Is this normal clam behavior?

OrionN · Jun 6, 2024

I imported them from Viet Nam in 2000.
I am not sure what else I can say. Just because Barry said them 20 years ago, it may be “true” then. This does not mean that it is true now. Just read the article, and do more research if you still think you are right, then come back and post on this thread.

minus9 · Jun 6, 2024

Outlaw Corals said:
Very nice clams you have there, i will always tell people to feed baby clams under 2 in. Something other then light, Derasa clams are much hardier then Maximas and croceas, the mortality rate for baby maximas especially is astronomical and i have never had someone tell me not to feed baby clams, feeding them has no chance of hurting them it could only be helpful

All you have to do is feed your fish and there will be plenty of nitrogen (food) for your clam(s). Also, there's no guarantee that a clam will actually ingest and consume phyto. The size thing has been a myth for so long, but has been debunked by scientific studies multiple times.

OrionN · Jun 6, 2024

@Outlaw Corals
I keep clams for 30 years now and grew them from 2 inches to 28 inches.
I keep Crocea from 1 incheand Maxima from 1.5 inches. I never “feed” my clams and they do just fine. If you have to buy phyto to feed your clams you will spend a huge amount of money. I raised clowns before and had phyto to raise rotifers for the fry. I did not feed the clams then and is not going to advise people to spend a truckload of money to waste on their clams. It won’t hurt the clams but sure hurt the pocket books follow that advice.

Outlaw Corals · Jun 6, 2024

OrionN said:
@Outlaw Corals
I keep clams for 30 years now and grew them from 2 inches to 28 inches.
I keep Crocea from 1 incheand Maxima from 1.5 inches. I never “feed” my clams and they do just fine. If you have to buy phyto to feed your clams you will spend a huge amount of money. I raised clowns before and had phyto to raise rotifers for the fry. I did not feed the clams then and is not going to advise people to spend a truckload of money to waste on their clams. It won’t hurt the clams but sure hurt the pocket books follow that advice.

It’s an expensive for sure, you have been in the hobby for a long time you should know the mortality rate of baby clams especially maximas, just because you had success with them at such a small size doesn’t mean everybody is going to have that same success therefore supplemental feeding is necessary

OrionN · Jun 6, 2024

Clams are not hard to keep. Enough to light and stable clean water with good Alkalinity and Ca is all they need. Not sterile Nitrate of 0 and phosphate of 0 water but normal water with adequate nitrogenous dissolved in the water. Even for tiny clams. They do need a lot of light which is why many beginner reefer can’t keep them. They don’t have adequate light, and often did not know to check for parasitic snails.
Much more important is to make sure and eliminate parasitic snails and treat Pinched Mantle Disease (PMD). QT them until they are know to be disease and pest free. PMD pretty much wipe out my collection of clams in the early 2000 until I come up with Fresh Water Dip (FWD) for this disease.
IMO/IME feeding them make no apparent different in their survival or increase rate of growth, if they are given optimal conditions.

Outlaw Corals · Jun 6, 2024

OrionN said:
Clams are not hard to keep. Enough to light and stable clean water with good Alkalinity and Ca is all they need. Not sterile Nitrate of 0 and phosphate of 0 water but normal water with adequate nitrogenous dissolved in the water. Even for tiny clams. They do need a lot of light which is why many beginner reefer can’t keep them. They don’t have adequate light, and often did not know to check for parasitic snails.
Much more important is to make sure and eliminate parasitic snails and treat Pinched Mantle Disease (PMD). QT them until they are know to be disease and pest free. PMD pretty much wipe out my collection of clams in the early 2000 until I come up with Fresh Water Dip (FWD) for this disease.
IMO/IME feeding them make no apparent different in their survival or increase rate of growth, if they are given optimal conditions.

The fellow i mentioned before was the only one doing all the research on pinched mantle disease (PMD) back 25 / 30 year’s ago and discovered that it was a protozoa causing the pinched mantle and the best way to treat it was with the fresh water dip, he was working on a medication for pm when he fell ill and passed away

OrionN · Jun 6, 2024

Outlaw Corals said:
The fellow i mentioned before was the only one doing all the research on pinched mantle disease (PMD) back 25 / 30 year’s ago and discovered that it was a protozoa causing the pinched mantle and the best way to treat it was with the fresh water dip, he was working on a medication for pm when he fell ill and passed away

I am sorry, but it was I who named and devise the treatment for PMD back in 2002. I thought that it is a superficial infection, most likely a protozoa. I was in communication with Barry , and donated money to his research later to see if he can ID it. In my write up on PMD, it stated this, and stated why I think his/and the biologist he works with conclusion that the tissue infection by Perkinsus was wrong. Just the simple fact that tissue infection will not response to FWD. If you read the study below, they isolated Perkinsus from both sick clams and healthy clams. They also not able to isolate Perkinsus from some sick clam and some healthy clams. It seem to me the correct conclusion should be Perkinsus is a incidental finding. This along with the fact that FWD only will treat superficial (surface) infection. Perkinsus is a tissue infection, infection in the tissue will never be exposed to fresh water with dipping, so it will not work.

Regardless, FWD is an effective treatment for PMD.

Here is the write up resulted from Bary study.

Pinched Mantle Syndrome in Giant Clams

Here is my write up:

Diagnosis and Treatment of Pinched Mantle Disease in Giant Clams.

Introduction It was almost 20 years ago when I first introduced the Fresh Water Dip (FWD) protocol for the treatment of Pinched Mantle Disease (PMD). Over the years, many reefers altered the protocol somewhat but, on the whole, it still is the only tried and true way to treat PMD, a universally...

www.reef2reef.com

minus9 · Jun 6, 2024

To back up @OrionN story, I worked for Dick Perrin in the 90's and was around when he used to FW dip incoming clams. I most likely was the person who shipped clams to @OrionN around that time as well, so I can back his story 100%.

Outlaw Corals · Jun 7, 2024

OrionN said:
I am sorry, but it was I who named and devise the treatment for PMD back in 2002. I thought that it is a superficial infection, most likely a protozoa. I was in communication with Barry , and donated money to his research later to see if he can ID it. In my write up on PMD, it stated this, and stated why I think his/and the biologist he works with conclusion that the tissue infection by Perkinsus was wrong. Just the simple fact that tissue infection will not response to FWD. If you read the study below, they isolated Perkinsus from both sick clams and healthy clams. They also not able to isolate Perkinsus from some sick clam and some healthy clams. It seem to me the correct conclusion should be Perkinsus is a incidental finding. This along with the fact that FWD only will treat superficial (surface) infection. Perkinsus is a tissue infection, infection in the tissue will never be exposed to fresh water with dipping, so it will not work.

Regardless, FWD is an effective treatment for PMD.

Here is the write up resulted from Bary study.

Pinched Mantle Syndrome in Giant Clams

Here is my write up:

Diagnosis and Treatment of Pinched Mantle Disease in Giant Clams.

Introduction It was almost 20 years ago when I first introduced the Fresh Water Dip (FWD) protocol for the treatment of Pinched Mantle Disease (PMD). Over the years, many reefers altered the protocol somewhat but, on the whole, it still is the only tried and true way to treat PMD, a universally...

www.reef2reef.com

Any time i used the FWD for treatment for PM i had pretty good success, to be honest I did not know if you were just messing with me or not but once you said, you donated money to Barry’s research, I knew you weren’t messing with me. I donated as well. I will definitely read the report a little later. I am actually heading out right now for a MRI.