Kalk or all for reef?

[TheyGaveItToMe]

Let’s get the facts from Lou Ekus himself. What does he have to say about it?

I'm still waiting for you to find a user that has had a negative result. Do you have that or just more opinions?

 

[Reefahholic]

I'm still waiting for you to find a user that has had a negative result. Do you have that or just more opinions?

More opinions? I just gave you the facts from the main man himself.

Since you asked…yes, there have been several reefers who had drifting elements or several elements that were very high that became a problem.

 

[TheyGaveItToMe]

More opinions? I just gave you the facts from the main man himself.

Since you asked…yes, there have been several reefers who had drifting elements or several elements that were very high that became a problem.

What facts are stated in that video?

 

[TheyGaveItToMe]

More opinions? I just gave you the facts from the main man himself.

Since you asked…yes, there have been several reefers who had drifting elements or several elements that were very high that became a problem.

September 19...

October 28...

And, I dose AFR. Those are facts.

 

[Reefahholic]

What facts are stated in that video?

You said that the consumption of each tank is equal to the ratio of trace elements in the bottle, and they’ll be consumed at the rate they are dosed. I said that it’s impossible, because every tank has a different rate of consumption.

Tropic Marin specifically designed AFR in ratios that the trace elements are consumed at the rate they are dosed.

Fact: Lou Ekus just proved me right when he said that if you have an element you want to increase or decrease (due to rate of consumption) you can’t.

 

[Reefahholic]

September 19...

October 28...

And, I dose AFR. Those are facts.

Ok, we’ll have a nice morning. I think I proved my point even using Lou Ekus’s own words.

 

[TheyGaveItToMe]

Fact: Lou Ekus just proved me right when he said that if you have an element you want to increase or decrease (due to rate of consumption) you can’t.

Fact: he is not correct. The chart that explains how to correct is right here. You adjust dosing, and supplement. Or even more simple, do a water change to reset parameters from time to time. Are you dosing each individual trace element? Do you think a single elements parameter is going to swing wildly between water changes?

 

[dmiki]

The results speak for themselves. Find a user that has had a negative experience using AFR.

I have had a negative experience! Dosing A4R and ICP came back with low Magnesium, Boron and ZERO Iodine and Molybdenum. I also use TM pro salt and when testing new batches of water, Alk was always 6.4-6.5 (Salifert). Here I was wondering why is my Alk always a little below 7 ?! BTW, I have the German batch. Now dosing kalkwasser and Sodium bicarbonate (NaHCO3) slowly and my Alk is above 7. Also, every time I changed water and/or dosed A4R, some corals were reacting/closing up. Sorry to say, but I am going back to my "old" salt, I've been using TM pro for over a year and a half and did not see any benefits over my previously used salt......except that I needed additional dosing for Alk......

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

September 19...

October 28...

And, I dose AFR. Those are facts.

So, 6 weeks after the first photo, your coral faded and you took a close-up, making it look larger?

I can do that without AFR... lol!

 

[EeyoreIsMySpiritAnimal]

Fact: he is not correct. The chart that explains how to correct is right here. You adjust dosing, and supplement. Or even more simple, do a water change to reset parameters from time to time. Are you dosing each individual trace element? Do you think a single elements parameter is going to swing wildly between water changes?

The CEO of the company that makes the product is wrong about how his own product works?

 

[The_Skrimp]

A lot of the concern here seems entirely unfounded. All For Reef has added trace elements that might prolong the time between water changes but in my experience, it’s not at all enough to replace them. I still have to dose for iodine, potassium, and magnesium. If your tank is consuming enough calcium and alk to keep up with what you are dosing then something would have to be pretty far off in your tank to overdose on the trace elements.

 

[TheyGaveItToMe]

So, 6 weeks after the first photo, your coral faded and you took a close-up, making it look larger?

I can do that without AFR... lol!

Look at all this growth...

When do you plan on starting a build thread, so we can see all your growth?

 

[TheyGaveItToMe]

The CEO of the company that makes the product is wrong about how his own product works?

Because, it was a 30 second clip cut out of context. Here is the hour long stream...

 

[GHOSTLY]

A lot of the concern here seems entirely unfounded. All For Reef has added trace elements that might prolong the time between water changes but in my experience, it’s not at all enough to replace them. I still have to dose for iodine, potassium, and magnesium. If your tank is consuming enough calcium and alk to keep up with what you are dosing then something would have to be pretty far off in your tank to overdose on the trace elements.

So Kalk raises PH and calcium but AFR raises alk, calcium, but also trace elements?

 

[TheyGaveItToMe]

I have had a negative experience! Dosing A4R and ICP came back with low Magnesium, Boron and ZERO Iodine and Molybdenum. I also use TM pro salt and when testing new batches of water, Alk was always 6.4-6.5 (Salifert). Here I was wondering why is my Alk always a little below 7 ?! BTW, I have the German batch. Now dosing kalkwasser and Sodium bicarbonate (NaHCO3) slowly and my Alk is above 7. Also, every time I changed water and/or dosed A4R, some corals were reacting/closing up. Sorry to say, but I am going back to my "old" salt, I've been using TM pro for over a year and a half and did not see any benefits over my previously used salt......except that I needed additional dosing for Alk......

dang, what is the PH of your fresh/RODI water? That doesn't make sense, because TM pro has a base Alkalinity of 7.
This sounds like user error, AFR is used to maintain levels not correct bad parameters. It is literally right there on the bottle.

Low Alkalinity, low magnesium, low boron, zero iodine... Sounds a lot like your dose amount might be low? Did that though ever cross your mind?

 

[HBtank]

I don't agree. Kalk is a one part Calcium and Alkalinity; AFR is a one part Calcium, Alkalinity, and trace elements. They use different delivery methods to achieve the same results.

What are you trying to claim is the difference?

I wouldn’t call magnesium a trace element (and others as well depending on the tank), and they certainly do not “achieve the same results” depending on the load/demands.

 

[TheyGaveItToMe]

I wouldn’t call magnesium a trace element (and others as well depending on the tank), and they certainly do not “achieve the same results” depending on the load/demands.

Do they both dose calcium and alkalinity?

 

[HBtank]

You said that the consumption of each tank is equal to the ratio of trace elements in the bottle, and they’ll be consumed at the rate they are dosed. I said that it’s impossible, because every tank has a different rate of consumption.



Fact: Lou Ekus just proved me right when he said that if you have an element you want to increase or decrease (due to rate of consumption) you can’t.

I have only seen deficits really reported with long term use based on ICP testing, and that is why they had to adjust the formula (increased A- elements) recently.

You can use their A- and K+ to adjust as needed. Or use their balling solutions to adjust core parameters. Also there is guidance on controlling dosing with alkalinity versus calcium testing, as tanks seem to land on one side or the other.

Point being if you like control and want to be more rigorous on testing individual parameters or ICP testing, you can tweak it as needed.

 

[HBtank]

Do they both dose calcium and alkalinity?

Why did you ignore my fundamental point?

Do you not understand how magnesium works in balancing calcium and alkalinity?

 

[AndrewJG]

I used the powdered ALL for Reef for while but as others have said had some issues with imbalance due to having to dose Nitrate which increased my Alkalinity, so I was always having to correct my Calcium, Magnesium and Trace Elements. Have gone onto Reef Zelements A + B which I dose less Part A (Alk) due to the Nitrate dosing bumping it up; so far so good.