reproduce and reattach to that particular fish.

 

[Brew12]

their immune systems are billions of years old. ours are only millions. they reproduce in larger numbers because they get eaten more because there is no apex predator in the ocean only on land. its a web in the seas. everything eats everything.

I would suggest reading this.
http://www.inmunologia.org/Upload/Articles/6/0/602.pdf

our precautions for disease are because we put them in a box and weaken them in trying domesticate them. its a sad truth.

I completely agree with this. Not only do we weaken them, but we basically trap them with parasites that would otherwise be flushed into the open ocean and starve in many cases.

 

[Crazieveggie]

This is just a terrible situation! I don't really have any ideas being very new...I may NEVER leave my house longer than to go to work again. This is just a random thought and I apologize if anyone already mentioned it, would stray voltage from a pump, or something causing a jolt of electricity cause something like this? I worry about being electrocuted all the time, only reason I think of it! I am so sorry for your losses.

I do have a grounding probe in the sump because I have always just done that. I did check with a volt meter and there is no stray voltage. That wasn't too random of a thought... It was one of my first ones.

 

[Brew12]

i dis agree.
their immune systems are billions of years old. ours are only millions. they reproduce in larger numbers because they get eaten more because there is no apex predator in the ocean only on land. its a web in the seas. everything eats everything.

our precautions for disease are because we put them in a box and weaken them in trying domesticate them. its a sad truth.

Qt is partly conditioning to reduce stressors, thus the use of low light. meds insure few aggressive diseases enter our animals environment(dt) as the animals there dont have the wild immune system to withstand a wild parasite or disese.. same as us getting inoculated while traveling and why we cant eat some local foods.

for the OP, im so sorry for your loss. Ive lost a few and have never figured out why.

Ooops... while I like that one, this one explains the trade off between immunity and reproduction over a wide variety of animals. Most of it went over my head.
http://icb.oxfordjournals.org/content/46/6/1060.full

 

[Joey waid]

I know it's been said, but velvet seems to be the answer.