New to Saltwater. Need advice.

fi.na.tine · Jul 16, 2014

OK - Having some issues and about to the point where I am about to throw in the towel on this.

Quick summary - 300 gallon tank, 90 gallon sump. Right around 150lbs live rock with a sandy substrate. Aqua UV 57W, Aquamaxx 350 skimmer, RO/DI unit from spectrapure that had issues and needed to be returned - since, using water from LFS until that resolves. Tank levels have always been good without any great swings up or down (ammonia/nitrate/nitrites have never been a problem - Ph got thrown off once but been good since, and SG is 1.026 - we try to keep that at 1.025 but got thrown off due to our RO breaking. (Seem kinda big for a starter? Well go big, or go home - I guess that was my thinking.)
(And if I make an error - feel free to point it out. Takes a lot to hurt my feelers.)

Started this all in December - Got the tank set up, had it cycle and got all the levels set out in early Feb. And started out - Doing purely fish but now have some varied Starfish, a couple anemones, Cleaner shrimp, some hermit crabs, about a dozen turbo snails, and an Urchin.

Here's my problem. We keep losing fish. We lost 10 of the 13 chromis we put in initially. No problems there as we expected some to die with it being a new tank, But now they just keep dying off. We are currently dealing with velvet and have lost a powder brown and a cow fish most recently. We also had 2 Moorish Idols where one bullied the other to death, and some other random die offs - We found out we were acclimating all wrong and killed a bunch of fish that way too. Current inhabitants are 2 Angels (not sure on types,) a cardinalfish, 1 moorish Idol, a yellow tang, a blue hippo, a clown, a hawkfish, a and the 3 original surviving chromis. We also have a coat of algae on the substrate that is pretty stubborn. It's a dark brown and has been there for the past 3 months.

We've lost more fish than I can count. Is this normal? It's pretty heartbreaking when my daughters favorite fish just disappears (Because that's what they all do - I have only had one actual floater) and it does not do my wallet any favors either. We know we may lose our entire tank to the velvet - We would treat with copper, but one day we want a shark and a ray in there, and we have no QT. Our LFS is willing to QT and treat with Copper though. We tried Rally and that - well... Not sure that all worked too well.

Am I just doomed to losing fish? Any help is appreciated.

fi.na.tine · Jul 16, 2014

Let me also say - I am in no way blaming my LFS guy. He's been a great help, but just looking for outside advice before I start pulling out my hair.

cor4eyh · Jul 16, 2014

Did you ever find the dead chromis? And do you have any jumpers? Check your overflows as well

tyler1503 · Jul 16, 2014

Have you found any large crabs or heard any loud clicking noises coming from the tank?
Because your not finding the dead fish it makes me think you have a nasty hitchhiker preying on your fish.

fi.na.tine · Jul 16, 2014

No on the chromis. Found one in overflow but that was all. No big crabs. Hermits are all < 1/2 inch. Did move rocks around about a month ago when I lost 3 fish in a day. One of those I suspect was stung by my RBTA. Found half a carcass of one fish it looked like the crabs and shrimp had picked over. The weird thing is that the cow never hid - he was always right up in front of the tank, and all fish were eating right up until they disappeared.

fi.na.tine · Jul 16, 2014

As far as jumpers - I have never seen any. The top has a canopy on 3 sides, so they would have to be super agile (and lucky) to all go out the back side.

cor4eyh · Jul 16, 2014

fi.na.tine said:
No on the chromis. Found one in overflow but that was all. No big crabs. Hermits are all < 1/2 inch. Did move rocks around about a month ago when I lost 3 fish in a day. One of those I suspect was stung by my RBTA. Found half a carcass of one fish it looked like the crabs and shrimp had picked over. The weird thing is that the cow never hid - he was always right up in front of the tank, and all fish were eating right up until they disappeared.

That sucks man and how's your trace elements? What kinda corals?

tyler1503 · Jul 16, 2014

Still sounds like something nasty is picking them off. Was the cowfish one of the first deaths after the chromis?

cor4eyh · Jul 16, 2014

Any mushrooms?

NanaReefer · Jul 16, 2014

Where did you get your rock?

fi.na.tine · Jul 16, 2014

As far as jumpers - I have never seen any. The top has a canopy on 3 sides, so they would have to be super agile (and lucky) to all go out the back side.

cor4eyh · Jul 16, 2014

fi.na.tine said:
As far as jumpers - I have never seen any. The top has a canopy on 3 sides, so they would have to be super agile (and lucky) to all go out the back side.

Are there any mushrooms? I've heard mushrooms will have wars and kill lots of fishes that aren't hardy enough!

fi.na.tine · Jul 16, 2014

No corals. Chromis were first in and they mostly died off in the first week. Just lost the cow yesterday. When they don't come out to eat, I never see them again. Rocks were bought online and delivered dry and white, have added some seasoned rock to get everything going - all bought from LFS and I have not seen any "sea monsters" such as spiders - a month or so ago I got tired of waiting for bodies and moved all the rock - that is when I found a half eaten/decayed corpse. I looked in all the nooks and crannies. (I was also looking for the RBTA that had vanished - turned out just curled up in his hole for a day.)

My GBTA has moved to just peeking out under a rock - in an opening the fish commonly went through. I almost forgot - there is a Niger and clown trigger in there too.

doreo · Jul 16, 2014

what star fish do you have?

twotangs · Jul 16, 2014

+1 on the origin of the rock. This is a big tank with a lot of rock, may still have cycle issues as demostated by the brown slim you are seeing. Also agree you may have a hitchhiker in there."go big or go home" also leads to big "learning curves". Stick with the hobby, it is rewarding but also dont expect to have a full blown reef in 7 months.

Bad Company · Jul 16, 2014

Your triggers are probably at fault, how big are they?

From live aquaria:

"Among the most colorful, the Clown Triggerfish is also one of the most aggressive commonly kept inhabitants of an aquarium. Care should be taken in selecting its tank mates, choosing other aggressive, large fish. The tank decor should also be chosen based on the propensity of the Clown Triggerfish to rearrange it. "

Chromis are NOT "aggressive, large fish" Liveaquaria is a great resource for both buying and determining compatibility.

You are populating your aquarium with food AND decoration.

fishroomlady · Jul 16, 2014

gosh there seem to be so many variables going on - velvet is a horrible disease and usually kills rather quickly. I'm not sure there is a treatment for it and are you sure that's what you have? As bad company said, you could very well be losing your fish to your clown trigger fish - how big is it? Nigers tend to not be nearly as aggressive - another thing to think about is even if you have a very large tank (which you do) it's not a good thing to add a lot of fish at one time even smaller fish like the chromis.....I would add no more than 2-3 fish at a time and space those additions over 1-2 weeks in between . From what I've read, Moorish Idols and cowfish are difficult to keep and it's probably not a good idea to try keeping that species until your tank is stable (as in inhabitants suriving long-term, no obvious disease). I wouldn't blame your anemones for fish deaths although they can be opportunistic if there is a slow and sick fish nearby.

As a start - I know they are beautiful I would re-home the clown trigger especially if you're interested in keeping more of a community tank than a predator tank (I'm guessing that from the fish you have been trying thus far). Don't add any more fish for the time being and try to siphon off the algae when you do a water change.

fi.na.tine · Jul 17, 2014

No more worry about the clown. He did not come out to feed and I have not seen him all day. He was never overly aggressive. He would bump some of the other fish but never go after them. The Niger also is pretty docile. But those 3 chromis are still alive and kicking.

fi.na.tine · Jul 18, 2014

So my wife went looking for corpses today. Found the cow fish dead, and Surprisingly the clown trigger was alive and back there as well. He had been treated initially for velvet but had returned, so he now is showing up with velvet again, so it is back to QT for him.
At this time we think we tried moving too fast. (No duh, right?) We will take all our creatures out, and drain the tank. We'll then remove the rock and bleach it, then clean out the tank and the substrate and start all over again. Not what I want to do - But this Velvet is too nasty and I don't want to lose all our fish.