Live Sand in RODI Water

[brandon429]

per their page, the item for sale I linked should not exist. the one where a single source covers both marine and freshwater.

 

[nereefpat]

how are the bac that seed for marine/salty not dying if they're mixed with ones for freshwater, or, maybe one strain does both without osmotic issues, but its right there in one bottle.

fresh vs salt isn't as extreme as its being painted, or bathroom cleaner could just be salty tap water. for every claimed limitation for bacteria, an opposing proof exists

Do you believe that product is simply a culture of bacteria dumped into 0 TDS RODI water, with no buffer?

Have you done plating in a micro lab? Do dilution tubes contain pure RODI water, or are they buffered?

Paying money for bacteria, via live sand or in a bottle, and then attempting to store that bacteria in RODI water is quite a gamble.

 

[brandon429]

Yes I have done some lab time for sure. I wanted to introduce things that are opposite to claims about the limitations of bac. Im always on the side they're tougher than being given credit for, we're still debating unmeasured items/safe zoning. If you claim to know the mechanism for the bottle bac double ability, and why after seeding they can never look upon the other side again, then you're likely right about some minor freshwater contact totally sterilizing sand, last step is the measure and post. until then, we're all doing equal guessing.

 

[ca1ore]

I think what the OP proposes is fine ...... live sand does essentially nothing anyhow except save you some sand washing labor LOL.

 

[fish farmer]

how are the bac that seed for marine/salty not dying if they're mixed with ones for freshwater, or, maybe one strain does both without osmotic issues, but its right there in one bottle.

fresh vs salt isn't as extreme as its being painted, or bathroom cleaner could just be salty tap water. for every claimed limitation for bacteria, an opposing proof exists

Brandon, based on your link....there is a freshwater AND a marine quick start for sale. But there is a bigger bottle available from Chewy that states it can work in both. All I gather from that is different strains with some overlap...even with my link with salinity ranges has the cutoff at 6ppt. I've done limited internet research regarding converting a marine tank into a brackish tank and what I found was the nitrobacter shifts at 12ppt (1.009 sg ) and live rock wouldn't work below 20ppt (1.015 sg).

 

[brandon429]

its neat stuff to interject into bioarguments thank you for those cutoff points I hadnt seen those before. i always thought it seemed odd the two strains can originate together but never mix environments again after seeding... really am not sure of the final results.



Team, one bag of sand, a cheap bucket of saltwater some liquid ammonia and a canister filter to use the sand as media and we have article gold, any takers

the hard data pre and post soak, it would get you a lot of views for sure

 

[lapin]

From what I have read a lot of bacteria such as (Nitrosospira, Nitrosomonas europaea/Nitrosococcus mobilis, Nitrosomonas communis, Nitrosomonas marina, Nitrosomonas oligotropha, Nitrosomonas cryotolerans and Nitrosomonas) can live in both fresh and salt water environments and provide nitrification. They can also adapt to be resistant to antibiotics.
A test by one of our reefing people would be a nice addition.

 

[brandon429]

I didn't know they'd co express or be seeded off one mixture until seeing those bottles. Freshwater keepers for 50 + years have been filling up tanks with glass or epoxy substrate, plastic plants, waiting 30 days, then adding a bunch of livebearers successfully. getting cross contamination-only cycling for freshwater is easy

but marine is wild west...nobody is even sure it can be done that way for marine tanks but ive read from old timers on here they did that in the 80s w bare skeleton systems...the act of filling saltwater brings in bac via vectoring, and they multiply given X amnt of days.

Our hobby cannot answer how long it takes or if ever a marine system to self-cycle without our help. (finished cycle meaning ability to oxidize some small amnt of ammonia in 24)

our hobby is 1000% sure that without manmade offerings, many of them for sale, marine bacteria can never ever show up and if they do, they'll die quite easy if we mess with them. we need to test all that. brs could do it easily they have a whole store of testing setups.