ICH - Embarrassed to Post / Should Have Listened

[rkpetersen]

Where are the marks on the tang? Marks like that could be HLLE, induced by stress.
No definite idea about the clown color changes, although it also sounds more stress related than infectious.
Please post some pics.

 

[nyknicks2544]

Here is a picture of the Clownfish discoloration. Notice the blackening around his stripe on the back as well as patches in the center stripe. The part of his body above his head also looks compressed. Any thoughts?

I am planning on treating with prazi-pro as preventive today unless others think it’s not wise.

Will try and get some pictures of the other tang later with lights fully on and feeding. He’s just too fast / spooked easily.

 

[rkpetersen]

I don't know what's going on there. #reefsquad, any thoughts on why a clown in markedly hyposaline tank would start to look like this?

 

[TheEngineer]

I’d guess uronema

 

[Katrina71]

Glad you posted. Lots of people run into things...never be embarrassed. At the very least you are helping yourself and others learn.

 

[4FordFamily]

If the spots are hard to see at times it sounds more like velvet. Ich is very obvious and hard to miss.

Fish can live with velvet for some time after arrival due to low levels of copper in the distribution system, seems to slow it down for up to a month.

 

[rkpetersen]

I’d guess uronema

I was thinking about that but it was a call I wasn't prepared to make. The skin discoloration is worse than I was expecting though.

If the spots are hard to see at times it sounds more like velvet. Ich is very obvious and hard to miss.

Fish can live with velvet for some time after arrival due to low levels of copper in the distribution system, seems to slow it down for up to a month.

Thanks for answering the call! Please check out the latest pics and tell us what you think.

 

[TheEngineer]

When I see that reddish bruising I immediately think uronema. Throw it it being a clown and that pushes me in that direction even more.

 

[nyknicks2544]

When I see that reddish bruising I immediately think uronema. Throw it it being a clown and that pushes me in that direction even more.

Thanks everyone! Any way I can help verify it? Looks like a tough diagnoses with few treatment options - even if it is cured in QT it can’t stay in this yank as Uronema doesn’t require a host and will just reinfect any without immunity?

Dosed prazi-pro and immediately noticed a decrease in appetite from the fish. Wrasse is usually an aggressive eater and has just been hiding and didn’t come out to eat LRS. Remainder of the fish showed signs of a decrease but still ate.

 

[TheEngineer]

Oh, you should 100% trust @4FordFamily over me. I was just sharing my thoughts.

 

[nyknicks2544]

Btw - tested water quality nitrates between 10-20 and not ammonia / nitrites

 

[nyknicks2544]

If the spots are hard to see at times it sounds more like velvet. Ich is very obvious and hard to miss.

Fish can live with velvet for some time after arrival due to low levels of copper in the distribution system, seems to slow it down for up to a month.

I believe it was ICH but am new. What are your thoughts on recent pictures of the white dots (not of the clown)? Going hypo has helped. I can’t tell if the tang is scarred / has something else. There are still 2-3 spots on either side of it compared to probably 50 prior to leaving. But they aren’t clear dots more like nicks / lines. All of the other fish are 100% clear from dots. I stared at my powder blue who was very bare prior to me leaving a week ago and no is completely clean of white spots.

If the spots significant disappeared with hypo it could not be velvet right? Or can velvet just come / go and perhaps it is just in a period where it can’t be seen but fish are still infected?

Thanks all!!

 

[4FordFamily]

I believe it was ICH but am new. What are your thoughts on recent pictures of the white dots (not of the clown)? Going hypo has helped. I can’t tell if the tang is scarred / has something else. There are still 2-3 spots on either side of it compared to probably 50 prior to leaving. But they aren’t clear dots more like nicks / lines. All of the other fish are 100% clear from dots. I stared at my powder blue who was very bare prior to me leaving a week ago and no is completely clean of white spots.

If the spots significant disappeared with hypo it could not be velvet right? Or can velvet just come / go and perhaps it is just in a period where it can’t be seen but fish are still infected?

Thanks all!!

I can’t see much in the photos. IME hypo does little to velvet, and it’s life cycle is a few days at most so maybe it was ich. Watch closely. Keep in mind any fluctuation in hyosalinity means you need to start all over. The most common issue that causes this is evaporation. I never could do it correctly in my DT, but also didn’t try much.

I do think the clowns above have uronema. They’d need removed and treated with metroplex and then fed metroplex and focus soaked foods, as would all fish they were in contact with. This is tough as uronema doesn’t have a fallow period...

It could be an infection as well, which would be “better news” but NFG would be the best choice for that, or add kanaplex and furan 2 to the metroplex.

@Humblefish @HotRocks

 

[csb123]

Don’t be embarrassed by a parasite outbreak. It happens to a majority of reefers. There has been a poll on R2R which shows a majority of reefers don’t quarantine, or have ineffective quarantines, for their livestock. You seem to be good a keeping your fish alive. But, even if your fish completely recover, there will still be ICH in your tank causing a continuous low grade infection. To get rid of this, you would need to let your tank go fishless for 72 days to eradicate the ICH in it. And, a recent post, shows that this may not even work 100%. In addition, you would have to put all your fish, and future livestock (fish, snails, hermits, frag plugs...) through a specific quarantine protocol to eliminate ICH and prevent its reintroduction into your system. And, the quarantine protocol is not particularly safe. Just see the number of posts with “died in quarantine” themes.

I would suggest looking into Humblefish’s lucid posts about “how to build an immune reef.”

 

[Humblefish]

I would suggest looking into Humblefish’s lucid posts about “how to build an immune reef.”

I think you're confusing me with @Paul B

 

[csb123]

I stand corrected!

 

[nyknicks2544]

Apologies for the non-replies it has been a busy week back to work. Love the start of a new year (not).

For those following along - it was an Down and then Up week for the tank. I am really unsure what is going on with these fish...

Started out w/ maintaining Hypo and treating w/ Prazi-Pro as well as feeding Metro / Kana bound w/ Focus in food last Saturday or Sunday. I believe that was a huge mistake - things took a downturn. Fish appetite decreased significantly. Clownfish color continued to deteriorate. My Wrasse took the brunt of it. He immediately went into hiding. I could see his spot under the rocks. Heavy heavy breathing and on his back / side the whole week. I thought I was going to lose him but 16 hour days kept me from doing a large water change. Finally Friday I see him stuck to the overflow not moving - I get the net to pull him out and then all of a sudden when it touches him he goes nuts swimming all over the tank running into walls its like he had no idea where he was or what was going on. His coloration was way off with these strange round white lines around his body and super pale, fins all frayed it was so sad.

So I start running Carbon to attempt to pull the meds out. Obviously with Hypo large water changes are hard because it needs to be spot on but I begin trying to do a 25%+ water change. Over Friday night and Saturday I swapped out ~30% of the water. When I finish last night I sit down to enjoy a movie and after the movie is done I check the tank. Bristletooth tang is on his side not moving! I touch him and he gets up but still laying down. I go to get the net panicked thinking I am about to lose him. I test the water and salinity is reading 1.007. There is no ammonia / nitrites in the tank. Immediately I add a cup of salt to the tank to try and boost the salinity as I am worried its too low and killing the fish. Immediately after adding the cup of salinity the fish go nuts swimming all over the tank. Tang gets up like nothing happened? It was the weirdest thing - I am not sure if he was sleeping / playing dead as I did startle all the fish by turning all the lights on from a state of pitch black.

So where do we stand?

Tank is in hypo still. ALL fish are doing wonderfully this morning. Everyone including the Wrasse is swimming around the tank. Coloration is almost completely back. Appetite is strong - Wrasse even ate frozen after not eating a single thing all week. Rest of fish are attacking food w/ vigor.

There is NO signs of ICH anywhere / on any fish. The Bristletooth who had markings last weekend is completely clean. I believe they were scars / flesh wounds from fighting off the ICH that have since healed.

Salinity in the tank is reading 1.007 on the Electronic reader and between 1.008/1.009 on the refractometer. I think I may have gone slightly too low on the water changes but am still unsure what happened last night.

The only issue: Larger female clownfish is still discolored in the white areas on the body becoming darker. Both clownfish also have white coloration around their mouths. Will post pictures to show what is going on. Unsure how to proceed with helping these guys. Nervous to do anything given the series of events. Their appetite and behavior seem normal.

Sorry this is long - but maybe someone years from now will read this and get something out of it. Thanks everyone!

 

[nyknicks2544]

Powder Blue Tang who wouldn't touch frozen and only ate Nori over the last month of having him is eating frozen food today - I went from a tank I thought was completely crashing due to the Praz-pro or too low of salinity to the most aggressive eating yet. So strange....

I plan on seeing through the hypo salinity as it appears to have "cured" the ICH. We'll see if it doesn't come back when I increase salinity 3-4 weeks from today but for the last two weeks it went from rampant in the tank to no signs for a solid week+.