Here we go TTM!

[Brew12]

Rev didn't link to his original thread but these fish have lived life in ich management conditions so the likelihood of velvet is minimal, but ich is very very likely. So this is preemptive so that he can keep more ornamental and difficult fish and keep parasites out of his beautiful new DT altogether. If these were new purchases treating for velvet would be imperative, IMO

I'm stalking Rev across the forum about this right now. I agree that TTM is fine for transferring the fish from his old DT to his new one. I'm just trying to use secret Jedi mind tricks to get him to treat newly purchased fish with copper.

 

[dactylo]

For me, the first attempt with cupramine was a disaster. I'm tempted to TTM before placing the fish in the DT. Theres no Ich symptoms on them now but I know it's there since I had to interrupt the copper before time.
I have had the fish for a few months now and they haven't showed any signs of velvet. Is velvet a silent infection like Ich or I shouldn't be worried with velvet at this point?

Edit: I just read 4FordFamily reply but I would still like a confirmation on this question.

 

[4FordFamily]

I'm stalking Rev across the forum about this right now. I agree that TTM is fine for transferring the fish from his old DT to his new one. I'm just trying to use secret Jedi mind tricks to get him to treat newly purchased fish with copper.

Yes this needs to happen I agree! The force is clearly with you, Jedi master.

 

[Humblefish]

I was thinking the same thing. Also allegedly the parasite can somehow "travel" 10 feet away per @Humblefish. I have no reason to doubt it, just an interesting thing to note!

You know I always have these studies on bookmark : http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0044848606001785

 

[Brew12]

For me, the first attempt with cupramine was a disaster. I'm tempted to TTM before placing the fish in the DT.
I have had the fish for a few months now and they haven't showed any signs of velvet. Is velvet a silent infection like Ich or I shouldn't be worried with velvet at this point?

Velvet is very much like a smaller version of marine ich, but with a faster life cycle. If you do TTM you really need to observe for a solid month after the last transfer and keep a close eye on the fish behavior before moving them out of QT. If your LFS uses low level of copper in their system, or the TTM itself, can keep velvet at low enough levels to not show symptoms for a few weeks.
It also seems like there is a strain of velvet going around right now that isn't showing much in the way of symptoms on fish with thicker slime coats. Scary times in the distribution system.

 

[4FordFamily]

For me, the first attempt with cupramine was a disaster. I'm tempted to TTM before placing the fish in the DT.
I have had the fish for a few months now and they haven't showed any signs of velvet. Is velvet a silent infection like Ich or I shouldn't be worried with velvet at this point?

Edit: I just read 4FordFamily reply but I would still like a confirmation on this question.

Velvet is running rampant in the hobby now, far worse than ever before, and is probably every bit as common as ich and several orders of magnitude more deadly.

If it doesn't show up in 4 weeks you're safe, IMO.

But all new fish should go through CP or Copper. I've brought somewhere between 100-150 fish through copper treatments over the past 3-4 years and it's not too difficult if copper is increased slowly and ammonia is kept absent as best as possible. Large water changes daily may be needed until it "cycles" but it can be done.

 

[4FordFamily]

Velvet is very much like a smaller version of marine ich, but with a faster life cycle. If you do TTM you really need to observe for a solid month after the last transfer and keep a close eye on the fish behavior before moving them out of QT. If your LFS uses low level of copper in their system, or the TTM itself, can keep velvet at low enough levels to not show symptoms for a few weeks.
It also seems like there is a strain of velvet going around right now that isn't showing much in the way of symptoms on fish with thicker slime coats. Scary times in the distribution system.

Yes and I might add it may not show symptoms even on tangs and angels in my case, other than swimming in to powerheads, cryptic behavior, hiding from light, blotchy color loss toward the end, loss of appetite, and heavy breathing. No spots at all, just gill decimation.

 

[Brew12]

not too difficult if copper is increased quickly

Don't you mean if copper is increased slowly? At least in cases where there are not visible symptoms of velvet?

Maybe some day there will be a fish supplier that will properly QT fish prior to sale and sell them for a premium.

 

[Triggreef]

Yes @revhtree ttm wool do nothing for velvet. When you get new fish from store, just ttm then use an observation tank for a couple weeks if your worried about velvet. 2 to 3 weeks and you should know if velvet in the system.

You can keep some type of media in your clean display tank, and use a hob filter with the media to keep ammonia from building when your observing.

 

[saltyhog]

TTM and velevet treatment don't have to be mutually exclusive. Start TTM and abort if any sign of velvet? I prefer to observe for 4-6 weeks after TTM.

I must be weird or I've done it so much I'm numb to it but I've never thought of TTM as a lot of work.....except getting up early before work to transfer. LOL.

 

[4FordFamily]

Don't you mean if copper is increased slowly? At least in cases where there are not visible symptoms of velvet?

Maybe some day there will be a fish supplier that will properly QT fish prior to sale and sell them for a premium.

Yes I mean slowly I'll fix in the original post!

 

[madcanary]

Are you saying the TTM didn't work?

From what I have read, TTM treats only Ich not Velvet. Madcanary, did you get Velvet during TTM?

Correct they got ICH then after 31 days in QT following the procedure for TTM and prazi on transfer 2 and 4 after 3 weeks in DT they got Velvet could have been Brooke's either way.
I will treat with cupramine from now on as much as I hate to.
I wonder if the velvet would have showed up during QT I'm no expert but the fish all died with a 2 day period had shallow rapid breathing and white dots with a powdery sheen to the whole body.
Who's knows maybe I didn't do something right.
I lost 5 tangs, a cleaner wrasse and royal Gramma in 2 days.
The rest of the fish are all happy and recovering in QT with 0.5ml of cupramine. Clowns and solarensis look great the sailfin has finally got his colour back and his fins look like crap. We are in day 4 of full strength cupramine dose.

 

[madcanary]

TTM and velevet treatment don't have to be mutually exclusive. Start TTM and abort if any sign of velvet? I prefer to observe for 4-6 weeks after TTM. QUOTE]

maybe I didn't allow enough time after TTM

 

[monkiboy]

For me, the first attempt with cupramine was a disaster. I'm tempted to TTM before placing the fish in the DT. Theres no Ich symptoms on them now but I know it's there since I had to interrupt the copper before time.
I have had the fish for a few months now and they haven't showed any signs of velvet. Is velvet a silent infection like Ich or I shouldn't be worried with velvet at this point?

it's unlikely the longer you go with observation with the fish being asymptomatic but possible a fish my have velvet and be asymptomatic. i have had an instance personally of it and have helped a few local reefers with tank nukes because of adding a non-prophlactically treated fish that appeared healthy in qt to their display.

It also seems like there is a strain of velvet going around right now that isn't showing much in the way of symptoms on fish with thicker slime coats. Scary times in the distribution system.

yes, prophylaxis is your reef tank's friend. have witnessed this with a couple fish myself.

Yes and I might add it may not show symptoms even on tangs and angels in my case, other than swimming in to powerheads, cryptic behavior, hiding from light, blotchy color loss toward the end, loss of appetite, and heavy breathing. No spots at all, just gill decimation.

sometimes not even that, unfortunately. it's unlikely but if i'm going to go through the effort to avoid putting my hard-earned dollars and pets in my tank at risk, then might as well go ahead and do the due diligence and be as sure as possible to avoid such a serious threat.

Maybe some day there will be a fish supplier that will properly QT fish prior to sale and sell them for a premium.

there are at least a couple excellent vendors that will run varying degrees of prophylaxis & quarantine for you on all fish they sell and ship nationally - tsm corals, pieces of the ocean, exotic reef creations, etc.

 

[WhiskeyCoffee]

What heater controller are you using?

 

[revhtree Verified Admin]

Finnex Titanium heaters.

Also I'll be transferring my fish this evening for the first time.

 

[Brew12]

Finnex Titanium heaters.

Also I'll be transferring my fish this evening for the first time.

Fantastic! Every transfer is one transfer closer!!!

 

[DLHDesign]

Also I'll be transferring my fish this evening for the first time.

Awesome! Are you keeping a log anywhere besides here? I found it helpful to set calendar reminders for my next TTM deadline so that I didn't miss the 72hr window. Happened once and I had to start all over from tank 1...

 

[revhtree Verified Admin]

Hey I transferred the fish over and noticed my regal has something going on with one side around the base of her body. These are the best photos I could take. Also what about the water that's left on the body of the fish when you transfer over? Surely it's impossible not to get some of the water from one tank into the other?

 

[DLHDesign]

Can say on the stuff on your fish. Does it look like a wound?

Surely it's impossible not to get some of the water from one tank into the other?

Some water is fine. The things you are looking to leave behind are attached to the solid surfaces in the tank, for the most part. The free-swimming things (if they exist) will be eliminated in the next tank. That's why it's 5 transfers - each transfer reduces the population lower and lower in conjunction with the lifecycle of the parasite.

The key is to clean the tanks really good (and give them time to dry) so that you kill all the parasites left attached to things.