Most readily consumed trace elements?

[PDR]

Just curious if there are certain trace elements that can be tested for that tend to be consumed faster than the others.

For example, if X is still within normal parameters then the rest are most likely as well. Let's assume an average medium demand mixed reef.

 

[Gareth elliott]

The only readily available hobby test kits i see are strontium, iodine, and iron.

Strontium can be used in making carbonate skeletons, i have never tested for it but could be some benefit.
Iodine has no known biological use. And iron test kits do not test low enough for most uses.
Icp testing does offer a window into a lot more of those we dont have kits for.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Just curious if there are certain trace elements that can be tested for that tend to be consumed faster than the others.

For example, if X is still within normal parameters then the rest are most likely as well. Let's assume an average medium demand mixed reef.

Unlikely to be as simple as this. Some are depleted quite fast, but unless you are dosing, you are unlikely to detect any. Iron and manganese, for example.

 

[PDR]

Unlikely to be as simple as this. Some are depleted quite fast, but unless you are dosing, you are unlikely to detect any. Iron and manganese, for example.

I kind of figured as much, but thought I'd ask anyway.

Thanks for the reply

 

[PDR]

Iodine has no known biological use.

I've never heard that before, if anything I keep reading how important it is. Can you elaborate?

Thanks

 

[Gareth elliott]

I've never heard that before, if anything I keep reading how important it is. Can you elaborate?

Thanks

Sorry was thinking lithium typing iodine, need sleep lol

 

[madweazl]

Sorry was thinking lithium typing iodine, need sleep lol

Largely the same for iodine; some people believe it makes a difference but there is little evidence to show it.

 

[tiggs]

I was always under the assumption that iodine is beneficial to crustaceans during their molt. Has this been disproven?

 

[Gareth elliott]

Even proven biological roles for iodine require very small amounts. A person taking a large sip of sea water is getting their daily requirement even at
.06 ppm in nsw. The hobby test kit for this doesn’t test this low and it can be toxic above this level.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I was always under the assumption that iodine is beneficial to crustaceans during their molt. Has this been disproven?

"Disproven" is perhaps too strong, but there's no apparent evidence other than that dosing it often causes a molt, and I see little reason to think it is needed for that.

Shrimp are often implicated, but folks who aquaculture shrimp for food, do not seem to ever discuss or dose iodine, and even grow them in fresh water a lot of the time.

It's easier to "prove" that crustaceans seem to thrive in reef tanks without supplemental iodine, that that doesn't mean there isn't any available in foods, since there typically is. I grew shrimp and crabs for years both before and after dosing supplemental iodine (then stopping) and saw no difference in them.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Largely the same for iodine; some people believe it makes a difference but there is little evidence to show it.

There are some organisms that have a clear need in the scientific literature (e.g., some gorgonia), but corals do not seem to have an established need or use for iodine. That doesn't mean there isn't one, but folks should be open minded to the benefit of iodine not being correct unless they have shown a clear benefit in their own tank.

I would also add that, depending on what you dose, adding supplemental iodine and observing an effect may be unrelated to the iodine itself. Dosing Lugols, for example, will have an impact on the speciation of certain trace metals because it is an oxidizer. Many trace metals can be in multiple forms (e.g., ferrous and ferric iron) and the two have different solubility and bioavailability. Dosing Lugols may drive the ferrous iron to the ferric form, at least temporarily. So folks should be cautious in concluding that iodine is having an effect when it may be possible that the effect was caused by other processes following a dosing.

 

[Cory]

Most readily consumed trace elements are:

Iron
Iodine
Molybdenum
Strontium
Silicate
Maganese

Not in any particular order and perhaps some are not trace elements

 

[taricha]

Here's a tracking of Iodide in my tank.
I added none for a few months (except what comes in with food and water change), then dosed some.
Haven't been able to point to changed consumption in other things when there was Iodine available or not.

Is iodide rapidly consumed and depleted? for sure!
Is it all luxury uptake that doesn't change the growth rate of anything? probably.

 

[Cory]

Here's a tracking of Iodide in my tank.
I added none for a few months (except what comes in with food and water change), then dosed some.
Haven't been able to point to changed consumption in other things when there was Iodine available or not.

Is iodide rapidly consumed and depleted? for sure!
Is it all luxury uptake that doesn't change the growth rate of anything? probably.

Did the gorgonian come back after iodine?

 

[taricha]

Did the gorgonian come back after iodine?

I was vague and misleading.
The dying gorgonian frag was because i cut some that was growing too fast and wasn't careful about where the frags ended up. Some fell into other corals and lost a lot of tissue from that.
Three testy of the gorgs seemed happy at all points in the process.

 

[PDR]

Here's a tracking of Iodide in my tank.
I added none for a few months (except what comes in with food and water change), then dosed some.
Haven't been able to point to changed consumption in other things when there was Iodine available or not.

Is iodide rapidly consumed and depleted? for sure!
Is it all luxury uptake that doesn't change the growth rate of anything? probably.

What test were you using to track the iodine?

 

[taricha]

What test were you using to track the iodine?

Seachem iodide test kit run through Hanna Silica meter.
Details here. https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/iodide-test-seachem-kit-and-hanna-silica-meter.391003

Three testy of the gorgs seemed happy at all points in the process.

Awful autocorrect. "*The rest* of the gorgs seemed happy at all points...."

 

[PDR]

Seachem iodide test kit run through Hanna Silica meter.
Details here. https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/iodide-test-seachem-kit-and-hanna-silica-meter.391003

Thats pretty cool!

Kind of on topic, but has anyone ever used the Red Sea iodine test kit? If so, is it fairly accurate or not worth it?

 

[Hans-Werner]

Iodine tests are difficult. If the Seachem iodide test is specific for iodide it may not find the complete iodine since part of it, and it may be the major part, is in the state of iodate. Iodate is the normal oxidation state in surface waters. Part (I think a small part) of it is reduced by algae to iodide. This may be a process to transfer energy from the photosynthetic apparatus to iodate and protect the photosynthetic apparatus from bleaching in this way.

Iron may be hidden to test kits by bacterial chelators like for example siderophores.

What I want to say, to my knowledge there is no trace element that can by tested for by the layman with sufficient precision. Usually even ICP-OES can't find most of the trace metals in reef tanks. For some of the trace metals the assumption that they are consumed in proportion to calcium by scleractinians and corallinaceans may come close to the true consumption in reef tanks.

 

[Stigigemla]

In my experience the Iodine value is not very important. I have (and some of my customers) seen increased purple color in birdsnest corals through adding Iodate. But thats only in tanks with zero iodate in the testing.
= 0,01 or 0,06 ppm seems to be unimportant. I dont think it affects growth much which might be a reason why scientists dont think of it as a necessity. Refugiums, especially with Caulerpa seems to consume Iodine. Chaetomorpha maybe much less.
Giesemann Iodine test is much easier to use than Salifert. Maybe it is only sold in Europe.