Heavy Import, Heavy Export?

[J1a]

When I started my aquarium keeping journey, I learnt that heavy import, heavy export is the golden standard for nutrition management. To ensure we are all on the same page, this means that we feed generously for the corals and fishes, then apply nutrient export aggressively to keep the nitrate and phosphate level low.

While this has worked well for me, I started to have different thoughts since last year. When I was pouring away skimates, and pull out bundles of chaeto from reactor, I ask myself: why am I using expensive fish and coral food to grow algae and scum? At that point, I reflected an question this gold standard.

Now I subscribe to something different: efficient import, minimum export. This does not mean limit the feeding to the aquarium. Au contraire, this means providing large amount of easily digested and palatable food for the aquarium residents. It also mean striking an ecological balance so that there is assimilate at different trophic levels. And most of the food fed to the aquarium goes towards growing the livestock, instead of being poured into the drain.

What are your thoughts?

 

[blaxsun]

It's definitely worth consideration. I wouldn't say that I'm at the optimal efficient import/minimal export point yet, but I've definitely optimized my feeding and nitrates and phosphates.

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

Now I subscribe to something different: efficient import, minimum export. This does not mean limit the feeding to the aquarium. Au contraire, this means providing large amount of easily digested and palatable food for the aquarium residents. It also mean striking an ecological balance so that there is assimilate at different trophic levels. And most of the food fed to the aquarium goes towards growing the livestock, instead of being poured into the drain.

What are your thoughts?

I'd be interested to hear in what ways you have changed actual behaviors and feeding. What specifically have you done and noticed as results?

 

[J1a]

I guess it's not like we are going to arrive at optimal setup in one step. However, I do feel that starting to consider efficiency is a good step to take.

 

[J1a]

I'd be interested to hear in what ways you have changed actual behaviors and feeding. What specifically have you done and noticed as results?

The first thing I do is to start by picking good food. If my goal is efficiency, I need to ensure the fishes and corals eat as much as possible from what I feed, and digest and convert them to biomass.

I have started to pay more attention to the pellets I choose, and look at their ingredients to ensure most of those are of marine origin. As I use the pellet, I observe the growth in the fishes to get a good idea of assimilation. So far, the fauna Marin pellets do very well.

For coral food, I start to make my own freeze dried plankton mix. It's difficult to evaluate the effect on growth because there are just too many factors.

In terms of livestock, I keep a good population of corals and clams, which can make use of some of the waste product of fishes

I also run a automatic zeo reactor, to grow bacteria mass and rinse them out hourly for feeding.


Result wise, I do see good growth on my corals. The fishes grows quickly (my AT grew from 3" to 5.5" in 6 months). The nutrients remains low (2.5ppm NO3, 0.02ppm PO4), I get to pour out probably half a cup of dark skimmate every month.

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

The first thing I do is to start by picking good food. If my goal is efficiency, I need to ensure the fishes and corals eat as much as possible from what I feed, and digest and convert them to biomass.

I have started to pay more attention to the pellets I choose, and look at their ingredients to ensure most of those are of marine origin. As I use the pellet, I observe the growth in the fishes to get a good idea of assimilation. So far, the fauna Marin pellets do very well.

For coral food, I start to make my own freeze dried plankton mix. It's difficult to evaluate the effect on growth because there are just too many factors.

In terms of livestock, I keep a good population of corals and clams, which can make use of some of the waste product of fishes

I also run a automatic zeo reactor, to grow bacteria mass and rinse them out hourly for feeding.


Result wise, I do see good growth on my corals. The fishes grows quickly (my AT grew from 3" to 5.5" in 6 months). The nutrients remains low (2.5ppm NO3, 0.02ppm PO4), I get to pour out probably half a cup of dark skimmate every month.

Great info and I believe a good topic.

 

[Lavey29]

But it takes more then just heavy export to grow algae as you indicate in your first post. Good flow or lack there of and/or improper lighting all contribute to the algae fund not solely fish poop.

 

[J1a]

But it takes more then just heavy export to grow algae as you indicate in your first post. Good flow or lack there of and/or improper lighting all contribute to the algae fund not solely fish poop.

Oh. When I say algae, in this context I mean chaeto, or other macroalgae in the refugium.

Not the ugly algae in the tank.

 

[mdb_talon]

I dont at all disagree with your premise. Having said that I am still firmly in the more traditional heavy input/heavy export camp.

For me this is purely based off my belief that we dont necessarily know the "ideal" food for our wide variety of fish and corals....so i throw a lot of a wide variety of foods at them with the hopes they are getting what they need.

The second factor i must admit is just laziness. I can keep dumping food in and pulling cheato out and it been working great. Not sure i really want to put the effort into really evaluating the food(s) that work the best.

 

[J1a]

so i throw a lot of a wide variety of foods at them with the hopes they are getting what they need.

This is another tricky factor. Perhaps a variety of food is actually more harm than good? Many fishes/invert in the sea are so specialized to feed on a single food, so perhaps aquatic lifes don't value variety like we do.

I totally agree that there are so many things we don't know. At the same time, I also hope that we can start to know more. After all, that's how this hobby can progress.

 

[Lavey29]

Oh. When I say algae, in this context I mean chaeto, or other macroalgae in the refugium.

Not the ugly algae in the tank.

Cool, same still applicable.

 

[J1a]

Cool, same still applicable.

I just feel kind of sad when $$$ worth of fish and coral food turn in to chaeto.

 

[Lavey29]

I just feel kind of sad when $$$ worth of fish and coral food turn in to chaeto.

It's funny you say that. I was just thinking today if I could grow corals the way I grow chaeto I'd have the most beautiful reef tank.

 

[Lavey29]

Honestly though if this hobby was easy it wouldn't be as rewarding and fun in the end and we would all get bored with it probably.

 

[J1a]

It's funny you say that. I was just thinking today if I could grow corals the way I grow chaeto I'd have the most beautiful reef tank.

It was an epiphany moment for me when I realised that.

Before that, I was so proud of the chaeto and the dark brown cups of skimmate.

 

[Lavey29]

It was an epiphany moment for me when I realised that.

Before that, I was so proud of the chaeto and the dark brown cups of skimmate.

I still want a lot of fish poop though. My tank seems to have improved over the months with a full stock of fish now and good quality frozen food. I've cut out pellets and flakes.

 

[mdb_talon]

This is another tricky factor. Perhaps a variety of food is actually more harm than good? Many fishes/invert in the sea are so specialized to feed on a single food, so perhaps aquatic lifes don't value variety like we do.

I totally agree that there are so many things we don't know. At the same time, I also hope that we can start to know more. After all, that's how this hobby can progress.

Oh for sure. I dont disagree at all other than what i do now works really well and because of that reluctant to change. With some effort and close evaluation it is certainly possible i could find a way that works better and certainly respect your approach.

 

[damsels are not mean]

The heavy in heavy out thing is intuitive because that's what a reef is in the wild, but our tanks are not reefs, and we do not do what reefs do anyways. I agree with your method, and I think it's the way to go for a reef.

I am not even sure that corals need food, as I tried feeding corals reef chili for a while and didn't notice much change in how they looked or PE or growth. That really needs to be studied in a controlled environment and I suspect that the relatively high nutrient levels I run my tanks at make feeding redundant as I am not sure the corals need much more than fish poop and dissolved nutrients to get what they need to grow. In a low nutrient system I think feeding is useful. Otherwise I only feed LPS because it's fun.

I think if you feed a high quality flake or pellet food lightly and keep your tanks reasonably stocked, nutrients are really not a boogeyman. I overfeed a bit because I love all the activity I get to see on the rocks at feeding time (and for some reason one of my tangs really loves hunting amphipods) but I really don't think nutrient export needs to be aggressive if you follow the efficient import mindset. Ideally your nutrients go as much into your corals, ornamental algae, fishes, etc. as possible and not into your skimmer cup.

 

[J1a]

I am not even sure that corals need food, as I tried feeding corals reef chili for a while and didn't notice much change in how they looked or PE or growth. That really needs to be studied in a controlled environment and I suspect that the relatively high nutrient levels I run my tanks at make feeding redundant as I am not sure the corals need much more than fish poop and dissolved nutrients to get what they need to grow. In a low nutrient system I think feeding is useful. Otherwise I only feed LPS because it's fun.

This is another huge discussion, but an worthwhile one. Maybe we can make a poll later to see what happens in different aquarium.

I overfeed a bit because I love all the activity I get to see on the rocks at feeding time (and for some reason one of my tangs really loves hunting amphipods) but I really don't think nutrient export needs to be aggressive if you follow the efficient import mindset.

I do feed a lot as well. To me, that's the fun part of reefing. Looking at fishes wolf down the pellets is just... Worth it.

 

[EakTheFreak]

I personally enjoy heavy in/heavy out as well. I carbon dose so that I can feed heavier to my fish & corals. Feeding the fish and my bigger LPS pieces is something I enjoy. I also culture white worms and started that for my Copperband butterfly fish but all the fish love them.

My fish never get sick and my clowns lay eggs (Knock on wood). My corals grow at a solid pace and I would say I empty my skimmer once every 5 days.

Due to the Carbon dosing schedule my parameters stay as follows:

Salinity - 34.5 PPT
ALK - 9.0
Calcium - 450
Mag - 1400
Phosphate - .05
Nitrate - 5 ppm