I Was Wrong

[Lavey29]

Yeah, I saw that the other day. Owning an EV today isn't the same as a gas/diesel, and it takes a different mindset/commitment than most people are used to. Shortages of charging infrastructure and issues with charging stations are fairly typical.

My son in law gets a free Tesla to use from his employer. He hates the thing. 300 mile range is actually 190 mile range if you run the AC and drive 70 on the freeway. Then a 45 minute wait to charge. People all think that charging is free or much less then gas too but then the sheep get a big sticker shock. I was at Mercedes a few months back and they were really pushing the EVs on me and I thought they were about as ugly as could be with styling. BMW way ahead with EV styling in my opinion but these cars will only work within certain limitations of use. My BMW is a gas electric hybrid and has a true 400 range. I think cars like this should really be the bridge between gas and EV until the technology and infrastructure for EV improves. This will take decades so wont really matter right because all the scientists like AOC said doomsday in a few years right? they said it in the 60s, 70s, 80s,90s,etc.... follow the money

 

[blaxsun]

My son in law gets a free Tesla to use from his employer. He hates the thing. 300 mile range is actually 190 mile range if you run the AC and drive 70 on the freeway. Then a 45 minute wait to charge. People all think that charging is free or much less then gas too but then the sheep get a big sticker shock. I was at Mercedes a few months back and they were really pushing the EVs on me and I thought they were about as ugly as could be with styling. BMW way ahead with EV styling in my opinion but these cars will only work within certain limitations of use. My BMW is a gas electric hybrid and has a true 400 range. I think cars like this should really be the bridge between gas and EV until the technology and infrastructure for EV improves. This will take decades so wont really matter right because all the scientists like AOC said doomsday in a few years right? they said it in the 60s, 70s, 80s,90s,etc.... follow the money

Teslas are great... if you don't mind the basic styling, long repair times and being gouged at the Tesla Superchargers. I have a 2022 BMW i4 and I get great range (500km+ in the summer) - but I also have a heated garage and L2 charger - and the bulk of my driving is in-city. We have a gas vehicle for long trips.

 

[Kato]

My son in law gets a free Tesla to use from his employer. He hates the thing. 300 mile range is actually 190 mile range if you run the AC and drive 70 on the freeway. Then a 45 minute wait to charge. People all think that charging is free or much less then gas too but then the sheep get a big sticker shock. I was at Mercedes a few months back and they were really pushing the EVs on me and I thought they were about as ugly as could be with styling. BMW way ahead with EV styling in my opinion but these cars will only work within certain limitations of use. My BMW is a gas electric hybrid and has a true 400 range. I think cars like this should really be the bridge between gas and EV until the technology and infrastructure for EV improves. This will take decades so wont really matter right because all the scientists like AOC said doomsday in a few years right? they said it in the 60s, 70s, 80s,90s,etc.... follow the money

How long is his commute? If long, I think he should just have a diesel.
No need to optimize or argue about the 1%. Vast majority of people don't drive 200 miles per day. As mentioned earlier in this thread, trying to reduce fossil fuels is not all or nothing. The shipping industry is just now heavily investing in removing the need for diesel

Personally I haven't been to a gas station in 8 years. It's kind of weird. Except, at least in Europe, many gas stations now have very fast chargers as well (the 10 min for 200km ones, 300KW). They even list the daily price of gas, diesel and KWh side by side.

Most people that don't have an EV forget that you have a 'gas station' at home. So your tank is full every morning. Most work places here now offer charging as you sit in your office all day and they give you the power for free (like giving you other benefits at work)

Like it or not, there will be no new fossil cars sold in 10 years. None in Norway in what, 2 years. Where I am its 5'ish IIRC.

PS: I was in california the other day and got a ride in the Rivian truck. First time I ever considered bying a truck...it likely won't fit in my small EU garage lol. May have one shipped over

 

[blaxsun]

How long is his commute? If long, I think he should just have a diesel.
No need to optimize or argue about the 1%. Vast majority of people don't drive 200 miles per day. As mentioned earlier in this thread, trying to reduce fossil fuels is not all or nothing.

Personally I haven't been to a gas station in 8 years. It's kind of weird. Except, at least in Europe, many gas stations now have very fast chargers as well (the 10 min for 200km ones, 300KW). They even list the daily price of gas, diesel and KWh side by side.

Like it or not, there will be no new fossil cars sold in 10 years. None in Norway in what, 2 years. Where I am its 5'ish IIRC.

Canada has set a target of 2035 for the end of the sale of gas/diesel-powered vehicles. No one believes this is even remotely possible (including the government "experts"). The lack of infrastructure is one thing, but the limited range 4 months out of the year makes this impractical for most people. And this is before we start talking about the 1-year wait and $60,000+ price tag for an EV... (hybrids are currently a 2-year wait).

If this ends up going through it will kill the automotive industry in Canada and jack the price of used gas/diesel vehicles through the roof. Should be interesting to see how onboard everyone is with the "green" initiatives then...

 

[Doctorgori]

Canada has set a target of 2035 for the end of the sale of gas/diesel-powered vehicles. No one believes this is even remotely possible (including the government "experts"). The lack of infrastructure is one thing, but the limited range 4 months out of the year makes this impractical for most people. And this is before we start talking about the 1-year wait and $60,000+ price tag for an EV... (hybrids are currently a 2-year wait).

If this ends up going through it will kill the automotive industry in Canada and jack the price of used gas/diesel vehicles through the roof. Should be interesting to see how onboard everyone is with the "green" initiatives then...

Not sure whats on the horizon but I thought the limiting factor is the stuff needed to make batteries in the 1st place

 

[fish farmer]

Canada has set a target of 2035 for the end of the sale of gas/diesel-powered vehicles. No one believes this is even remotely possible (including the government "experts"). The lack of infrastructure is one thing, but the limited range 4 months out of the year makes this impractical for most people. And this is before we start talking about the 1-year wait and $60,000+ price tag for an EV... (hybrids are currently a 2-year wait).

If this ends up going through it will kill the automotive industry in Canada and jack the price of used gas/diesel vehicles through the roof. Should be interesting to see how onboard everyone is with the "green" initiatives then...

I think Vermont has similar initiatives with green vehicles sales. My stealership was pushing a Prius on us when were at the end of our Corolla lease. It was spendy, don't remember the model but it had a sizable rear area. Looked like a video game console when I got in it. I hated it....but I also hated the look of the new Corolla as well.

I'm biased with all newer vehicles anyway, gas or other. Too many sensors, safety features, convenience features. I just need a base model 6 cylinder powered vehicle that doesn't start rusting in eight years that I can use to camp and fish with.... that's why I drive a van...

 

[Iamnotyourtrigger]

You're back to that. It's not '3 trillion cubic tons'; it's not a drop of pee. It's 421 ppm.

First off; your math is wrong and not even using the correct units.

Second; nobody is arguing about how much 0.04% of the atmosphere is. Yes, we know it's a very small percentage of the atmosphere. Yes, we know adding another 0.04% doesn't feel like it will have an impact. But it does. I honestly don't know how someone can run a reef tank and not understand this. If you really think 400 ppm is so dilute as to not matter lets go ahead and add ONE PPM of something to your reef tank. Why don't we try copper? It will only take 15 drops in a 200 gallon tank to reach 1ppm. But it's so dilute it won't do anything, right? After everything dies, imagine adding 6,000 more drops. That's still only 400 ppm, less than the co2 content of the atmosphere. For goodness sake we measure phosphate and ammonia and a dozen other things in concentrations less than a single ppm and panic.

And if you insist on sticking with the disgusting comparison, that's 6,000 drops of pee in a single 200 gallon tank. You have the tools to measure this in your kitchen - it's 1 and a quarter cups of pee. In a single tank.

So just how much co2 is in the atmosphere? Each ppm represents 7.82 gigatonnes; and as of 2022 the concentration was 421 ppm. That's 3,292 gigatonnes. And a third of that has been added since the mid 1800s alone.




This is propaganda from the corporations doing the polluting. They want you to feel guilty so that you blame yourself instead of them. Remember shows like Captain Planet?

You made a pertinent, relevant, and logical case. Obviously, people are going to ignore this.

 

[Kato]

I'm biased with all newer vehicles anyway, gas or other. Too many sensors, safety features, convenience features. I just need a base model 6 cylinder powered vehicle that doesn't start rusting in eight years that I can use to camp and fish with.... that's why I drive a van...

I think the camping industry will be revolutionized when batteries and solar get even better. With that much power perhaps a starlink and you have everything you need. Perhaps power a tank some day.

 

[Lavey29]

Teslas are great... if you don't mind the basic styling, long repair times and being gouged at the Tesla Superchargers. I have a 2022 BMW i4 and I get great range (500km+ in the summer) - but I also have a heated garage and L2 charger - and the bulk of my driving is in-city. We have a gas vehicle for long trips.

Yea the BMW I class is nice. I considered one a few months back but the amount of driving and lack of infrastructure just did not support the idea. Ended up with an X5 but I have to admit I like it much better then the previous Mercedes AMG.

 

[Lavey29]

Canada has set a target of 2035 for the end of the sale of gas/diesel-powered vehicles. No one believes this is even remotely possible (including the government "experts"). The lack of infrastructure is one thing, but the limited range 4 months out of the year makes this impractical for most people. And this is before we start talking about the 1-year wait and $60,000+ price tag for an EV... (hybrids are currently a 2-year wait).

If this ends up going through it will kill the automotive industry in Canada and jack the price of used gas/diesel vehicles through the roof. Should be interesting to see how onboard everyone is with the "green" initiatives then...

California has the same target date.

 

[Lavey29]

How long is his commute? If long, I think he should just have a diesel.
No need to optimize or argue about the 1%. Vast majority of people don't drive 200 miles per day. As mentioned earlier in this thread, trying to reduce fossil fuels is not all or nothing. The shipping industry is just now heavily investing in removing the need for diesel

Personally I haven't been to a gas station in 8 years. It's kind of weird. Except, at least in Europe, many gas stations now have very fast chargers as well (the 10 min for 200km ones, 300KW). They even list the daily price of gas, diesel and KWh side by side.

Most people that don't have an EV forget that you have a 'gas station' at home. So your tank is full every morning. Most work places here now offer charging as you sit in your office all day and they give you the power for free (like giving you other benefits at work)

Like it or not, there will be no new fossil cars sold in 10 years. None in Norway in what, 2 years. Where I am its 5'ish IIRC.

PS: I was in california the other day and got a ride in the Rivian truck. First time I ever considered bying a truck...it likely won't fit in my small EU garage lol. May have one shipped over

For short commutes EV is fine as long as you can charge at home. The technology and infrastructure just is not ready to fast track the transition. There are so many variables other then just cars involved. Lets not forget who controls the lithium also (remember follow the money). If I had short commutes and home charging, I would have no problem with a BMW EV as long as I had a gas guzzler for long trips.

My son in law probably drives at least 120 miles each day in his Tesla to work and back. So many things reduce his range to and the the EV manufacturers fail to mention these unless you read the small print I guess.

 

[Kato]

Yea the BMW I class is nice. I considered one a few months back but the amount of driving and lack of infrastructure just did not support the idea. Ended up with an X5 but I have to admit I like it much better then the previous Mercedes AMG.

BMW can charge at Tesla superchargers now right? At least here all CCS plugs are allowed at superchargers.

 

[fish farmer]

I think the camping industry will be revolutionized when batteries and solar get even better. With that much power perhaps a starlink and you have everything you need. Perhaps power a tank some day.

Have you priced a new camper van recently? They are more than my house....which is $107,000....but could sell for more.

I don't need all the bells and whistles. Heck I've lived without 4 wheel drive for about 10 years. It's just another component that can fail and cost money to replace.

 

[Doctorgori]

I’m not sure I’d want to travel cross country on a EV. Perhaps in the near future they will have a “fast charge” …for now I’m a lil hesitant..

 

[Lavey29]

BMW can charge at Tesla superchargers now right? At least here all CCS plugs are allowed at superchargers.

No Sure and the only superchargers I care about are the ones in my boats. Wonder if anyone has even considered how EV is going to impact the recreational boating industry. C'mon sheep wake up....

 

[fish farmer]

I’m not sure I’d want to travel cross country on a EV. Perhaps in the near future they will have a “fast charge” …for now I’m a lil hesitant..

That's where I sit too. Drove to Florida last year and Tennessee this year. Other far trips are just over 200 miles and they are trips where using public transportation would be challenging.

 

[Kato]

Have you priced a new camper van recently? They are more than my house....which is $107,000....but could sell for more.

I don't need all the bells and whistles. Heck I've lived without 4 wheel drive for about 10 years. It's just another component that can fail and cost money to replace.

You're right. It is insane. And I did...then my screen broke in two when the number came up

 

[Doctorgori]

That's where I sit too. Drove to Florida last year and Tennessee this year. Other far trips are just over 200 miles and they are trips where using public transportation would be challenging.

The visual of being pulled over and out of juice is a lil disconcerting … I mean do you hold up a sign “out of juice’ and will AAA be able to service you in a timely fashion if at all?
OTOH, filling the car up using solar panels is appealing

 

[Court_Appointed_Hypeman]

On the EV discussion taking place here.

Tesla's are honestly crap compared to other EVs My work is installing an EV charger in my space, and i have gotten to test a few, my boss specifically wanted me to go with tesla, and I don't like em, most of that is personal preference but range and chargetimes were significantly worse.

If tesla is the baseline for EVs being any good, its not going to convince many people.

 

[fish farmer]

The visual of being pulled over and out of juice is a lil disconcerting … I mean do you hold up a sign “out of juice’ and will AAA be able to service you in a timely fashion if at all?
OTOH, filling the car up using solar panels is appealing

At some time it will be figured out...I have a recent AAA story regarding my ICE van...blew the muffler in w.virgina. I thought it was the tranny going bad, AAA checked it out at the highway rest area. No tow needed, but kept the service appt. It was Sunday so the next Monday go to muffler shop.... won't be able to check it out until the afternoon.

I drove a loud muffler all the way through Virginia and got it fixed in Tennessee. That wouldn't happen with a battery rig.