Leathers perpetually shedding -cross post

[mcarroll]

Leather corals do need lots of flow to shed efficiently.

A sharp decline in nutrient levels with no help from you should indicate that those nutrients were used up in growth.

Is there any chance of corals have gotten bigger and actually (partially) blocked flow to some of these corals so that a flow improvement or maybe just rearranging your flow would help?

I would still take some measurements of your lights rather than continuing to guess on that front. A lux meter app for your smart phone is free in a handheld lux meter only goes for $10-$20.

As for flow, that is a lot harder to gauge and there's no way to measure it. So whether to experiment here is up to you, but it seems like a worthwhile idea to me.

As far as I know about the chemical warfare you mentioned, that only applies against stony corals not vs each other.

It's possible there is nothing wrong here at all, by the way. Switching the coral to a new environment is all it would take to make this possible.

Sounds to me like everything in the tank is mostly OK, so it might not be worth worrying anymore.

 

[hart24601]

Have you ruled out a fish nipping them 100%? After flow that would be my guess. It doesn't take much, just a few pecks a day.

 

[miyags]

Whats your salinity?. When I forget to top off my water, my crown leather closes up.When I do the top off,it sheds and opens back up.Try lowering salinity a tad.Just a thought.

 

[CindyKz]

Leather corals do need lots of flow to shed efficiently.
A sharp decline in nutrient levels with no help from you should indicate that those nutrients were used up in growth.

Is there any chance of corals have gotten bigger and actually (partially) blocked flow to some of these corals so that a flow improvement or maybe just rearranging your flow would help?

I would still take some measurements of your lights rather than continuing to guess on that front. A lux meter app for your smart phone is free in a handheld lux meter only goes for $10-$20.

As for flow, that is a lot harder to gauge and there's no way to measure it. So whether to experiment here is up to you, but it seems like a worthwhile idea to me.

As far as I know about the chemical warfare you mentioned, that only applies against stony corals not vs each other.

It's possible there is nothing wrong here at all, by the way. Switching the coral to a new environment is all it would take to make this possible.

Sounds to me like everything in the tank is mostly OK, so it might not be worth worrying anymore.

I'm pretty sure the decline in nutrients was just a result of moving the tank and getting rid of the dirty-ish sand. No real growth. And I would tend to agree that it might be nothing except that one coral definitely seems to be suffering.

I could borrow a PAR meter easily. Anyone know how much light leathers like?

 

[CindyKz]

Have you ruled out a fish nipping them 100%? After flow that would be my guess. It doesn't take much, just a few pecks a day.

I haven't observed that or bite marks. Beyond that, I guess there's no way to be certain. I'll keep a closer eye for a while. It's a possibility

 

[mcarroll]

except that one coral definitely seems to be suffering.

Which one? Can you post a pic that features this coral? Maybe one that shows what and where all your flow is too?

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

I'm pretty sure the decline in nutrients was just a result of moving the tank and getting rid of the dirty-ish sand. No real growth. And I would tend to agree that it might be nothing except that one coral definitely seems to be suffering.

I could borrow a PAR meter easily. Anyone know how much light leathers like?

Most are generalist I belive. So quite. Literally will take 80-1100.

 

[CindyKz]

Which one? Can you post a pic that features this coral? Maybe one that shows what and where all your flow is too?

1st page of the thread, 3rd pic down. It posted sideways but if you rotate and look at it correctly it's on the far right. The first pic is a FTS shows powerhead placement. The powerheads were alternating each minute but I reprogrammed them yesterday to run one minute together, alternate a minute each, and repeat. I tried this programming once before and it didn't make any difference but I thought I'd try again.

 

[CindyKz]

So I have tried most of the suggestions here. Increasing my flow seems to have helped some but the issues still exist. Open, close, shed repeat. Except for one poor coral that still inflates/deflates but hasn't polyped out at all.

I started wondering about pests. I've always seen flatworms in this tank, thought I had id'd them as harmless white acoel variety. And there was only one now and then. Now I'm not so sure. I see them on the glass but not the corals - when I siphon the surface of the corals to see what I get, I don't get flatworms. Still, they are on the glass so definitely there. It's only a 32 gal tank so a wrasse doesn't seem like an option, except maybe a leapord wrasse.

Tempted to try Flatworm exit I have read about the issues involved. Just getting very frustrated.

ETA: LA recommends a 50 gal tank for a leopard so that's not an option either

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

I’d like to see the flatworms if you can.

Have we talked about carbon and purigen?

 

[CindyKz]

I’d like to see the flatworms if you can.

Have we talked about carbon and purigen?

Yep, I've always had carbon in that tank - in a bag, no room for a reactor. I doubled it with no effect.

I've tried to get pictures but my phone won't focus on them. (no camera here, sorry Salty )

I am ordering a microscope this morning so I can get a better look at least.

 

[CindyKz]

Yep, I've always had carbon in that tank - in a bag, no room for a reactor. I doubled it with no effect.

I've tried to get pictures but my phone won't focus on them. (no camera here, sorry Salty )

I am ordering a microscope this morning so I can get a better look at least.

Microscope with camera ordered, so hopefully on Friday I can id them and post pics. I looked hard with a flashlight just now. I still can only see them on the glass, not the corals or sand. To my naked eye (well, naked with trifocals haha) they look like the white acoel flatworms with 2 pronged tail.

I think either way I'm going to try FE. I suppose they could be irritating my corals just enough to cause this constant shedding cycle.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

https://www.lionfishlair.com/hitchhikers-guide/

 

[CindyKz]

https://www.lionfishlair.com/hitchhikers-guide/

Yes, I don't see anything like that. They look more like this one, from what I can tell:

But they are so small, I have a hard time seeing details. Scope should be here Friday.

 

[CindyKz]

Finally able to get a pic. They appear to have 2, not 3 pronged tail to me.

 

[CindyKz]

Used the microscope, which came with a camera. Unfortunately, the magnification of the camera is such that I couldn't "zoom out" to get the entire critter in one frame. They are definitely the acoel worms.

Supposed to be harmless, but I expect they could still irritate corals into staying closed.

I used Flatworm exit tonight. Quite a few floated around but not the masses I expected. No ill effects so far (it's been a couple of hours). A few zoas closed up briefly and I think I lost a few mini-brittle stars. Fish ate normally afterward and are behaving normally now. We'll see what the next few days brings.

I'm also on the lookout for a pink-streaked wrasse for this tank.

 

[CindyKz]

Used the microscope, which came with a camera. Unfortunately, the magnification of the camera is such that I couldn't "zoom out" to get the entire critter in one frame. They are definitely the acoel worms.

Supposed to be harmless, but I expect they could still irritate corals into staying closed.

I used Flatworm exit tonight. Quite a few floated around but not the masses I expected. No ill effects so far (it's been a couple of hours). A few zoas closed up briefly and I think I lost a few mini-brittle stars. Fish ate normally afterward and are behaving normally now. We'll see what the next few days brings.

I'm also on the lookout for a pink-streaked wrasse for this tank.

Just thought I'd post an update. Since the FE my midas blenny (the guy in my avatar) is MIA presumed dead, and the one coral that ALWAYS looked good has closed up. I did another water change and changed out the carbon again, although of course I did that immediately following the FE. The other 2 fish in the tank, a puffer and a hawkfish, are behaving normally as are the other corals. Still cranky.

I haven't had any luck finding a pink-streaked wrasse. I've seen them on Divers Den but never on days that I could take delivery. I got a fourline wrasse at a frag swap this weekend instead. Cute little guy, we'll see how that goes. They get mixed reviews on whether or not they are as badly behaved as their sixline cousins. He is in quarantine now.

OH. And I still have the darn flatworms, and I still don't know if they are causing the problems (I suspect not).