My quarantine

Symptoms or not, I do copper for all fish that aren’t sensitive to copper. If unsure, I check w the folks here. The type of copper I have (Cupramine) has a 14 day treatment cycle. Then I transfer to sterile qt. Then 2 rounds of prazi. Then homey sterile qt for 30 days of observation w no meds.
I try to follow this:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/my-current-qt-process.483371/

Oh wow you really are extreme. I believe I’ll follow a similar process not sure if I’ll use prazzi though? Is it mainly for flukes or??? I added the two clownfish out of my main 40 gal to the QT it makes me so nervous now that I’ve lost a few fish and do not want it to happen again. They are breathing a little heavy but are swimming around. Probably just a little stressed because trying to catch the little buggers was nearly impossible.
 
Oh wow you really are extreme. I believe I’ll follow a similar process not sure if I’ll use prazzi though? Is it mainly for flukes or??? I added the two clownfish out of my main 40 gal to the QT it makes me so nervous now that I’ve lost a few fish and do not want it to happen again. They are breathing a little heavy but are swimming around. Probably just a little stressed because trying to catch the little buggers was nearly impossible.

I’ve had 3 tank crashes in 2 yrs.
Crash 1 - no qt
Crash 2 - too short qt
Crash 3 - cross contamination
I’ve had Ich, Velvet, Flukes, an infection from flukes, and an undetermined illness. Luckily, not all made it into DT. Ich did. So did Velvet. Both resulted in loss of most fish. I was going to give up and tear down my 55g. Then I found R2R and decided to upgrade lol.

To answer your questions: Yes. Prazi is for Flukes. And intestinal worms. It’s a dewormer. Seems to me that Copper and prazi cover the 2 common issues: external parasites and worms. Assume that’s why their both recommended. The protocol I linked is for NEW fish w who knows what.
No need for prazi to address Ich or Velvet.

Words of caution w copper: do not use a any other meds. Or water conditioner. Test copper levels DAILY. it’s going to be hard keeping 5.5g tank aerated for 2 fish. Usually would have powerhead causing ripple at surface of water to increase oxygen in water. Assume no powerhead in such a small tank? Add air stone. Or HOB filter causing waterfall and ripple. DO NOT SKIP oxygenating tank.
 
wow I can’t imagine. I’m devastated over losing a few dish let alone a whole tank. Same as you I started with no QT and now am. Hopefully I’ll skip that 2nd crash’s reason of not long enough Qt. I have a hob filter that causes a large ripple on the top of the tank. Also a air stone. Yes I do no not to add any conditioner etc to copper as it strips it down making it highly toxic to the fish!
 
wow I can’t imagine. I’m devastated over losing a few dish let alone a whole tank. Same as you I started with no QT and now am. Hopefully I’ll skip that 2nd crash’s reason of not long enough Qt. I have a hob filter that causes a large ripple on the top of the tank. Also a air stone. Yes I do no not to add any conditioner etc to copper as it strips it down making it highly toxic to the fish!

Good good.

I didn’t know. Luckily, someone on here mentioned it before it was too late for me. I had no idea.

Good luck w the clowns. Keep us posted :)
 
I'd add a seachem ammonia alert badge since most ammonia test kits don't work if there is copper in the water. Also be careful having rock in thee qt, I believe it can absorb meds and add some difficulty to dosing as well as leech the meds back out later if you were to move the rock into the DT after QT without properly cleaning them.

You may want to wait for someone who knows more than I do to chime in on that though, I'm still getting my first fish through 30 days of observational qt.
 
I'd add a seachem ammonia alert badge since most ammonia test kits don't work if there is copper in the water. Also be careful having rock in thee qt, I believe it can absorb meds and add some difficulty to dosing as well as leech the meds back out later if you were to move the rock into the DT after QT without properly cleaning them.

You may want to wait for someone who knows more than I do to chime in on that though, I'm still getting my first fish through 30 days of observational qt.

Oh that’s a good idea. I knew about the ammonia alert badges but didn’t know that normal test kits may not work with copper. I’ll definitely pick some of those up. I do know about the rock, Seachem cupramine says that it does not get absorbed through the rock but you never know so I’m planning to take it out before I start copper anyways. Just gave the fish a place to hide for now.
 
Good good.

I didn’t know. Luckily, someone on here mentioned it before it was too late for me. I had no idea.

Good luck w the clowns. Keep us posted :)
Thank you and sure will! Will have a update tomorrow morning most likely. [emoji3]
 
Oh that’s a good idea. I knew about the ammonia alert badges but didn’t know that normal test kits may not work with copper. I’ll definitely pick some of those up. I do know about the rock, Seachem cupramine says that it does not get absorbed through the rock but you never know so I’m planning to take it out before I start copper anyways. Just gave the fish a place to hide for now.
I picked up some PVC elbows at the local hardware store and scrubbed them with RODI for a few minutes before putting them in the tank, my Plectranthias seem's to enjoy them but I must admit It doesn't look very "homey" but I don't have to worry about absorption or difficulties with sterilization.

I don't want to flood your thread with bad cell phone pictures so heres a link to my qt, lots of tips in there from the people that actually know what they are doing:D
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/first-quarantine-am-i-ready.596223/page-3#post-6080496
 
Just be careful with that copper in such a small volume QT. Seems like it would be real easy to over dose.
 
Woke up this morning and went and checked on the clownfish. Everything seems to be doing good!
 
Oh wow you really are extreme. I believe I’ll follow a similar process not sure if I’ll use prazzi though? Is it mainly for flukes or??? I added the two clownfish out of my main 40 gal to the QT it makes me so nervous now that I’ve lost a few fish and do not want it to happen again. They are breathing a little heavy but are swimming around. Probably just a little stressed because trying to catch the little buggers was nearly impossible.

Here’s the dilemma with flukes:

  1. They are very prevalent these days
  2. They are hard to spot sometimes. Even after a freshwater dip it’s sometimes hard to see them if there are only a few. A few usually become a few hundred fairly quickly.
  3. Prazipro is pretty non-toxic to fish and inverts and targets the flukes.
  4. After treatment, an infected fish will often develop infections from the fluke attachment.
You can treat all fish prophylactically in quarantine and be ready to treat the infection if it shows up. If you wait and find flukes after they’ve gone to the display, you can treat in the display for the flukes, but if a fish develops an infection, you’ll likely need to rescue them and treat for a few days in Kanaplex or other antibiotic back in QT. I’d say 1 out of 3 fish I’ve treated have developed secondary infections after clearing the flukes.

Flukes is the only time where I go for prophylactic treatment, but either approach is totally rational.
 
I'd add a seachem ammonia alert badge since most ammonia test kits don't work if there is copper in the water. Also be careful having rock in thee qt, I believe it can absorb meds and add some difficulty to dosing as well as leech the meds back out later if you were to move the rock into the DT after QT without properly cleaning them.

You may want to wait for someone who knows more than I do to chime in on that though, I'm still getting my first fish through 30 days of observational qt.

Following, setting up my QT this weekend as well.
FWIW, my understanding is that as a best practice, you don't ever put rock from a QT back into a DT.
 
Following along. Will TTM after 14 days of copper work on velvet too?
 
5 gallons is also too small to be an effective quarantine for any but the smallest fish.

Also, you mentioned losing a Tang.

Neither your QT nor your dislay are adequate for that fish...stress would eventually have ruined that party if that's not what did in your tang.

Don't get too hung up on "the miracles of QT" and forget the basics: too many fish, or too big of fish in too small of a tank creates stress.

Stress is something you want to remove from new fish, not something you want to give them more of.

All you have to do is look at the very few threads created by the people who advocate QT with such vigor and see that they have problems just like people who don't QT. They lose whole loads of fish, etc.

QT has its place, but it is (clearly) not a miracle, it is not a panacea.

QT is a tool that can be used for either good or for harm just like any other tool.

QT gets promoted so hard that all of the downsides usually get totally overlooked, white washed, glossed over.

Everything about QT is stressful, so it should not be performed lightly.

There are definitely some fish that are healthy enough when purchased that they should not be quarantined, and if they are they end up in worse shape than before.

If you treat every single fish you buy, this is a fact for how you treat fish. You are sometimes taking healthy fish and making them worse.

If you don't do anything to identify these healthy fish upfront (And, perhaps more importantly, you also do nothing to identify the sick fish either.), then it is on you if these formerly healthy fish die in treatment.

The fact that this aspect is not promoted with equal vigor to quarantining is not the fishes fault or my fault. But it will be the truth if you quarantine and medicate every fish that you get without thinking.

If you are in the position where you have to buy your fish sight unseen, and you also happen to be in a position where you have to buy your fish in bulk quantities as opposed to bringing them home one at a time, then you should probably quarantine every fish that you get because you are getting what amounts to wholesale quality fish. (In case that sounds like a bonus, it's not...you're paying full retail for lesser quality.)

However, if you are in a position to identify each and every individual fish that you plan to bring home and put a new tank, then quarantining and medicating every single one of them would be a foolish second step.

The better idea is to keep shopping for a fish that are healthy enough to bring home, and to get good at identifying the fish that should not come home. Skip meds, maybe even skip observation. If you are in this position, your best bet is to gain plenty of experience in observation while the fish are still at the store and to give each new addition to your tank at least a few weeks (or more!) before the next addition.

Of course not everyone is in that position these days, so good luck if that scenario doesn't apply to you.

You will need luck and a bigger more naturalistic QT tank if that's the road you're heading down. :)

I would also recommend a microscope. This is a tool that is absolutely requisite in identifying pathogen's before treatment, but which barely merits a mention by the qt guides. I have never understood this — the excuses for it that I have heard are weak. @Paul B (of all people) has written more about using a scope on fish than anyone else I can name off-hand if you want some posts to look up. if you go outside the hobby, there are actually lots of guides on YouTube and other websites for fish autopsy.
 
5 gallons is also too small to be an effective quarantine for any but the smallest fish.

Also, you mentioned losing a Tang.

Neither your QT nor your dislay are adequate for that fish...stress would eventually have ruined that party if that's not what did in your tang.

Don't get too hung up on "the miracles of QT" and forget the basics: too many fish, or too big of fish in too small of a tank creates stress.

Stress is something you want to remove from new fish, not something you want to give them more of.

All you have to do is look at the very few threads created by the people who advocate QT with such vigor and see that they have problems just like people who don't QT. They lose whole loads of fish, etc.

QT has its place, but it is (clearly) not a miracle, it is not a panacea.

QT is a tool that can be used for either good or for harm just like any other tool.

QT gets promoted so hard that all of the downsides usually get totally overlooked, white washed, glossed over.

Everything about QT is stressful, so it should not be performed lightly.

There are definitely some fish that are healthy enough when purchased that they should not be quarantined, and if they are they end up in worse shape than before.

If you treat every single fish you buy, this is a fact for how you treat fish. You are sometimes taking healthy fish and making them worse.

If you don't do anything to identify these healthy fish upfront (And, perhaps more importantly, you also do nothing to identify the sick fish either.), then it is on you if these formerly healthy fish die in treatment.

The fact that this aspect is not promoted with equal vigor to quarantining is not the fishes fault or my fault. But it will be the truth if you quarantine and medicate every fish that you get without thinking.

If you are in the position where you have to buy your fish sight unseen, and you also happen to be in a position where you have to buy your fish in bulk quantities as opposed to bringing them home one at a time, then you should probably quarantine every fish that you get because you are getting what amounts to wholesale quality fish. (In case that sounds like a bonus, it's not...you're paying full retail for lesser quality.)

However, if you are in a position to identify each and every individual fish that you plan to bring home and put a new tank, then quarantining and medicating every single one of them would be a foolish second step.

The better idea is to keep shopping for a fish that are healthy enough to bring home, and to get good at identifying the fish that should not come home. Skip meds, maybe even skip observation. If you are in this position, your best bet is to gain plenty of experience in observation while the fish are still at the store and to give each new addition to your tank at least a few weeks (or more!) before the next addition.

Of course not everyone is in that position these days, so good luck if that scenario doesn't apply to you.

You will need luck and a bigger more naturalistic QT tank if that's the road you're heading down. :)

I would also recommend a microscope. This is a tool that is absolutely requisite in identifying pathogen's before treatment, but which barely merits a mention by the qt guides. I have never understood this — the excuses for it that I have heard are weak. @Paul B (of all people) has written more about using a scope on fish than anyone else I can name off-hand if you want some posts to look up. if you go outside the hobby, there are actually lots of guides on YouTube and other websites for fish autopsy.


Glad to have you back!
 

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