Don't leave, just don't mislead. Probiotics have helped my IBS immensely over the years, as doctors never could, so it's a touchy subject and I don't take well to many saying probiotics are junk science. Even simple yogurt is probiotic in nature and is scientifically proven to help, even peer reviewer.
Maintenance bacteria
- Thread starter Charley
- Start date
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The issue with most human probiotics is short term storage and diversity. Single strain probiotics never did much for me. Most probiotics come with a low volume too. Same as everything, some bacteria are better at certain things, that goes with gut flora too. What bacteria us used depends on what you are fighting or trying to accomplish. I assume it's the same in a saltwater tank. High cfu and diversity is what helped my issues the most, even simple Activia added to a fruit smoothie with natural protein powder, that also has probiotics, helped.
KrisReef
10K Club member
I encouraged my daughter to study gut biome but she wants to be an MD and not do lab research for a living. I secretly wished she would do similar research on Reef microbes but that ain't gonna happen. 
That aside, these discussions are a bit bothersome in that terms like "good" bacteria vs. "bad" bacteria get tossed about with only anecdotal information about user-reported results with rarely any proper identity of the specific bacterial critter being discussed.
To digress further, gut biome research is a very young science and a fantastically interesting field. Lots to be learned about bacterial roles in guts and in reef tanks. It is a bold new frontier where fecal transplants are gaining validity. Can't make this stuff up.
Someday soon there should be aquarium products available with bacterial strain mixture(s) listed on the bottle ingredients. We have some products now but their application is probably closer to the essential oils market than to a fecal transplant in many instances. I'm glad these products are available now and I trust that improved or better available products will be on the market shortly. It's certainly not all thieves oil and I've seen good results myself but what's in the bottle is still a proprietary mystery.
How often has it been said; "Don't add what you can't test for?"
End of rant. I'm going back into solitary now.
That aside, these discussions are a bit bothersome in that terms like "good" bacteria vs. "bad" bacteria get tossed about with only anecdotal information about user-reported results with rarely any proper identity of the specific bacterial critter being discussed.
To digress further, gut biome research is a very young science and a fantastically interesting field. Lots to be learned about bacterial roles in guts and in reef tanks. It is a bold new frontier where fecal transplants are gaining validity. Can't make this stuff up.
Someday soon there should be aquarium products available with bacterial strain mixture(s) listed on the bottle ingredients. We have some products now but their application is probably closer to the essential oils market than to a fecal transplant in many instances. I'm glad these products are available now and I trust that improved or better available products will be on the market shortly. It's certainly not all thieves oil and I've seen good results myself but what's in the bottle is still a proprietary mystery.
How often has it been said; "Don't add what you can't test for?"
End of rant. I'm going back into solitary now.
In my years of research (personal and while I had college access to peer review) I found several scientific articles about gut flora and the appendix. It seems the appendix was determined to be a sink for storing and producing beneficial bacteria for the human intestines which may go back to the beginning of man kind to deal with food poisoning of undercooked food or other bad food handling issues before it was common knowledge.I encouraged my daughter to study gut biome but she wants to be an MD and not do lab research for a living. I secretly wished she would do similar research on Reef microbes but that ain't gonna happen.
That aside, these discussions are a bit bothersome in that terms like "good" bacteria vs. "bad" bacteria get tossed about with only anecdotal information about user-reported results with rarely any proper identity of the specific bacterial critter being discussed.
To digress further, gut biome research is a very young science and a fantastically interesting field. Lots to be learned about bacterial roles in guts and in reef tanks. It is a bold new frontier where fecal transplants are gaining validity. Can't make this stuff up.
Someday soon there should be aquarium products available with bacterial strain mixture(s) listed on the bottle ingredients. We have some products now but their application is probably closer to the essential oils market than to a fecal transplant in many instances. I'm glad these products are available now and I trust that improved or better available products will be on the market shortly. It's certainly not all thieves oil and I've seen good results myself but what's in the bottle is still a proprietary mystery.
How often has it been said; "Don't add what you can't test for?"
End of rant. I'm going back into solitary now.
It is interesting science and needs to be honestly studied for the benefit of humans. Same goes for stuff like curcummin, vitamin C, D, E, Etc... I'd join the research but I can't do school as it's too stressful and causes health issues so I stick to being a lowly mechanic, was hard enough to go to school for that.
You may or may not be aware, but the VAST majority of all the different bacteria species present in a typical healthy reef aquarium can't currently be cultured. So when you buy a bottled bacteria product to help start a new system/speed up the cycle time, you basically get nitrifiers and possibly some denitrifiers(?). If a system is set up properly, these will populate and maintain themselves on various substrates (unless the environment is drastically perturbed for some reason). But the vast majority of the hundreds of different types of bacteria come in with live rock and/or live sand. Many have functions in a system that are only now being explored/understood.
End effect is 'It's your money' so if you still think that adding bottled bacteria on a regular basis to an established reef aquarium is something beneficial, have at it. Personally, I'd be much more inclined to add an infusion of live rock/live sand if my system ever had an event that seriously disrupted the bacterial community.
Piranhapat
Active Member
It does work to help jump start a new tank cycle. But I always wonder how the bacteria stays alive in bottle. They say bacteria needs a surface to grow on and live. So how can it stay alive in Bottle with nothing to attach too. Also bacteria not in the water. Anybody no how?
I believe some manufacturers state the bacteria are in a state of dormancy. How they do that is beyond me. Something about when added to water makes them wake up. Don't take my word on this as truth though, I just thought I read that somewhere at some point.
I'd like to see a test done. Say a tank was started with dry rock and something like biospira or the like. Maybe do a aquabiomics test say a week after adding the bacteria. Then run the tank normally for say a year then do another aquabiomics test. Then add live rock from the ocean from say TBS or LR&R and test again 6 months later to see if there is a difference.
Charley
Active Member
Interesting.......if that is true..... then logically i should go out and get some natural seawater.....strain and adjust as necessary to get the good bacteria that live in the ocean?
You could do that, but the bacterial strains that live in the open ocean (or anywhere else not reef related) are not necessarily the ones that are found near a coral reef. That's why live rock and live sand from reef related areas are recommended.
