High Nitrates!...What could be causing this?

Thraciandrummer · Mar 31, 2016

Hi all,
Last night I tested with a new Salifert Nitrate test kit and my Nitrates were at about 50PPM. I am trying to figure out what is causing this spike but I am not too sure what it could be. Here is the run down of equipment and livestock I currently have...

Equipment/filter media-
125 G 6 foot long tank with 36 G sump
Reef Octopus space saver skimmer rated for 300 gallons
two filter socks
carbon and GFO reactor
Refugium with baseball sized ball of Chaeto and 15 pounds of miracle mud
4 units of Chemi Pure elite
two Hydor Koralia Evolution powerheads rated for 1500 GPH each (one on each side of the tank)
3 Kessil A360s placed about 8 inches above the water.

Live Stock -
1 large Fox Face
1 medium Blue Tang
2 FireFish
1 Chromis
1 Coral Banded Shrimp
Squamosa Clam
3 Lobo heads
a few Acan heads
Several Zoa frags/colonies
120 lbs of live sand and rock

I feed pretty lightly. Everyday I feed 1/4 sheet of Sea Veggies to the tang and Foxface which they devour in seconds, then I feed a pinch of flake food and a small amount of PE Mysis and a 1/4 cube of forzen Spirulina. I watch the fish eat this and they seem to eat it all pretty quickly, so I don't believe that I am over feeding. I also have been Dosing Red Sea's coral nutrition program (4 ML of formula A and B daily) based on the recommendations on the package. The only other thing I feed is a Poland Spring cap full of Phytoplankton green water to the tank daily for the clam.

I am thinking that maybe the green water solution I am dosing to the tank for the clam is the reason for my Nitrate spike. The clam is over 4" so I am beginning to think that it doesn't need the green water to survive and that is what might be causing my issue. The clam is doing great, so I may turn down the dosing of the green water to once a week.

Few other details, my Chaeto does not seem to grow. I am lighting the fuge 6 hours a day from midnight to 6 AM, but the Chaeto is still the same size as when I bought it months ago. Some one had suggested get 3 or 4 mangroves for the fuge, so I might go get some of those this weekend.

If anyone can offer some advise on what I could do to lower the nitrates and what could be the cause of my nitrate spike, I'd appreciate it.

Water Parameters
Nitrates - 50PPM
Phosphates - 0
Calcium - 430PPM
Alk - 8.5 dkH
Magnesium - 1335
Salinity - 1.025
PH - 8.1
Temp 78

twilliard · Mar 31, 2016

Thraciandrummer said:
I am thinking that maybe the green water solution I am dosing to the tank for the clam is the reason for my Nitrate spike.

You may be absolutely correct on this

Randy Holmes-Farley · Mar 31, 2016

I agree that the green water is a contributor, along with foods. Reducing any of them should help, or increasing nitrate reduction.

FWIW, it doesn't really matter if the foods added are eaten or not. Most of the nitrogen and phosphate in them are still released to the water.

Thraciandrummer · Mar 31, 2016

I am going to stop the green water for now and lighten up my feedings even more. I will go get some mangroves this weekend and hopefully this will help. I want to try to figure out the cause of the problem to reduce the nitrates instead of putting reduction measures in place (other than water changes of course).

Randy Holmes-Farley · Mar 31, 2016

Thraciandrummer said:
I am going to stop the green water for now and lighten up my feedings even more. I will go get some mangroves this weekend and hopefully this will help. I want to try to figure out the cause of the problem to reduce the nitrates instead of putting reduction measures in place (other than water changes of course).

FWIW, mangroves can be nice, but they grow fairly slowly so are not a strong export method in most cases. Macroalgae and turf algae typically grow a lot faster, which is why people more often use those.

aabjones888 · Mar 31, 2016

I'd also try leaving your light over your cheato for 24 hrs a day. It Might help it grow and absorb more stuff and help keep your ph stable. As far as mangroves go, I think u need a whole forest for them to do any good, but they do look cool growing in your sump.

twilliard · Mar 31, 2016

With the lack of Po4 it may grow abnormally slow

Thraciandrummer · Mar 31, 2016

Ok so forget the mangroves then. maybe I'll get another baseball sized piece of Chaeto and increase the lighting over the fuge like aabjones888 said.

twilliard · Mar 31, 2016

My fuge is 24 hours
Po4 .014
No3 5ppm

Myka · Mar 31, 2016

I'd also like to point out that your powerheads are insufficient for your tank size and shape. The lack of flow is probably allowing food and detritus to settle in the tank.

You say this is a "spike". How long ago was the last time you tested the tank? What was the reading then? How old is the tank?

Thraciandrummer · Mar 31, 2016

I test usually monthly for the nitrogen cycle tests, but I was previously using an API test kit which was a mistake on my part. Those tests were reading Nitrates at 0. I picked up a salifert Nitrate kit which read 50PPM, so that is why I am concerned now. I was also wondering if it could be a flow problem. Can you suggest better power heads? Should I keep the two hydors and just add a third power head or ditch the Hydors completely and go with something else? I really like the Vortech MP40s but unfortunately I don't have the cash to blow $700 on power heads right now.

Randy Holmes-Farley · Mar 31, 2016

Thraciandrummer said:
I test usually monthly for the nitrogen cycle tests, but I was previously using an API test kit which was a mistake on my part. Those tests were reading Nitrates at 0. I picked up a salifert Nitrate kit which read 50PPM, so that is why I am concerned now. I was also wondering if it could be a flow problem. Can you suggest better power heads? Should I keep the two hydors and just add a third power head or ditch the Hydors completely and go with something else? I really like the Vortech MP40s but unfortunately I don't have the cash to blow $700 on power heads right now.

Increased flow may help det more detritus to a skimmer before it degrades, and it may increase denitrification a bit by forcing more water slowly through rock and sand pores, but flow isn't generally the first thing to look at for more nitrate export, IMO.

twilliard · Mar 31, 2016

Randy Holmes-Farley said:
Increased flow may help det more detritus to a skimmer before it degrades, and it may increase denitrification a bit by forcing more water slowly through rock and sand pores, but flow isn't generally the first thing to look at for more nitrate export, IMO.

Hi Randy sorry for an off topic post (unable to message ) can I ask you if I am headed in the right direction with a bachelor of Science focusing on micro biology?
I want to study micro organisms which I know skimmers pull out.

Bruce Burnett · Mar 31, 2016

I would stop the Red Sea energy for a week and retest. Also how soon after you used it did you test. I am using all in one bio pellets and I actually had to increase my feedings. But I also found if I dosed the red sea full amount 3 days in a row my nitrates and phosphate went up but then 3 days later they were down.

Myka · Apr 1, 2016

Randy Holmes-Farley said:
Increased flow may help det more detritus to a skimmer before it degrades, and it may increase denitrification a bit by forcing more water slowly through rock and sand pores, but flow isn't generally the first thing to look at for more nitrate export, IMO.

Me neither, but you guys covered everything else.

Thraciandrummer said:
Should I keep the two hydors and just add a third power head or ditch the Hydors completely and go with something else?

I'd just add a third one.

Thraciandrummer · Apr 1, 2016

Nitrates were up before I started the Red Sea program and since I don't have many corals I was only doing 2 ml of each per day. I think my problem is the green water though which I stopped using as of yesterday. What biopellet reactor do you use? I think I might pick one up?

Randy Holmes-Farley · Apr 1, 2016

twilliard said:
Hi Randy sorry for an off topic post (unable to message ) can I ask you if I am headed in the right direction with a bachelor of Science focusing on micro biology?
I want to study micro organisms which I know skimmers pull out.

That sounds like a great way to learn to examine and understand such organisms, yes!

twilliard · Apr 1, 2016

Randy Holmes-Farley said:
That sounds like a great way to learn to examine and understand such organisms, yes!

Thank you randy for your input!

Myka · Apr 1, 2016

Thraciandrummer said:
Nitrates were up before I started the Red Sea program and since I don't have many corals I was only doing 2 ml of each per day. I think my problem is the green water though which I stopped using as of yesterday. What biopellet reactor do you use? I think I might pick one up?

Since you don't have many corals in there, why don't you just stop dosing everything? The purpose of the Red Sea products is to replace elements that are used up by the corals. Go back to the basics, and get the tank clean again.

Bruce Burnett · Apr 1, 2016

Thraciandrummer said:
Nitrates were up before I started the Red Sea program and since I don't have many corals I was only doing 2 ml of each per day. I think my problem is the green water though which I stopped using as of yesterday. What biopellet reactor do you use? I think I might pick one up?

Myka said:
Since you don't have many corals in there, why don't you just stop dosing everything? The purpose of the Red Sea products is to replace elements that are used up by the corals. Go back to the basics, and get the tank clean again.

I agree not a lot of live stock in general, reduce the input all all additives including food. Might also try another set of reagents or test kit. Could start dosing vinegar, it is cheap and easy Randy has a whole article on it. Pellets and a good reactor is a lot more money to start and it is not the only way. I like to leave for a couple weeks at a time. If you are adding kalk to your top you can add vinegar to the top off mix but don't make but a day or two worth at a time or you will have bacteria growing in the top off water. A gallon of pure white vinegar from the grocery store is cheaper than dosing vodka. But my reactor is a Reefs Dynamics but they are now out of business.