fishless sps

Dennis Cartier · Apr 24, 2022

How is the fishless SPS tank going?

I am starting a daily dose of ammonium chloride into my tank, that has fish, to help with limited (0.2 ppm) nitrate. I have been noticing it is depressing my phosphate. I am trying to keep the phosphate up by feeding high phosphate foods. If that does not work, I may have to add an offsetting phosphate dose to my ammonium chloride dosing.

Earlier in the thread, you mentioned the premise that if a tank can grow algae, it can grow coral. Which make sense to me. I am wondering if anyone has tried to use a dedicated algae fertilizer like f2 for coral? I know it includes some B vitamins and all the nutrients that algae, typically phytoplankton, require. Might be an interesting experiment.

Also, your premise that nutrients processed the fish gut may be needed for successful coral growth. What about using a lot more tiny guts? Still feeding the tank, but under the objective of having the food processed by pods and CUC, bristleworms, etc. Ghost feeding is often recommended for keeping corals happy when running fallow, so I am wondering if that may not be a more direct approach to running fishless?

Anyway, looking forward to seeing how things are going.

Jon_W79 · Apr 25, 2022

Dennis Cartier said:
How is the fishless SPS tank going?

I am starting a daily dose of ammonium chloride into my tank, that has fish, to help with limited (0.2 ppm) nitrate. I have been noticing it is depressing my phosphate. I am trying to keep the phosphate up by feeding high phosphate foods. If that does not work, I may have to add an offsetting phosphate dose to my ammonium chloride dosing.

Earlier in the thread, you mentioned the premise that if a tank can grow algae, it can grow coral. Which make sense to me. I am wondering if anyone has tried to use a dedicated algae fertilizer like f2 for coral? I know it includes some B vitamins and all the nutrients that algae, typically phytoplankton, require. Might be an interesting experiment.

Also, your premise that nutrients processed the fish gut may be needed for successful coral growth. What about using a lot more tiny guts? Still feeding the tank, but under the objective of having the food processed by pods and CUC, bristleworms, etc. Ghost feeding is often recommended for keeping corals happy when running fallow, so I am wondering if that may not be a more direct approach to running fishless?

Anyway, looking forward to seeing how things are going.

It is doing ok. Nothing has died, or is dying. I think the Hyperberry stopped growing(at least significantly) a week or two ago probably because phosphate got to zero, and maybe also because the temperature was getting over 82 degrees, and maybe it could have used some more par than it was getting from the old radium bulb, and a not very good reflector. All corals except for maybe one have been getting decent or good polyp extention. I just switched to a Photon v2 , that will be a big improvement.

I think the f2 may be ok if you don't mind the nitrate(I would prefer not to add nitrate) and it doesn't add too much phosphate. I don't think ghost feeding works very well, and I don't think that it is likely that it can. I'm still feeling good about the Raindrops on Roses Mille. I think I will post coral pictures on Friday or Saturday, at a minimum I will give an update on the corals.

jdiefenbaugh · Apr 30, 2022

Dirk Petersen had hundreds of A. tenuis recruits in a fishless system, and had the best success with just feeding naups. Keep in mind, these were 1 mm in size when they settled out, and to 4 months. He still grows corals faster than anyone I've ever seen.

Jon_W79 · May 1, 2022

I think I might have started the led light at too low of a setting. It might take a while to get the amount of light I want. I think the corals look kind of dark for the amount of light they are getting, and the nitrate and phosphate level.

drawman · May 8, 2022

jdiefenbaugh said:
Dirk Petersen had hundreds of A. tenuis recruits in a fishless system, and had the best success with just feeding naups. Keep in mind, these were 1 mm in size when they settled out, and to 4 months. He still grows corals faster than anyone I've ever seen.

Do you have a link to this article? I would like to read it.

sculpin01 · May 8, 2022

It’s here:

(PDF) Influence of different food sources on the initial development of sexual recruits of reefbuilding corals in aquaculture

PDF | In coral aquaculture, sexual reproduction increasingly plays an important role for serving trade and reef restoration purposes. However, until... | Find, read and cite all the research you need on ResearchGate

www.researchgate.net

drawman · May 8, 2022

sculpin01 said:
It’s here:

(PDF) Influence of different food sources on the initial development of sexual recruits of reefbuilding corals in aquaculture

PDF | In coral aquaculture, sexual reproduction increasingly plays an important role for serving trade and reef restoration purposes. However, until... | Find, read and cite all the research you need on ResearchGate

www.researchgate.net

Thanks!

Jon_W79 · Jun 3, 2022

Here is 56 days of growth of the Ultimate Soli. I really need to take it off the frag rack. This coral doesn't need any fish to do good in captivity. This coral could use a six foot diameter or larger container, just for it.

Jon_W79 · Jun 4, 2022

jdiefenbaugh said:
Dirk Petersen had hundreds of A. tenuis recruits in a fishless system, and had the best success with just feeding naups. Keep in mind, these were 1 mm in size when they settled out, and to 4 months. He still grows corals faster than anyone I've ever seen.

I think he was also adding microalgae, I think that is a very important part of the reason the corals grew well. I believe microalgae is a good source of organic carbon. I think that many species of microalgae are great for at least most acropora(at least many species can consume them). I believe it has at least two benefits for acropora, one is that it gives the coral a beneficial type of organic carbon, and the other is that it helps grow bacteria for the coral to consume with the organic carbon it adds. I believe I had a phytoplankton bloom in my my fishless frag tank at least 6 weeks after adding the corals, it got to where I couldn't see more than a foot through the water, I was concerned about the corals, but after looking at them, I think they really liked it, they had really good polyp extention, or at least the best since I had got them.

jdiefenbaugh · Jun 21, 2022

Jon_W79 said:
I think he was also adding microalgae, I think that is a very important part of the reason the corals grew well. I believe microalgae is a good source of organic carbon. I think that many species of microalgae are great for at least most acropora(at least many species can consume them). I believe it has at least two benefits for acropora, one is that it gives the coral a beneficial type of organic carbon, and the other is that it helps grow bacteria for the coral to consume with the organic carbon it adds. I believe I had a phytoplankton bloom in my my fishless frag tank at least 6 weeks after adding the corals, it got to where I couldn't see more than a foot through the water, I was concerned about the corals, but after looking at them, I think they really liked it, they had really good polyp extention, or at least the best since I had got them.

Dirk was testing different systems with algae, but naups only were far and away the best food. Didn't get much benefit from the algae he was using. I worked with Dirk on A. palmata recruits briefly when I was with Secore, it was always naups and a yeast based food that were recommended.