Heaters — Finnex or BRS?

mike550 · Mar 8, 2021

Hello. I’m thinking of converting to a two heater system on my 120G. One controlled by an InkBird that is powered by an Apex. The other heater would be plugged in to the EB 832 directly and pretty much “always on” (like temp < 80)

I‘d appreciate any thoughts on Finnex vs BRS

capt.dave · Mar 8, 2021

I did something similar with 2 BRS heaters plugged into one of their controllers. That then goes into the Apex, which only turns off if temp gets above 80. That way the much cheaper BRS controller is turning on and off all the time, saving switch wear on the far more expensive EB 832. This is the setup Ryan recommended in several BRS Investigates episodes. I'm happy with the BRS heaters but I think the real benefit is the separate controller backed up by the Apex only in the event the water gets too warm. You could do that with either the BRS or Finnex controller.

Oh, one other thing Ryan harps on that I also learned the hard way. DO NOT put your heater in the return pump section of your sump. Someday, you'll run that low and expose the heater. Thankfully for me, it was a Finnex heater and the plastic shield around the heating element melted but the acrylic on the sump did not. I now have both heaters in the drain section and that should only run dry if the sump shatters and spills all over the floor...in which case I certainly won't care about the heaters!

Tiki Reef Joshua · Mar 8, 2021

Finnex by way of ranco. Unbeatable IMO.

mike550 · Mar 8, 2021

@capt.dave thanks for your thoughts. My goal is to have two heaters — both underpowered so that if either the controller or a heater fails I still have some heat but also can’t overheat the tank.

Heater #1 plugged directly into the Eb832 will be the “always on” one. But turn off at 80 or maybe something higher like 82

Heater #2 would be plugged into a controller, and this would be the one that turns on/off to keep the tank stable.

Is this overkill?

Daniel@R2R · Mar 8, 2021

I've got both Finnex and BRS heaters. They're both great products.

((FORDTECH)) · Mar 8, 2021

mike550 said:
@capt.dave thanks for your thoughts. My goal is to have two heaters — both underpowered so that if either the controller or a heater fails I still have some heat but also can’t overheat the tank.

Heater #1 plugged directly into the Eb832 will be the “always on” one. But turn off at 80 or maybe something higher like 82

Heater #2 would be plugged into a controller, and this would be the one that turns on/off to keep the tank stable.

Is this overkill?

Why have a heater always on ?

((FORDTECH)) · Mar 8, 2021

mike550 said:
@capt.dave thanks for your thoughts. My goal is to have two heaters — both underpowered so that if either the controller or a heater fails I still have some heat but also can’t overheat the tank.

Heater #1 plugged directly into the Eb832 will be the “always on” one. But turn off at 80 or maybe something higher like 82

Heater #2 would be plugged into a controller, and this would be the one that turns on/off to keep the tank stable.

Is this overkill?

I’m pretty sure a heater needs an off period or will fail very soon

mike550 · Mar 9, 2021

((FORDTECH)) said:
Why have a heater always on ?

If I have two heaters 300W each but my tank really needs 500W. Heater 1 plugged directly into the EB832 is On unless the temperature in the tank goes over 82. So basically alway on, and keeps from cycling the EB832. Heater 2 is controlled by an InkBird (or similar) and goes on/off for a target temp of 79. Same command on the EB832 that if the temp goes over 82 then off. Heater 2 is doing the actual temp control

((FORDTECH)) · Mar 9, 2021

mike550 said:
If I have two heaters 300W each but my tank really needs 500W. Heater 1 plugged directly into the EB832 is On unless the temperature in the tank goes over 82. So basically alway on, and keeps from cycling the EB832. Heater 2 is controlled by an InkBird (or similar) and goes on/off for a target temp of 79. Same command on the EB832 that if the temp goes over 82 then off. Heater 2 is doing the actual temp control

It if heat 1 runs for 6 months straight without turning off won’t it fail before then. They are not designed for 100% duty cycle. It’s not a return pump. I’ve never heard of anyone doing this but good luck

((FORDTECH)) · Mar 9, 2021

And FYI Ive run my heaters straight to my energy bars for 10 years now never had an issue still running that system and also have new apex with new 832 bar doing same thing 2 years. I do same thing with multiple energy bars and multiple heaters that turn on and off at different temps In case of failure. But would never leave one running. Have you ever felt the power cord of a heater that’s been running for hours? You can almost feel it very hot soft and melting. I use all finnex 300 and 500watt titanium heaters

KStatefan · Mar 9, 2021

((FORDTECH)) said:
It if heat 1 runs for 6 months straight without turning off won’t it fail before then. They are not designed for 100% duty cycle. It’s not a return pump. I’ve never heard of anyone doing this but good luck

What duty cycle are they designed for?

ksed · Mar 9, 2021

((FORDTECH)) said:
It if heat 1 runs for 6 months straight without turning off won’t it fail before then. They are not designed for 100% duty cycle. It’s not a return pump. I’ve never heard of anyone doing this but good luck

I’ve run Eheim heaters for two year always on the on position. The onl time they are off is when I unplug them from the walk socket.

RobB'z Reef · Mar 9, 2021

what wattage are you looking at?

RobB'z Reef · Mar 9, 2021

((FORDTECH)) said:
And FYI Ive run my heaters straight to my energy bars for 10 years now never had an issue still running that system and also have new apex with new 832 bar doing same thing 2 years. I do same thing with multiple energy bars and multiple heaters that turn on and off at different temps In case of failure. But would never leave one running. Have you ever felt the power cord of a heater that’s been running for hours? You can almost feel it very hot soft and melting. I use all finnex 300 and 500watt titanium heaters

I'm on board with running them from the Apex, I'm not buying that hype spread around that running them on your Apex is going to trash your outlet. Perhaps if you're running 600w+ heaters it may be a bit more on the wear and tear side but there are solutions for that. Working on running mine via the 24v ports to control a secondary relay as a test of theory. When running two, run them alternating 12hr shifts and you'll save wear on the heaters themselves I think.

DaddyFish · Mar 9, 2021

I'm going to saw open a modern titanium heater and dissect the circuitry. There's no reason a modern device should be using bimetallic contact strips anymore, not with the powerful triacs available today.
I find it hard to believe that in anything besides the most ancient design glass tube heaters that there's anything resembling mechanical contacts being used.

vetteguy53081 · Mar 9, 2021

Forever, I have used Finnex with confidence.

((FORDTECH)) · Mar 9, 2021

KStatefan said:
What duty cycle are they designed for?

I’m not sure but if you contact manufacture I’m sure they will tell you not to run a heater 24/7 and not think your gunna have problems

((FORDTECH)) · Mar 9, 2021

Rob.bucek said:
I'm on board with running them from the Apex, I'm not buying that hype spread around that running them on your Apex is going to trash your outlet. Perhaps if you're running 600w+ heaters it may be a bit more on the wear and tear side but there are solutions for that. Working on running mine via the 24v ports to control a secondary relay as a test of theory. When running two, run them alternating 12hr shifts and you'll save wear on the heaters themselves I think.

I 100% agree having them cycle on and off like normal will not damage apex energy bars.