New to the saltwater

Tidal Gardens
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Water change amounts vary, I've found. Some people do a 10% weekly change. Others, a 20% bi-weekly. I always thought that was a lot do to at one time. Speaking with my LFS who keeps a fantastic display tank, as well as reading some articles from reefers with awesome, awesome tanks, I find that it seems a lot of the 'pros' do smaller water changes. There's no proven method that smaller or larger changes are more beneficial one way or the other, but water changes are necessary to help replenish elements that get used in your saltwater that the ocean replenishes naturally.

Water changes are not just to remove nitrates. They're to replenish elements as well, like Calcium, Magnesium, Strontium, Iodine, Alkalinity, etc.

A lot of people (I haven't started this myself) grow macro algae in their fuge for a variety of reasons. Having light on opposite your lights in the DT helps maintain your pH levels. Having the algae in the fuge also means that you're going to have less (if any) algae in your DT because you've got it growing in the fuge and that's taking all the silicates and nutrients that other algae needs to grow/survive, etc...

I'm using a PhosBan reactor filled with premium grade carbon to add to water clarity & remove any phosphates. Two Little Fishies sells one that's like $30 or so. I'm running it off an inexpensive Hydor pump that also cost $30.

I COULD be wrong (please, bear in mind I'm also new, about 2+ months into starting my tank, so I can really only give you my experiences, what I've learned, and gone through - there are certainly more expert minds and experienced than mine) but I believe Phosphates are the result of nitrates breaking down in the system. So one would occur after the other. So it is possible that your nitrates could be/read 0 on a test, but you have Phosphates at higher than 3, which would make your corals unhappy.
 
Ecoscape Reef Rock
thanks that helped a lot! but I just wanna clear up a couple things, since im having trouble with the lingo. what do you mean by having lights opposite your lights in the DT? having lights on ur fuge under ur display tank maintains ph? so is it that ur ph is dropping if there is a lack of light? and I was just reading about that beginners intro to GFO article. would that GFO work with the phosban reactor? and do you have that running in your sump like with your protein skimmer? also im thinking about doing a DIY aquaclear filter fuge so im going to have limited room. would you recommend one of those little bio cube protein skimmers? I need something small
 
I'm aware of GFO, but I don't run that, or really have a good understanding of it - you'll need to speak to someone or ask in your own forum to someone who has more knowledge, there. It's a different thing, than the PhosBan Reactor I am running. Mine is pure carbon.

pH will drop when your DT (display tank) lighting goes off for the night until the lights come back on again. So one way to counter that is to run a light in your sump, opposite your lighting schedule for your display tank not only to help the macro algae grow, but also to maintain pH levels. I haven't started this yet, but I do plan to. I'm going to be getting myself some mangroves, I think as they'll help reduce nitrates = less potential algae.

As to your protein skimmer, the best advice I can give you is to get the best one you can afford. Don't skimp, or try to save money on it. Reef Octopus is the brand I have, and they are very reliable and not as expensive as some of the others. I only really looked at/investigated larger skimmers.

You may want to look at a HOB (hang on back) skimmer. One of the newer things also is the 'all in one' nano-cubes that have lighting/skimmers/everything within the stand and the tank. They look pretty good, but I've no idea on how well they're built or how reliable they are. I suggest talking to some other people who're running nano's, and get some advice from them.
 
Top Shelf Aquatics
Ryan great job so far!
 
Chewy.com
Ok... Seems like you are trying to get a lot of info after you have jumped into the hobby. Welcome. I'm sure everyone here will try their best to help you, but its very important to do as much reading as you can on your own. This will help you ask the right questions on here.
First, are you using tap water for your salt mix? If so, I would start over with Reverse Osmosis or Deionized water instead. This way you are not battling nitrates and phosphates from the start. Second, your tank will not cycle at all until there is an ammonia source to feed your bio system. This comes from animal waste or decomposition. You will not get readings from your test kits until ammonia is introduced. Unless of course it is already in your tap water. As for phosphates, they don't come from nitrates. They are a separate product of decomposition of waste or uneaten food. Although water changes and skimming help inadvertently with nitrate export, they are not your main way of getting rid of it. There is a bacteria that is anaerobic that lives in the rock and sand that converts it into nitrogen gas. I only do 10% water changes once a month unless I have issues. GFO is a very good way to keep phosphates low. I would use it if you can. You can use it from day one if you want.
As for the opposite light cycle in your refugium, there is a very good explanation for that. When photosynthesis occurs, CO2 is used and O2 is given off. At night photosynthesis stops and respiration causes CO2 to be given off. CO2 causes the water to become acidic, and this drops your pH. So keeping photosynthesis going all the time keeps your pH more stable from day to night.
Hope all this helps. Lots for you to learn, but have fun with it.


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so otter, when you say there is a bacteria that coverts "it" into nitrogen gas, what is "it", nitrates or ammonia and is this bacteria the same as nitrifying bacteria that keeps your tank cycled or is this something different? because with just protein skimming and maybe GFO that wouldn't keep a tank running at low nitrates on a 10% partial a month
 
and about the ph dropping at night, would this take place in a FOWLR system aswell? with nothing intentionally in the aquarium that would be photosynthesizing. but would the algae do that if you had just regular amounts of algae or coralline even?
 
Here is how your Nitrogen cycle goes in a closed system reef aquarium.
Animals produce waste in the form of ammonia. An oxygen loving nitrifying bacteria with the genus Nitrosomonas breaks down Ammonia into Nitrite. Another different kind of oxygen loving nitrifying bacteria with the genus Nitrobacter breaks down nitrite into nitrate. Both ammonia and nitrite are lethal in moderate doses to most marine life, but nitrate is just an irritant in high levels and is considered an algae blooming fertilizer. In fresh water aquariums the nitrate has no place to go so we do water changes to dilute it. In a salt water set up we use liverock and living sand beds that have anaerobic areas within them. This allows another type of bacteria to grow of the denitrifying sort. There are more than a few genus' as I recall. These anaerobic conditions in the rock and sand allow this denitrifying bacteria to grow and break down the nitrate into nitrogen gas and thus the gas leaves your aquarium into the atmosphere. This is why you should let your rock and sand do all of your biological filtration. You don't want your nitrifying bacteria to produce nitrate somewhere else where your rock will have trouble denitrifying the nitrate later. You want it all to happen close together, this way you can maintain near zero on all you nitrogenous wastes all the time. So no bio balls or any other type of bio filter.
As for the opposite light cycle in a fish only with live rock. You still get algae growth of some kind on the rocks in the display, so you will get a pH swing from day to night, but it is not nearly as defined as In a brightly lit reef system. Set up your opposite light cycle accordingly.


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Top Shelf Aquatics
With a healthy bio system, a protein skimmer, and GFO, you should be able to run a pretty clean system.


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oh one more thing otter, whats the cheapest, easiest way to get either DI water or RO? my lfs sells RO for 84cents a gallon... that seems pretty steep but I wouldn't know because that's the only thing around. I was looking up RO systems and I found one for like $250 that does like 25 gal a day.. it seems as though I would rather do that than give my lfs almost a dollar per gallon of fish tank water but idk how much electricity it would use or if the filter cartridges need to be changed and how much that is going to run me and how often
 
Tidal Gardens
but I'm also the aquatic specialist at petco, I supervise the entire aquatics section as well as a lot of customer service on the weekends. we do run marine aquariums at my petco and im the only individual that is allowed to maintain and feed the saltwater. that makes it hard since I have 2 days off every week so everytime I go back to work theres something that has to be tweaked or fixed. so if I ended up investing in the RO system or whatever is easiest and cheapest and still premium quality water, I could probably end up selling the extra that I make just like my LFS since we don't sell it, it wouldn't be conflict of interest I don't believe and I could sell it for like 70 cents a gal which is a better price than the local marine store nearby.
 
A Reverse Osmosis unit is always a good idea to have. It takes no electricity unless your tap water pressure is too low. Here is what I recommend. It is cheeper than what you were looking at.
http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/brs-4-stage-value-plus-ro-di-system-75gpd.html
And get a float valve found on the bottom right of the page.
You can then put the float in a plastic Rubbermaid garbage can and the unit will keep the garbage can filled at all times. That way you always have water ready to go.
And if petco will let you sell it, that's great. That will help you pay for cartridge replacements.
Directions on the RO unit should tell you how to install and maintain. If not, do a how to search on the web or here.


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