Have you ditched LED's for T5's?

thewackyreefer · Jan 13, 2012

A little background to start...

I've got a 36" x 30" x 14" tank with 2 x AI SOL Blue's running over the top of them. My tank is primarily LPS (acans) and zoas/palys. I've got a few SPS but not too many. I've been running the AI SOL's for probably a year or so now and I'm still not getting the coloration out of my corals I was getting with my older MH + T5 fixtures.

Have any of you switched back to T5's from LED's? Would love to hear your experiences.

marclwheeler · Jan 13, 2012

reason you maybe struggling... IMO, is that AI aren't full spectrum... try out the Radions... easier to program and gives awesome coloration...

also, I think the AI weren't meant for complete replacem't of MH/T5 ... if you ran T5's along w/ them you would prolly get results you like...but all goes back to that full spectrum thingy...

good luck

P.S. let try not to give all LEDs a bad rap... cause not all LEDs are the same... if I didn't have the radions i prolly would have Luke's at Reef Filtration... stand up guy too... just even over the AIs

JackoChang · Jan 13, 2012

Did your acans turn orange too?

spero · Jan 13, 2012

I've had a 6 or so head acan grow 4 additional heads under led's. However, what was once a bring red and green acan, has turned into a lighter shade of red with orange spots of color (somewhat similar to what Jacko posted above). The light has dulled a couple corals, but the majority have retained their bright colorations.

The acan is still beautiful and I love the growth (as with all the corals in my tank). My tank runs 25 3watt Led's at 14k, 4 @456, and 2 @466. I've been looking for ways to add more of the 400ish spectrum, especially the lower half of the 400's. I believe the coloration will improve witht those additions.

FaviaFreak · Jan 13, 2012

I've heard of a few top notched guys that switched back to T5's from LED because they lost coloration in LPS especially chalices, the claim was T5 still gives them better coloration all around.

I know some SPS guys who love LED and claim they get great growth (incredible growth) but still lack the great coloration and pop they got with T5 and MH I dunno I am of the old school way of thinking (if it ain't broke don't fix it) although the functionality of LED's and programming possibilities with them are very intriguing

cdness · Jan 13, 2012

My latest build I have 2 feet lit with a Evo fixture and 4 feel lit by T-5. I am loving the color of the LED side so I am looking to dump the T-5s.

dnov99 · Jan 13, 2012

FaviaFreak said:
I've heard of a few top notched guys that switched back to T5's from LED because they lost coloration in LPS especially chalices, the claim was T5 still gives them better coloration all around.

I know some SPS guys who love LED and claim they get great growth (incredible growth) but still lack the great coloration and pop they got with T5 and MH I dunno I am of the old school way of thinking (if it ain't broke don't fix it) although the functionality of LED's and programming possibilities with them are very intriguing

I completely agree with the above. I had LED's on my frag tank for a year, and just switched back to a T5 fixture. The tank was mostly chalices and favia and I immediately saw a difference in coloration and health of all the LPS. Everything seemed "happier" and puffed out and more colors came out in the corals due to the better spectrum of the T5's.

On my DT I still have LED's and will keep them due to the energy savings and lack of heat from the lights. I can say that I have never had such growth and coloration in my SPS as I have with LED's, it has been amazing. Although I do supplement the lights with T5 fiji purple bulbs as the LED's just dont have that spectrum.

With my experience if you have a LPS dominant tank no need to switch to LEDs.

LILBUDDHA · Jan 13, 2012

FaviaFreak said:
I've heard of a few top notched guys that switched back to T5's from LED because they lost coloration in LPS especially chalices, the claim was T5 still gives them better coloration all around.

I know of some friends that got better coloration of chalices with leds . They seem to grow faster with them too . I am unsure of reds in a chalice . I am not a chalice fan .

I know some SPS guys who love LED and claim they get great growth (incredible growth) but still lack the great coloration and pop they got with T5 and MH I dunno I am of the old school way of thinking (if it ain't broke don't fix it) although the functionality of LED's and programming possibilities with them are very intriguing

IME
A transistion from mh to leds is a hard path to make .Sometimes it pays off and sometime it doesn't
The coloration issue is with any red corals .. Not a Setosa ... (it's not really red imho ). Usually a table like red planet ,red robin ..
The same applies to Acans some will go from red 2 orange .
Purple and blue SPS get good coloration with leds .
I went back and forth with leds . Anywho I still own a unit because if I sold it I would take a big hit on it #$$$
My new build has T5's . I think the best best would be a hybrid unit using t5 and led . To the above poster thinking of removing the t5's . I think that's a bad move . I have always wondered if it is the UV in MH and T5s that make SPS so awesome . Just a thought.. Leds from my understanding do not emit UV at all unless a special emitter is used . My old PACSUN had them and I had no issues with SPS of any color with that unit as long as I kept the SPS in close range of the unit .

gar732 · Jan 13, 2012

I had my frag tank lit by led and my display lt by T5. I had some corals including chalices color up like never before. I also had a few corals that would not color up like under T5s but for the most part my led expierence was positive. I believe a little of both is the best bet and that is exactly what I'm doing in my display. The biggest problem I've found with LEDs and lps is that the light is just too intense and tends to bleach or lighten them up unless you turn the LEDs down quite a bit but once you've found the happy medium the colors will be there.

kuyatwo · Jan 13, 2012

i switched back to a mh/t5 fixture sfiligoi xr6 400 watt radium and 4 x ati blue plus on my 150 gallon tank. When i ran 4 ai sol blue my acans turned orange and chalices lost color also. Sps also in particular ora cali tort, Jason Fox Paris Hilton, Purple Monster, tyree ultimate stag and Red planet they all lost their two tone coloring

BigAl07 · Jan 13, 2012

In the last issue (or one before that I can't remember) were several articles re: LED & coral health/coloration.

IMHO if you're running only a Blue fixture or a White fixture then you're missing a good portion of the picture. LEDs are narrow in spectrum which is why they are so intense with such low wattage. Instead of wasting watts producing light in a broad spectrum they produced more light in a narrow spectrum.

It's like you're putting 100gallons of gas in your gas tank of your car. Do you want that 100g to be a mixture of 87 octane, 89octane and 91octane or do you want it to be mostly 91octane? LED are narrow in spectrum where-as T5's and especially MH are very broad spectrum.

A well designed, built and operated LED will indeed give great coral growth and in many cases phenomenal coral coloration.

thewackyreefer · Jan 13, 2012

Great input guys! This is a lot of really good information here.

Someone asked if the problem was the acans turning orange and losing their "rainbow" earlier in the thread, yes, that is definitely the case. At this point I have probably 30+ different acans and probably half of them look exactly the same. It's pretty frustrating to lose the rainbow considering the price of some of them.

So now the question becomes T5's or 2 x Ecotech Radion fixtures? Will the Radion provide a more full spectrum with the additional colored LED's than the AI Sol Blue? Seems obvious but how does that compare to the spectrum you can get out of T5's?

gar732 · Jan 13, 2012

Before you spend big money on new fixtures, if I were you, I'd pick up a T5 retro kit and throw a couple of T5s on there with your AIs and turn the AIs down a bit. A retro kit can be found pretty inexpensively and might just solve your problem where as new fixtures might not though you won't know till you try.

BigAl07 · Jan 13, 2012

gar732 said:
Before you spend big money on new fixtures, if I were you, I'd pick up a T5 retro kit and throw a couple of T5s on there with your AIs and turn the AIs down a bit. A retro kit can be found pretty inexpensively and might just solve your problem where as new fixtures might not though you won't know till you try.

Very wise suggestion! Also don't be afraid to toss a "Specialty" bulb in the mix (KZ Fiji Purple for example). Chances are you may only be missing one narrow section with your current fixture and with just a slight "Tweaking" you might find the right combo. On the other hand adding T5's and such to the LED sort of defeats part of the reason many of us have gone to LED to begin with.

With all this being said.. I'm anxious to see how people with the new Radions report back on coral growth and coral coloration as a whole. I suspect it will be positive but like already mentioned you never know till you try.

Reef Breeders · Jan 13, 2012

So far so ggod with leds, its been almost 2 weeks, and coloration is improved a ton over mh. "spectrum" has nothing to do with it, it refers to the color of light, and has nothing to do with anything else. Leds come in almost any color you can imagine, so throw in some red/green if that is a concern. Anyways,you can get spectacular growth with a good fixture, and bad growht wiht a bad one. IMO, the only way to do it right is with diy, high quality leds.

KJAG · Jan 13, 2012

There's a local guy I buy almost all of my Zs and Ps from who runs LEDs. The coloring on his polyps are far superior to anything I've ever seen, including my tank w T5's(soon to be upgraded to LED),orders from online vendors with T5's or any polyps I've seen in LFS under halides. He doesn't keep SPS though, and to be honest all of the LED SPS tanks I've seen aren't as richly colored as t5 /MH.Could be due to lack of spectrum but I think most people simply run their LEDs too high. Just my opinion

impur · Jan 13, 2012

I switched back to T5 from LED a few months ago over my frag tank. SPS and zoas loved the LED, but ALL my LPS lost color, especially chalices. My OME chalice went from bright bright green to almost completely brown. about 1.5 months later under T5 and its almost back to the super bright green again.

I am looking to add a LED strip light to the tank though. As long as the colors don't fade, the blue LED sure makes corals pop.

Tab28 · Jan 13, 2012

I have several rainbow acans that have turned red/orange. I am running MH and T5. My LFS told me it was because I am giving them too much light. I koved them under a ledge and the purple gorgonian sways back and forth to create shifting shade. they are beginning to get some rainbow coloring back in the mouths but only time will tell if they will if the remaining portions will color back to rainbow. LED has come along way it seems every year they get better. I have read several articles on keepers who had several bulbs dies in the units after about 4 years. They replaced the bulbs and a few months later a few more die. Granted the quality has greatly improved from 4 years ago. But 4 years ago they thought it was perfect and only time will tell if the "Improved" new LED will stand the test. A LFS I buy from had a beautiful DT with LED's. The coral colors were great. They are now reserve that tank for softies and some new arrivals that the LED give the color that punch. They told me the are not sold on LED yet and their DT is now used for quick sell items they want to highlight for sale. All their high light corals lost the coloring and growth fell after about a year.

thewackyreefer · Jan 13, 2012

My Z's & P's also look pretty amazing under the LED's, I definitely cannot complain about the coloration of those. I'm not much of a chalice collector as like I said I collect mostly acans.

I do agree most people run their LED's far too bright, in my case I max out at 30%W/45%B/45%RB during the mid-day peak and 5%W/30%B/30%RB in the morning and evening. I have run them both higher and lower I have not noticed any difference in the coloration.

Shores805 said:
There's a local guy I buy almost all of my Zs and Ps from who runs LEDs. The coloring on his polyps are far superior to anything I've ever seen, including my tank w T5's(soon to be upgraded to LED),orders from online vendors with T5's or any polyps I've seen in LFS under halides. He doesn't keep SPS though, and to be honest all of the LED SPS tanks I've seen aren't as richly colored as t5 /MH.Could be due to lack of spectrum but I think most people simply run their LEDs too high. Just my opinion