Just ich or worse?

[cliffclaven]

Today is my red sea sailfin tangs 8th day in copper and after being out for work over the weekend I noticed it has what looks like ich. Doesn't look to bad but there's some stuff on his fins that's making me worry. If any idea please let me no.
Thanks

 

[HotRocks]

8th day of Therapeutic copper?

What type of copper are you using? What is your current Cu level?

 

[Humblefish]

Also, do some of the fins look eaten on? If so, that is more a symptom of skin flukes: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/flukes-–-general-guidelines.224423/

 

[cliffclaven]

I tested and waited 5 mins using seachem copper and test kit and it read between .2and .3 but then after like 5 more mins its was around .5

 

[cliffclaven]

Also, do some of the fins look eaten on? If so, that is more a symptom of skin flukes: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/flukes-–-general-guidelines.224423/

I did a freshwater dip for 5 mins and maybe saw a couple white dots hard to tell but looked like a couple of things were falling off. Didn't see many but the fin that runs across his spin (dorsel?) Looks chewed up and his tail finals. side fins look like that have stuff on them but not missing tissue.

But did fw dip and removing all the copper. Dont know if I should restart copper or dose parzi cuz didnt see many spots... but as soon as I put him back in the tank he went in front of the powerhead ro swim against the flow.

 

[HotRocks]

I did a freshwater dip for 5 mins and maybe saw a couple white dots hard to tell but looked like a couple of things were falling off. Didn't see many but the fin that runs across his spin (dorsel?) Looks chewed up and his tail finals. side fins look like that have stuff on them but not missing tissue.

But did fw dip and removing all the copper. Dont know if I should restart copper or dose parzi cuz didnt see many spots... but as soon as I put him back in the tank he went in front of the powerhead ro swim against the flow.

Did you see any sesame seed looking things fall off?

Swimming into powerhead is a sign of velvet. The spots on his fins that I can see are "velvet like". The freshwater dip would provide temporary relief if you are dealing with velvet. @Humblefish's recommendation is to also do a bath in acriflavine to help prevent infection. If you are dealing with velvet, you will want to get the fish back into therapeutic copper ASAP. I am not saying that is what you are dealing with for sure. It could be velvet or flukes or a combination of the two.

 

[cliffclaven]

Did you see any sesame seed looking things fall off?

Swimming into powerhead is a sign of velvet. The spots on his fins that I can see are "velvet like". The freshwater dip would provide temporary relief if you are dealing with velvet. @Humblefish's recommendation is to also do a bath in acriflavine to help prevent infection. If you are dealing with velvet, you will want to get the fish back into therapeutic copper ASAP. I am not saying that is what you are dealing with for sure. It could be velvet or flukes or a combination of the two.

Ok but only thing with that is that hes been in the tank for 8 days no problem or spots he is pretty skiddish but would eat if I left the filter off for a while. So could velvet wait that long before showing?? I know it's a quick killer witch is why I ask

 

[cliffclaven]

And also so what do you think my copper lvl is? With it taking a while but getting darker blue, but I know it says it should only take about 4 mins

 

[HotRocks]

Ok but only thing with that is that hes been in the tank for 8 days no problem or spots he is pretty skiddish but would eat if I left the filter off for a while. So could velvet wait that long before showing?? I know it's a quick killer witch is why I ask

And also so what do you think my copper lvl is? With it taking a while but getting darker blue, but I know it says it should only take about 4 mins

I am sure that is the reason Humble is leaning Flukes. If your copper level is sub-therapeutic it is possible that it could be velvet.
So hard to tell with visual tests. It seems the salifert test is the easiest to read for ionic copper.
To answer your question, yes it is possible for velvet to show up 8 days into copper treatment if the level is sub-therapeutic.
Is there any media in your filter that could be absorbing copper?

 

[cliffclaven]

I am sure that is the reason Humble is leaning Flukes. If your copper level is sub-therapeutic it is possible that it could be velvet.
So hard to tell with visual tests. It seems the salifert test is the easiest to read for ionic copper.
To answer your question, yes it is possible for velvet to show up 8 days into copper treatment if the level is sub-therapeutic.
Is there any media in your filter that could be absorbing copper?

No. Does copper evaporate? Because I have an ato

 

[HotRocks]

No. Does copper evaporate? Because I have an ato

No it does not evaporate. You are fine to top off with RODI.

 

[cliffclaven]

Then not sure I already dosed cu again I did 2.5ml I use a syringe just because its easier then counting and more accurate. Last time I did the same but I think I did 2ml. In a 20 gallon tank btw

 

[HotRocks]

It's one ml per 10.5 gallons, then repeat again in 48 hours. So to get to the therapeutic level you will need a total of 3.8ml.

I would break this up into smaller .5ml doses if possible. If you already dosed 2 ml then go .5ml tomorrow am, .5ml pm, etc. Until you reach the 3.8ml mark.

Your test was probably closer to the .25ppm mark prior. Which is sub-therapeutic. I have found cupramine to test very consistent if dosed per instructions with the Hanna high range copper checker, which provides a digital result

 

[cliffclaven]

It's one ml per 10.5 gallons, then repeat again in 48 hours. So to get to the therapeutic level you will need a total of 3.8ml.

I would break this up into smaller .5ml doses if possible. If you already dosed 2 ml then go .5ml tomorrow am, .5ml pm, etc. Until you reach the 3.8ml mark.

Your test was probably closer to the .25ppm mark prior. Which is sub-therapeutic. I have found cupramine to test very consistent if dosed per instructions with the Hanna high range copper checker, which provides a digital result

I have alot of trouble reading the kit wish I could send it to you for the hanna checker lol but ok I did 2.4 today I'll do .5 tomorrow twice and again for the third day .. should I use parzi too or kanaplex?

 

[cliffclaven]

It's one ml per 10.5 gallons, then repeat again in 48 hours. So to get to the therapeutic level you will need a total of 3.8ml.

I would break this up into smaller .5ml doses if possible. If you already dosed 2 ml then go .5ml tomorrow am, .5ml pm, etc. Until you reach the 3.8ml mark.

Your test was probably closer to the .25ppm mark prior. Which is sub-therapeutic. I have found cupramine to test very consistent if dosed per instructions with the Hanna high range copper checker, which provides a digital result

And where did you find the hanna checker for copper I didnt find it on Ebay Amazon or brs lol

 

[HotRocks]

I got mine direct. They now are directing people to these vendors for preorders and they offer free shipping.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/hi702-copper-checker-for-seawater.386806/

 

[Humblefish]

^^ Agree with @HotRocks about pretty much everything

It’s great having another go-to person in the fish disease forum. Thank you @HotRocks for all of your incredible contributions.

 

[HotRocks]

^^ Agree with @HotRocks about pretty much everything

It’s great having another go-to person in the fish disease forum. Thank you @HotRocks for all of your incredible contributions.

Glad to help! I have good sources for information!

 

[cliffclaven]

Yea thanks for all the help and so fast.
Any idea when the hanna checker comes out?

Glad to help! I have good sources for information!

 

[HotRocks]

Yea thanks for all the help and so fast.
Any idea when the hanna checker comes out?

They are available currently. Just the mad rush on them has created backorders since it was newly discovered that they work in saltwater. They are made in Romania. Most people that have ordered recently are getting them within a couple weeks it seems. I think by the end of this month stocking should no longer be an issue based on info provided by the manufacturer.