Life-time GHL ION probe

[nickm]

shipment to US leaves in 10 days from Germany

When will we be able to start placing new orders for an ION D?

 

[Vinny@GHLUSA Verified Sponsor]

When will we be able to start placing new orders for an ION D?

After we're caught up with the existing pre-orders.

 

[JaysLittleOcean]

Any updates? I was hoping that individual who initially pre-ordered, received their equipment, then has the sensor become faulty would be first on the list to receive the new sensors?

 

[timry2]

Vinny just advised me that the shipment to the US was delayed and will be shipping 1 week from today.

 

[robbyg]

Vinny just advised me that the shipment to the US was delayed and will be shipping 1 week from today.

The whole delay excuse thing has really been over used. The impact this iond must be having on there overall sales must be massive. I fear for them as a company in the long term because they actually make good controllers and this thing is just killing their reputation and cash flow.

 

[Matthias Gross]

Hi Robby,

thank you for being concerned about the well-being of my company, really appreciated.
But there is no reason to be concerned, despite the bumps in the road we experienced mainly caused by these IOND sensor delays, we were able to grow, even in the current economic environment. Lots of customers from all over the world, professionals from research and industry, and hobbyists which prefer reliability and high quality standards over cheap.

 

[Matthias Gross]

About shipping to US - now it is FINAL

A large batch of IOND sensors for the US market has been produced and will be shipped along our huge shipment from Germany to US.

In case there was a delay with that air freight shipment this week (you never know) I bring these sensors PERSONALLY in my luggage when I fly this Saturday from Germany to our US warehouse!

 

[Matthias Gross]

About the costs per IOND measurement:

1000mL reference cost $31, you need around 15mL per measurement each fluid, these are around 65 measurements.
-> around 50 Cent, multiplied by 2 because you need 2 references
-> $1 per measurement

plus the sensor for $80, min. guaranteed lifetime are 90 days

-> worst case scenario is below $2 for a measurement


We understand that there might be cheaper options to measure 5 parameters at once for $2, if someone does not appreciate automatic measurements, the convenience and the possibility to automatically control these water parameters by automatic dosings based on the last measurements then the IOND is maybe not the right solution.

 

[IKD]

About the costs per IOND measurement:

1000mL reference cost $31, you need around 15mL per measurement each fluid, these are around 65 measurements.
-> around 50 Cent, multiplied by 2 because you need 2 references
-> $1 per measurement

plus the sensor for $80, min. guaranteed lifetime are 90 days

-> worst case scenario is below $2 for a measurement


We understand that there might be cheaper options to measure 5 parameters at once for $2, if someone does not appreciate automatic measurements, the convenience and the possibility to automatically control these water parameters by automatic dosings based on the last measurements then the IOND is maybe not the right solution.

Thank you. Are the new sensors to have a 90 day warranty? Just wanted to confirm as I may have misread what was written. You say ‘minimum’ but what will the official warranty duration be?

 

[Vinny@GHLUSA Verified Sponsor]

Thank you. Are the new sensors to have a 90 day warranty? Just wanted to confirm as I may have misread what was written. You say ‘minimum’ but what will the official warranty duration be?

90 days.

 

[areefer01]

About the costs per IOND measurement:

1000mL reference cost $31, you need around 15mL per measurement each fluid, these are around 65 measurements.
-> around 50 Cent, multiplied by 2 because you need 2 references
-> $1 per measurement

plus the sensor for $80, min. guaranteed lifetime are 90 days

-> worst case scenario is below $2 for a measurement


We understand that there might be cheaper options to measure 5 parameters at once for $2, if someone does not appreciate automatic measurements, the convenience and the possibility to automatically control these water parameters by automatic dosings based on the last measurements then the IOND is maybe not the right solution.

365 days per year / 90 day probe life expectancy = 4 probes per year (estimated). 4 x 80 US (estimate) = 320 US before tax or markup (MAP). Again estimates. This is probe alone not including reference fluid. Question would be how long does the probe last based on test(s) per day.

Not apples to apples because different test and measurements but another machine testing 3 things using brand specific reagents is 94 US pre tax 6 month kit or 188 per year using default 4, 2, 2 testing. Can use reversed engineered reagents for lower cost.

Ignoring the noise on what is best and personal bias the only thing I'd wonder is probe longevity and consistency with similar testing per day. Trends require data and data requires testing. If the probe lasts 90 days with multiple tests per day there shouldn't be much concern and 320 bucks is a small price to pay for trending.

Good luck Mr. Gross - sounds like you all worked very hard. Hopefully rewards follow.

 

[Macca_75]

365 days per year / 90 day probe life expectancy = 4 probes per year (estimated). 4 x 80 US (estimate) = 320 US before tax or markup (MAP). Again estimates. This is probe alone not including reference fluid. Question would be how long does the probe last based on test(s) per day.

Not apples to apples because different test and measurements but another machine testing 3 things using brand specific reagents is 94 US pre tax 6 month kit or 188 per year using default 4, 2, 2 testing. Can use reversed engineered reagents for lower cost.

Ignoring the noise on what is best and personal bias the only thing I'd wonder is probe longevity and consistency with similar testing per day. Trends require data and data requires testing. If the probe lasts 90 days with multiple tests per day there shouldn't be much concern and 320 bucks is a small price to pay for trending.

Good luck Mr. Gross - sounds like you all worked very hard. Hopefully rewards follow.

90 days is the warranty (minimum life) right? Could/should last longer? which drives the cost/test down (say a probe last a year for example)?

 

[BeanAnimal]

About the costs per IOND measurement:

1000mL reference cost $31, you need around 15mL per measurement each fluid, these are around 65 measurements.
-> around 50 Cent, multiplied by 2 because you need 2 references
-> $1 per measurement

plus the sensor for $80, min. guaranteed lifetime are 90 days

-> worst case scenario is below $2 for a measurement


We understand that there might be cheaper options to measure 5 parameters at once for $2, if someone does not appreciate automatic measurements, the convenience and the possibility to automatically control these water parameters by automatic dosings based on the last measurements then the IOND is maybe not the right solution.

Honestly not trying to be negative or play devils advocate here but want to add my perspective.

If I factor in general reality (a bad probe or two and the shipping, tax and shipping of consumable, calibration waste, multi-ion reference, etc.) That number is real world ~$3 or more a test. If we amortize the total cost with purchase and assume we get 3 years of testing once time a day out of the unit we are at $3.92 per test or $1430 per year and that is if things stay pretty "ideal".

When added to the consumables cost of the KH director the 'cost per test" to be able to see the (3) parameters that I really care about (Ca, Alk, Mag) rises even further to close to $5 or more per day.

It is a hard decision given that I have invested somewhere north of $5K in GHL equipment already, but I just can't wrap my head around spending that much money per test/day and feel that the consumables price is extremely prohibitive for my use case.

I think I will pass for now and see how others fare over the next year or so. Looking forward to seeing results now that backorders are starting to get filled.

 

[IKD]

I thought the warranty used to be

90 days.

This is a change from the original warranty correct? Wasn’t it 6 months (180 days) limited warranty? Will the 90 day still be a limited warranty?

Life-time GHL ION probe

Hello everyone, A poll to see how long your ION probe(s) lasted. Greetings, Matthijs

www.reef2reef.com

 

[areefer01]

About the costs per IOND measurement:

1000mL reference cost $31, you need around 15mL per measurement each fluid, these are around 65 measurements.
-> around 50 Cent, multiplied by 2 because you need 2 references
-> $1 per measurement

plus the sensor for $80, min. guaranteed lifetime are 90 days

-> worst case scenario is below $2 for a measurement


We understand that there might be cheaper options to measure 5 parameters at once for $2, if someone does not appreciate automatic measurements, the convenience and the possibility to automatically control these water parameters by automatic dosings based on the last measurements then the IOND is maybe not the right solution.

I've not seen any clarity around the probe guarantee vs number of tests per day or week. Does the number of tests have a direct correlation to the sensor life?

Pretty important.

 

[IKD]

I've not seen any clarity around the probe guarantee vs number of tests per day or week. Does the number of tests have a direct correlation to the sensor life?

Pretty important.

I found this older post (Nov ‘21) from an unofficial (but GHL guru, Gaël) that talks about water quality over # tests determining sensor life. This would have been the original sensors and maybe the new designs are different.

Has anyone that pre-ordered seen their ION Director yet?

I seen no value in this device, or any other automatic tester, if all your tank needs is weekly testing. It just doesn't make financial sense, including the time it takes to perform manual testing. Which is my situation, I only test weekly. I do test more often on an as needed basis. You may...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[BeanAnimal]

I think I have decided to try the Reefbot Lab, simply based on initial investment and ongoing consumables cost.

The only reluctance is that it is a disparate application outside of the GHL ecosystem. That said, The GHL charting and overall speed of the dashboard are an ongoing sore spot for me as much as I do like the hardware and general programing interface.

The goal is to leverage the GHL API (hopefully this is actually released soon) along with pulling data from ReefBot to build my own dashboard.

 

[areefer01]

I think I have decided to try the Reefbot Lab, simply based on initial investment and ongoing consumables cost.

The only reluctance is that it is a disparate application outside of the GHL ecosystem. That said, The GHL charting and overall speed of the dashboard are an ongoing sore spot for me as much as I do like the hardware and general programing interface.

The goal is to leverage the GHL API (hopefully this is actually released soon) along with pulling data from ReefBot to build my own dashboard.

If you haven't check out Grafana for the presentation layer and telegraf to collect the data. This is what I use with my Neptune Apex. Other options out there of course.

 

[BeanAnimal]

If you haven't check out Grafana for the presentation layer and telegraf to collect the data. This is what I use with my Neptune Apex. Other options out there of course.

I have not used Grafana - but have several other platforms (tableau, GDS, etc.) and JS front ends for dashboards. No experience with telegraf. I was likely just going to write my own data service, but will look into it too.

It is my understanding (may be wrong) that the custom web page option from Profilux 3 is not longer available in P4 - so hoping the API actually gets published and exposes the same data as the token did.

Thank you.

 

[Oiva]

Have anyone recived the new probe? Or is this still a unicorn.