I’m considering an APEX

[Miami Reef]

Here are the reasons I’m considering an APEX:

I can connect BRS 1.1mL dosing pumps to dose throughout the day for my sodium hydroxide.

I can get alerts when temp/salinity start to climb out of range.

I’m sure there are other uses, but my main purpose of having an APEX is to dose and to have more security for my tank.

How does an apex alert you if a power outage happens? I live in a place where hurricanes happen almost yearly and not having my generator come on gives me a lot of worry. If I can get an alert when a certain equipment isn’t working that would be worth it in and of itself.


If you told me a few months ago that I would be considering an APEX, I would have laughed.

 

[homer1475]

Heartbeat function.

Basically if the head unit doesn't communicate with neptunes servers, you get an alert.

 

[mich2599]

Here are the reasons I’m considering an APEX:

I can connect BRS 1.1mL dosing pumps to dose throughout the day for my sodium hydroxide.

I can get alerts when temp/salinity start to climb out of range.

I’m sure there are other uses, but my main purpose of having an APEX is to dose and to have more security for my tank.

How does an apex alert you if a power outage happens? I live in a place where hurricanes happen almost yearly and not having my generator come on gives me a lot of worry. If I can get an alert when a certain equipment isn’t working that would be worth it in and of itself.


If you told me a few months ago that I would be considering an APEX, I would have laughed.

I was the same. I said i would never get one, and now that I have one ilove it!!! You can set-up an alarm letting you know when the "heartbeat" of the apex disconnects from the wifi either bc of power issues or wifi gone bad. Good way to protect a reef tank.

 

[mich2599]

Furthermore, you can set up individual power alarms to tell you when your return pump or heater is using too much electricity. Give you a heads up when something is about to fail or has failed.

 

[HuduVudu]

@Miami Reef automation seems like a good idea until you implement it.

If you design for automation then you need to account for failures. Input devices drift and fail. How will your system handle that. Equipment especially dosers drift and fail. How will your system handle that.

It isn't an issue with any particular brand it is a situation with automation. Be VERY careful in designing these systems, they are not as straight forward as they seem.

 

[Macdaddynick1]

Great choice. Automation is almost necessary at some point. Some people choose to have a little automation some choose to have a lot. Apex is really there to save your tank when things go really wrong without you noticing. It also creates a lot of QOL improvements for you and your tank. Plus it serves as a fairly reliable doser and/or carx controller.

 

[Yates273]

I have to say I was in the same boat as you. I thought it was crazy to spend that kind of money on an Apex. Fast forward a couple years and I ended up buying one along with every other module for it. I also use it for Shutting everything down at the press of a button to feed tank. I absolutely love having the automation as well as water testing right at my fingertips. Yes there were some bumps in the road but everything was easy to correct. I absolutely love my Apex knowing I can always monitor my system when I’m not around especially when I’m on vacation.
Take a look at Suncrestreef’s tutorial. He has a complete write up of everything Apex that is very useful

 

[aurora.k]

I love mine and definitely have peace of mind with all the alerts.

 

[Miami Reef]

@Miami Reef automation seems like a good idea until you implement it.

If you design for automation then you need to account for failures. Input devices drift and fail. How will your system handle that. Equipment especially dosers drift and fail. How will your system handle that.

It isn't an issue with any particular brand it is a situation with automation. Be VERY careful in designing these systems, they are not as straight forward as they seem.

Can you please elaborate this more? Are you trying to say don’t put all your eggs in one basket with the APEX? I like to keep things very simple. I’m not passionate about technology or creating systems. My passion is in keeping the tank. The APEX will be used as a tool, not as a way to make me further from the tank.

 

[HuduVudu]

Can you please elaborate this more? Are you trying to say don’t put all your eggs in one basket with the APEX? I like to keep things very simple. I’m not passionate about technology or creating systems. My passion is in keeping the tank. The APEX will be used as a tool, not as a way to make me further from the tank.

I am not speaking to APEX at all. All controllers will have this problem. APEX has it's pros and cons but my point isn't about APEX, it is about automation. That said one of the things I found to be frustrating with Neptune is once you enter their universe escaping is very difficult.

Examples to illustrate. Say you set up your doser to dose to a chemical until a certain condition is reached. Seems straight forward enough and with the APEX this will be easy to do. This is one good thing about APEX. The problem(s) is this, what if the thing that you are measuring the feedback with drifts or fails outright and provides either an inaccurate or a completely erroneous number. pH probes are notoriously innaccurate. They drift they fail. If the numbers that the failing probe (whatever it is) get into your equation then your controller will dutifully carry out the exact instructions you provided. Computers are dumb they do exactly what you tell them to do. They do not care that you just dumped 2 liters of calcium chloride in your tank. They where just following orders. Also let's say you get the probes down and they tell the doser to dose a particular amount. If the doser comes out of calibration instead of dosing 1ml/hour now you are dosing 10ml/hour. Ooops. Sometimes even the the controller tell the equipment to do something and the equipment either doesn't get the start command or the stop command. This isn't as common a problem, but when it happens like all of the other issues if you haven't planned for this the results are catastrophic.

ATO's illustrate this problem perfectly.

Many people think ooohhh I will just add more redundency. This is fine but remember every path that will control is prone to failure. It also has a cost wether monetarily or through system resources.

KISS is an engineering term for THIS very reason. A good engineer doesn't design kewl systems a good engineer designs systems that are fault tolerant.

Keep this in mind when you make the trade offs between doing something manually or automating the process.

I am not trying to scare you away from automation quite the contrary. I am trying to help you build a safe foundation so that I don't see posts from you asking how to deal with after effects of this failure. It is usually catastrophic for the creatures and the their caretaker.

 

[PeterC99]

Go get your Apex!

The functionality, redundancy, and configurability make it well worth it!

 

[Sean Clark]

I use my Apex for the ability to remotely monitor things. Nothing that is life critical is controlled by it though. If my Apex dies my reef will not be effected. Controllers are great but I do ensure that it cannot crash anything.

 

[Lbrdsoxfan]

I use my Apex for the ability to remotely monitor things. Nothing that is life critical is controlled by it though. If my Apex dies my reef will not be effected. Controllers are great but I do ensure that it cannot crash anything.

This. I can substitute a wifi powerstrip in the apex's place and it will do 99% of what a apex does. I run a apex classic because I don't want to be overtly invested in one brands ecosystem and at this point, I don't plan to be either. I do like the fact that I was able to integrate my roller filter and ato. If either failed, back to socks and I have a simple float switch ato system as a backup.

 

[InactiveAcct]

It’s a good move. I built a reefpi that only monitors ph and temp and it’s avoided a few near disasters over the course of a year.

Most recent being that I didn’t realize I’d blocked overflows after I did some maintenance, got a notification that temp / ph were whacky values, went to check and sure enough sump was almost empty and water was about to spill over the top of the tank.
From looking at ph records you can even tell what days you were away/ home/ windows open/ guests over. Pretty interesting.

 

[Rmckoy]

I’ve put a lot of thought into it over the years and can’t make myself believe it’s going to make my reefing experience any better .
With my current system , equipment nothing is compatible

 

[Sean Clark]

How does an apex alert you if a power outage happens?

There are two options for this that I am aware of.
The first is the Heartbeat. This will have about a 30 min delay before notification though. This will still notify you on your phone if properly configured even if your home internet goes out.

The second way is to use the Apex head unit power monitor.
This uses a power adapter that is plugged into a power source that is not on any kind of backup power.
When the Apex senses that the power supply to this outlet is lost, it will trigger a state from normal "Power Apex On" to "Power Apex Off". You can use this condition in programing to use this power state to control anything just like a switch.

 

[Miami Reef]

I’m trying to get the BRS dosing pumps but it says this

“When used with controllers like the Apex, we recommend connecting these to a mechanical relay outlet, and not a TRIAC outlet on the controller's power bar.”

Can someone elaborate what exactly they want me to do? Does the APEX come with these mechanical outlets? If not, do I buy abs plug the mechanical outlet directly into the apex and then plug the dosing pumps into that special outlet?

 

[Sean Clark]

This surprises me for such a low power tool such as the BRS doser. I believe the EB4 is still available and has all relay outlets. I also believe that there are plenty of people out there running BRS doses on EB832s without issue.
Hopefully someone else with a more definitive answer will chime in.

 

[HuduVudu]

@Miami Reef plug the doser into the 120 volt outlets is what that is saying.

EDIT: There are two ways to switch ... TRIAC (transitor) and relay. I thought all of the outlets were relay. Let me look and see if I can find which are which.

 

[HuduVudu]

@Miami Reef & @Sean Clark

Neptune EB8 Energy Bar - I have two outlets stuck in the ON position

I have a Neptune EB8 Energy Bar (that are probably 8-10yrs old) where outlet #s 2 & 3 are stuck in the ON position. Meaning any attempt to control them by turning them OFF via Apex, fails. They just stay ON if the slider in Apex is slid to OFF Easy fix? I scoured YouTube for a DIY vid and...

www.reef2reef.com

Outputs 1-3 and 5-7 are solid-state, while Ouputs 4 and 8 are relay controlled.

Plug your dosers into 4 or 8.