New to Copperband Butterfly

jy808 · Mar 18, 2020

After much deliberation, I finally pulled the trigger and purchased a copperband butterfly. I understand the challenges that lie ahead so I am taking my every action with caution. I seek advice in hopes that it goes into my DT healthy and eating!

Scratching
So it's currently in my QT, and after an hour I have already noticed it scratching itself against the rocks. I did not do a freshwater dip as I was afraid how stressed it could get. When would be an appropriate time to do so, as I do not want to stress it so much as I've only just acclimated it to my QT parameters. Would medication be a better choice? At this stage it is not showing white spots so it could possibly be flukes, or are there other diseases that the copperband are susceptible to?

QT
My QT is only 14g. I understand they do require alot of room, but this is the only QT I have. How likely will it survive a 14g for 72 days? The filtration in the QT also isn't great as it has no sump. It is currently showing high Nitrite levels, between 0.25 - 0.50 ppm. How picky are these fish with water parameters?

Really hope the experienced copperband owners could guide me through the process!

Old Fritz · Mar 18, 2020

Their issue is almost always ich (ime anyways). Do a freshwater dip to confirm. I've never had any issues doing freshwater dips before adding them to a new tank just match pH and alkalinity using seachem buffer.

Treatment with copper should last a month. Then prazipro or general cure for 2 weeks.

Recommend either getting fresh foods from your grocery store (that may be difficult these days) or I recommend San Francisco Bay angel and butterfly food it has worked wonders for me

ReefHog · Mar 18, 2020

I recently QTd a CBB along with a Moorish Idol. They were medicated with Chloroquine Phosphate for 14 days in a 20gal with no tank size issues. Then transferred to a 29 gal observation tank for 30 days with black mollies and treated with praziquantel. Mine were eating at LFS before I bought them so I just needed to keep them eating. They ate mysis, clam slices and live black worms. I did have quite a few mini hunger strikes. It was very frustrating as one day the CBB would eat Mysis like crazy then a week later he wouldn’t touch them. Same with worms and clams. I just kept at it. He’s eating clam slices and Mysis very good now. Won’t touch live black worms anymore. He destroyed a few rocks with Aiptasia. I found feeding several (4or 5) times a day what he would eat worked best. I also found that when he wasn’t eating from the water column he would sometimes eat from plastic tweezers.

jy808 · Mar 18, 2020

Old Fritz said:
Their issue is almost always ich (ime anyways). Do a freshwater dip to confirm. I've never had any issues doing freshwater dips before adding them to a new tank just match pH and alkalinity using seachem buffer.

Treatment with copper should last a month. Then prazipro or general cure for 2 weeks.

Recommend either getting fresh foods from your grocery store (that may be difficult these days) or I recommend San Francisco Bay angel and butterfly food it has worked wonders for me

I had always wondered if they were similar to the blue tangs in terms of proneness to ich?

Big G · Mar 18, 2020

CBBs are notorious for developing those "red sores" on their sides and the prognosis is rapid and usually not good. Keeping NFG powder on hand "before" you have the fish is a real good move.

jy808 · Mar 18, 2020

I've come home just now from the LFS with some new RO water, to find alot of it's scales along the bed of the QT! Something is definitely bothering it.

I am going to do a freshwater dip now, and if that doesn't help ease the itching should I go ahead and do the copper treatment regardless?

jy808 · Mar 18, 2020

Ok guys. Just did about a 3-4 minute fresh water dip and this was what remained. Any idea what it is?

ReefHog · Mar 18, 2020

I’m sure you’ll hear from the experts but looks like flukes to me. There’s good treatment info over on the disease forum.

jy808 · Mar 18, 2020

This will be my first case of flukes!

Well im planning my next course of action:
1) immediately treat it with copper first?
or
2) immediately purchase prazipro and treat?
or
3) keep doing fresh water dips?
or
4) do nothing for now and see how it goes after that fresh water dip?

It's currently idling in one area and not swimming around. It is probably very stressed after all that.
Also has not eaten, but maybe due to the flukes.

Big G · Mar 18, 2020

Flukes.
There are 3 types of flukes. FW dips remove the skin flukes the easiest. The other two really need long duration prazi or hypo.

Flukes – General Guidelines

Many thanks to "Newsmyrna80" for writing this. Reposted with her permission. Some facts: Flukes are not true flukes. They are actually parasitic flatworms belonging to the class of Monogeans. There are 13 families of flukes. However, only three families infect saltwater fish. 1...

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CBBs are notorious for not eating and slowly fading. Black or White worms. Masstick with food mixed and smeared on a rock, tank wall, etc.

jy808 · Mar 19, 2020

I don't have prazipro where I'm from, but purchased something similar that contains the active ingredient praziquantel.

I had dosed the QT last night and waiting to see results.

It's been 2 days in the QT and still hasn't eaten. I have tried mysis and brine so far (while it had flukes).

Would fish normally be lethargic and not eat while dosed with praziquantel?

Masstick looks like a decent product that I want to try, will search for some and give it a go. Was also thinking nori and frozen blood worms.

Paul B · Mar 19, 2020

I am sorry, but copperbands do not do well in quarantine. Especially in a 14 gallon tank. You did good to eliminate the flukes though.

Quarantine people may be able to guide you through quarantining a copperband. I have been keeping them since the 70s.
Live worms like whiteworms are the best foods but if they don't want to eat, they won't eat and he may never eat in a small quarantine tank.
Sorry again..

ReefHog · Mar 19, 2020

When my CBB would not eat from water column I would use long plastic tweezers with PE Mysis and thin clam slices. Sometimes I’d have to hold it there for a minute or longer as he would just look at it for a while. Eventually he would grab a piece. Then two. Then three and so on. I also rubber banded half a clam shell to a piece of live rock and left it on the bottom for him for half the day. He would pick at that off and on. By far the hardest fish to get through quarantine. And mine was already eating at the lfs.

jy808 · Mar 19, 2020

How long did you quarantine it for?

ReefHog said:
When my CBB would not eat from water column I would use long plastic tweezers with PE Mysis and thin clam slices. Sometimes I’d have to hold it there for a minute or longer as he would just look at it for a while. Eventually he would grab a piece. Then two. Then three and so on. I also rubber banded half a clam shell to a piece of live rock and left it on the bottom for him for half the day. He would pick at that off and on. By far the hardest fish to get through quarantine. And mine was already eating at the lfs.

How long did you quarantine it for?

ReefHog · Mar 19, 2020

Two weeks in 20 gallon with Chloroquine Phosphate. Then four weeks in 29 gallon observation with sand and live rock covered with Aiptasia. It’s my understanding if they’re not eating when you get them it’s an uphill battle. I had a hard time and he was eating. I won’t call it a success until he’s a year old.

Fish4udog · Mar 19, 2020

Have a CBB best investment was a cleaner wrasse always cleaning him have had mine 4yrs

jy808 · Mar 20, 2020

Just a little bit of an update.

After dosing with praziquantel, I've done a 25% water change. After a few hours the CBB has reacted to the masstick that was put in the tank but still refuses to eat it. Although it does not seem as lethargic as before and is more curious with its surroundings which is somewhat of a better sign.

It's day 3 in the QT and still not eating. There is leftover masstick and mysis left uneaten in the tank so I'm going to try syphon that out soon.

My next step is to try live black worms, then a clam. I really hope it bites.

Onto my next issue. As i woke up this morning i noticed 2 spots on its tail and one on its fin. Funny enough i have seen this quite regularly on CBB at 2 LFS that i have visited so thought this is rather common for the CBB? Any advice on what it could be?

I have yet to add any copper into the QT as there were no signs of ich yet, but if i did have to put copper i would want it to eat first.

Is it recommended that i put copper regardless (at a therapeutic amount) for the CBB?

Fish4udog · Mar 20, 2020

Mine took a couple days but he would eat frozen brine, mysis and plankton

Big G · Mar 20, 2020

Very common for CBBs to present lymphocystis.

Lymphocystis

Lymphocystis What You Need To Know: * This is a virus that many fish carry for life. The white nodules (cauliflower-like growths) can grow both externally and internally; so symptoms are not always visible. * There is no known cure for Lympho. However, feeding vitamin-enriched foods and...

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