Nitrites sky high for weeks
agreed, but we don't have a way to know.
everyone takes a single reading off api or red sea, posts it, then the recommends begin.
but in api vs red sea vs salifert vs hanna comparison threads, a given water sample ranges fifty ppm. 99% of posters who think they know levels don't.
everyone takes a single reading off api or red sea, posts it, then the recommends begin.
but in api vs red sea vs salifert vs hanna comparison threads, a given water sample ranges fifty ppm. 99% of posters who think they know levels don't.
Rmckoy
7500 Club Member
In the olden days .
nitrire was the 2nd stage of the nitrogen cycle .
a ammonia source is needed to elevate and maintain a higher level of ammonia before transforming it to nitrite .
again nitrites are elevated through that process while consuming ammonia , to be transformed to nitrate which used to be said as the final stage
After ammonia and nitrite were both testing 0 nitrates will be high where A large water change is done to reduce them .
Besides cycling a new tank almost 20 years ago .
I have never tested nitrite .
my sole quest to stop nitrite testing in the hobby isn't to ire chemists
its because forum cyclers seem so stuck, unable, hesitant by training they get, always buying reinforcements for a process that completes just fine anyway
when I strolled through the rows and rows of skip cycle tanks at Aquashella it seemed totally unfair for such a rift to exist.
step one in new tankers getting the exact same start date control as 400 reefs at a convention: un factor nitrite.
it wasn't to buck the system, it was to streamline practices.
its because forum cyclers seem so stuck, unable, hesitant by training they get, always buying reinforcements for a process that completes just fine anyway
when I strolled through the rows and rows of skip cycle tanks at Aquashella it seemed totally unfair for such a rift to exist.
step one in new tankers getting the exact same start date control as 400 reefs at a convention: un factor nitrite.
it wasn't to buck the system, it was to streamline practices.
FishyFishFish
Valuable Member
I am not looking for specific numbers; I am just looking for a reduction in nitrite, which isn't happening and I still don't understand why. Whilst nitrite might be irrelevant for the safety of reef inhabitants, it still shows that my cycle is not complete.
This is not my first cycle and I have never had this problem before. The only difference this time is dry rock v live rock, however, there was no problem getting ammonia under control with the dry rock (and no bottle bac), but nitrite is another story.
Again, I understand that this might be irrelevant but my logical mind needs to know why!!
I haven't read into the 'skip' cycle, but I'm not sure the convention comparison is relevant to all home aquarists. I haven't been to any of the conventions but I assume most (if not all) of the displays are set up with live rock with no minimal die-off, which cycles very quickly from my tiny experience. Therefore, presumably, the nitrite levels in these display tanks is very low/zero very quickly. That is not the same for us cycling with dry rock (which is becoming more and more common); my cycle is not comparable to a live rock cycle.
This is not my first cycle and I have never had this problem before. The only difference this time is dry rock v live rock, however, there was no problem getting ammonia under control with the dry rock (and no bottle bac), but nitrite is another story.
Again, I understand that this might be irrelevant but my logical mind needs to know why!!
I haven't read into the 'skip' cycle, but I'm not sure the convention comparison is relevant to all home aquarists. I haven't been to any of the conventions but I assume most (if not all) of the displays are set up with live rock with no minimal die-off, which cycles very quickly from my tiny experience. Therefore, presumably, the nitrite levels in these display tanks is very low/zero very quickly. That is not the same for us cycling with dry rock (which is becoming more and more common); my cycle is not comparable to a live rock cycle.
they have reefs like this one too: instant dry starts full setup.
www.reef2reef.com
that's anemone, corals, fish, day one all dry start. bottle bac is this powerful. nitrites were not established here even though the reef was. tracked out to one year of maturation.
skip cycling now includes all dry setups, ethically too, nothing is harmed.
its a fish disease risk hidden prob...
I too am interested in nitrite data just to learn more about cycling, the problem today is ability to measure it accurately, we can't
api did not become accurate all of a sudden just because its our only mass tester for nitrite, its still api.
once we all have digital readouts for nitrite, we'll understand it much better.
Bio-spira works great
I just started a new tank a little over a week ago. I started with all dry rock and new sand. I added a bottle of Bio-Spira and put fish and coral the same day. Never saw any ammonia and fish and coral seem healthy.
www.reef2reef.com
that's anemone, corals, fish, day one all dry start. bottle bac is this powerful. nitrites were not established here even though the reef was. tracked out to one year of maturation.
skip cycling now includes all dry setups, ethically too, nothing is harmed.
its a fish disease risk hidden prob...
I too am interested in nitrite data just to learn more about cycling, the problem today is ability to measure it accurately, we can't
api did not become accurate all of a sudden just because its our only mass tester for nitrite, its still api.
once we all have digital readouts for nitrite, we'll understand it much better.
OP
OP
zachj.1109
New Member
I’m on well water. Tds is 75-100 depending on if it’s dry or how long it rains. Brs stage 5 ro/di is on the way as of last night, excited for that! I did go buy distilled water from Walmart today and did a 75% water change and levels went to
Ammonia .25 (again, api tests, so hoping it’s 0)
Nitrite still 5+
nitrates 5-20 (I’m starting to loathe the color cards for api as well)
Should I honestly just forget the nitrite tests? I’ve heard from so many sources that it’s irrelevant to marine systems, but is it not important to have 0?
Post #18 has that answer in the link. I bet no thread on the web has as many nitrite positive tanks logged, and started fine.
Im not even sure how a dissenting opinion could exist given the lack of counter evidence, there’s literally no information so far that it matters posted here, all links are to the doesnt matter condition.
Im not even sure how a dissenting opinion could exist given the lack of counter evidence, there’s literally no information so far that it matters posted here, all links are to the doesnt matter condition.
DaddyFish
“5 percenter”
Personally I only bother with Nitrite testing during initial cycling of a new setup/tank.
I am partially colorblind but even a house full of color-sighted people never agree on my test results. That's why I switched to 100% digital testing using ITS-Sensafe Exact iDip Marine System.
OP
OP
zachj.1109
New Member
My question is kinda on both, but everyone’s helping out pretty good! To simplify my questions, is it normal for nitrite to stay high for 9 weeks? With no fish in the tank should nitrates be over 100? I’ve heard nitrites will make the nitrate test basically give a false positive with api. I understand the export of nitrates, so that’s not an issue.
OP
OP
zachj.1109
New Member
This is exactly my question.
DaddyFish
“5 percenter”
None of our hobby grade tests are all that precise. Here's my suggestion if it still concerns you...
After you get your RO/DI established, mix some fresh saltwater, aerate for 24-hours and then use that same test kit to test it for Nitrites. I'm willing to bet you'll get a 5.
OP
OP
zachj.1109
New Member
Good idea, I’ll try that and update, thanks all for the welcome and help. Way better than Facebook troll groups I’m in. Much appreciated.
Courtney Aldrich
Active Member
Yes, nitrite levels can stay high. The nitrite-oxidizing bacteria (NOB) that convert nitrite to nitrate are inhibited by > 5ppm nitrite, thus if you overdose ammonia, you can rapidly exceed 5 ppm nitrite, which will stall the cycle (do a water change to lower nitrite to 2 ppm). The NOB are extremely slow-growing with doubling times of around 30 hours, whereas most other heterotrophic bacteria reproduce every hour or less (if you want to cycle a tank using bacteria in a bottle, you don't want other heterotrophs as they will compete with the slow-growing NOB). If you really want to learn more about the cycle then watch this video that explains how to cycle a tank, see: . As noted in several previous posts, nitrite interferes with the nitrate tests and will result in a false-positive. All nitrate test kits reduce nitrate to nitrite and measure the generated nitrite, so if. you already have high nitrite, then your nitrate test will be high. Some nitrate tests can have even more significant interference if they use chemistry that is inefficient at nitrate reduction.
FishyFishFish
Valuable Member
Nope. I've just tested a new batch of mixed saltwater (mixed and heated for 24 hours) and zero nitrite on the same test kit I've been using for my tank.
Before doing a big water change I dosed some more ammonium chloride to check that my ammonia was still under control. This was done this morning, up to 1ppm, and is already back down to zero. People keep criticizing the API tests, and I'm sure they aren't perfect, but I'm not sure they are as bad as their reputation suggests. I have never had problems with them accurately showing trends.
With my ammonia still under control I am now going to do my big water change and see whether getting nitrite definitely below 5ppm does anything to help the process.
the cycle wont stall that leads to circular purchasing. I have a link that shows reef water containing enough bacteria to cycle a reef in 20 days, a separate all dry reef in twenty days, and that video says there isn’t any in the water.
Post #18 ends the debate on stuck cycles. It’s pages of claimed stuck cycles shown not stuck, and we stopped a circular purchase
It will continue for years, there aren’t any stuck cycles we just change the water and reveal the basal working layer, under clean water, and they’re not stuck now.
there is no more old rule that requires indefinite wait to clear wastewater, we can manually clear it on the date the bottle bac says.
We found a totally reliable mainly free way of making sure no cycle stalls, not one ever posted.
twelve more pages of work using live tank examples with feedback:
nitrite cannot stall a cycle using updated rules.
clearly my claims don’t have any peer reviews heh so I make them from reef peer reviews accumulated for pattern inspection. we have three more like these, titled differently same concept, the other is 28 pages of starts on file.
www.reef2reef.com
Post #18 ends the debate on stuck cycles. It’s pages of claimed stuck cycles shown not stuck, and we stopped a circular purchase
It will continue for years, there aren’t any stuck cycles we just change the water and reveal the basal working layer, under clean water, and they’re not stuck now.
there is no more old rule that requires indefinite wait to clear wastewater, we can manually clear it on the date the bottle bac says.
We found a totally reliable mainly free way of making sure no cycle stalls, not one ever posted.
twelve more pages of work using live tank examples with feedback:
nitrite cannot stall a cycle using updated rules.
clearly my claims don’t have any peer reviews heh so I make them from reef peer reviews accumulated for pattern inspection. we have three more like these, titled differently same concept, the other is 28 pages of starts on file.
How to unstick any seemingly stuck cycle
Updated Cycling Science in Action This is a testless reef tank cycling thread, the only one from any board. If you ever had trouble with reef tank cycling in the past, you won't any longer after working some jobs with us. chances are you are using/about to use a method of reef tank cycling...
www.reef2reef.com
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DaddyFish
“5 percenter”
You sorta missed my point. I proposed that the OP do the test if he's still concerned with Nitrite. What I'm betting is that his particular test kit is giving a false positive.
FishyFishFish
Valuable Member
Maybe, but I am in a similar situation. Nitrite high and not reducing. In my case it is not a test kit error and I see no real reason why the OPs scenario is markedly different from mine.
Under 25 days / nitrite compliance time on most cycling charts/ I’d believe anyone is legit positive for it. And as mentioned any heavy initial ammonia blasting might kick it up eight notches but it’s ok either way.
Slowly but surely I’m earning its disconsideration in cycling with every new work example collected. Everyone meets their ammonia control date by the time the label on the bottle bac says...we just have to interpret the test readings differently. Looking for hard zeroes on api is the biggest rabbit hole ever
our way never gets rabbit holed, we name the completion date for any cycle off a verbal description of the arrangements alone, because they all work similar timeframes for ammonia control (ten days and under, per the charts, faster with bottle bac including as soon as it’s added the tank is protected)
we aren’t doing anything really fantastic its just the discovery that basal filtration layers deposit using the known timeframe even if the top water is out of spec. And we have yet to see one variation where it does not work. linked next post is a thread with an 8 ppm instantly unstuck reef then it gets a year of updates.
we change the wastewater to save the bacteria all the time and work and to save us the wait. We use accurate surface area mechanics to know the surfaces are still just as active as a 30 day wait, and we can cycle any reef without any testing by merely adding two different strains of bottle bac because it’s not possible two different brands could be DOA. Toss in two pinches of feed, two brands of bac, wait ten days, change water, cycled. No testing.
one or both bottles will kick in, and meet the same start date again and again. This very tank in question, what core date are we approaching? Day ten
Slowly but surely I’m earning its disconsideration in cycling with every new work example collected. Everyone meets their ammonia control date by the time the label on the bottle bac says...we just have to interpret the test readings differently. Looking for hard zeroes on api is the biggest rabbit hole ever
our way never gets rabbit holed, we name the completion date for any cycle off a verbal description of the arrangements alone, because they all work similar timeframes for ammonia control (ten days and under, per the charts, faster with bottle bac including as soon as it’s added the tank is protected)
we aren’t doing anything really fantastic its just the discovery that basal filtration layers deposit using the known timeframe even if the top water is out of spec. And we have yet to see one variation where it does not work. linked next post is a thread with an 8 ppm instantly unstuck reef then it gets a year of updates.
we change the wastewater to save the bacteria all the time and work and to save us the wait. We use accurate surface area mechanics to know the surfaces are still just as active as a 30 day wait, and we can cycle any reef without any testing by merely adding two different strains of bottle bac because it’s not possible two different brands could be DOA. Toss in two pinches of feed, two brands of bac, wait ten days, change water, cycled. No testing.
one or both bottles will kick in, and meet the same start date again and again. This very tank in question, what core date are we approaching? Day ten
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