Nutrients high after wc not working now what???

[MattL22]

Quick back round on my tank it's a 220
With 40 gal sump

Sro 5000 int
Wp60
2 250w mh
2 radions

System was started 13-14 months ago with mostly dead rock needless to say I had a hair algae farm for few months I decided to use biopellets and over 6 months it eventually cleared up but still not getting good sps color/ growth so I decided to pull pellets go tried and true wc etc

No3 shot up to 50 ppm over last 3 months I had hoped the tank would eventually stabilize and just did 30 gal wc every week or so ....
No3 still high and po4 up now also I have been running Gfo but about 3 weeks ago nuisance algae started to grow again that's when I decided to start 50 gal wc to try and drop the no3 3 weeks later it's still high wc have not put a dent in it ! This last week I decided to vaccum my sand for 1st time and pulled a ton of muck out I will continue to vaccum my sand and rocks I'm kinda at a loss I've been successful in past with a 75 gal but this 220 gonna drive me crazy I don't wanna give up on my dream of a full blown sps tank but I'm starting to think about just adding some xeina .....

Any thoughts I toyed with starting vinegar dosing again

I have added bacteria to try and boost bac population

 

[MattL22]

I'd really like to avoid carbon dosing ATM as most sps tanks I've seen don't carbon dose and don't worry so much if alk is 8-10 just that it's stable

 

[Daniel@R2R Verified Admin]

Hmm...to reduce nitrates, carbon dosing could help, but it sounds like you have a source that you need to figure out. This may seem like a basic question, but have you checked your source water for nitrates? Are you using RODI? If your source water is void of nitrates, then it is something being added to the tank or produced by the tank. What's your bioload? How much are you feeding? You mentioned your sand bed having "muck" in it. How deep is your sand bed? These are some things that might help get to the bottom of your nitrate/PO4 source.

Don't give up! Let's see if we can get you back on track.

Also, 50g water changes amount to about 22% of your display (and I'm figuring that between sump and display with displacement from LR, sand, and equipment 220g might be a good figure for your total water volume...would you agree?). This is a good water change, but doesn't seem like a huge water change given your total volume. How often are you changing 50 gallons? Are you seeing any reduction in nutrients at all from this routine?

Also, if you've been running GFO for 3 weeks and PO4 is still high, then it's likely that your GFO is exhausted and needs to be changed.

HTH

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

You won't really deter algae unless the nitrate drops below a couple of ppm and phosphate below about 0.03 ppm or so. Consequently, water changes aren't going to do the trick.

Vinegar dosing is a fine plan, as are many other ways of reducing nutrients. Adding back the pellets may be a fine alternative.

I'd also keep up the GFO. It may only last a few days if phosphate is substantially elevated.

What is the phosphate measurement?

 

[MattL22]

Not sure on po4 never had much luck with the Hanna egg so I use algae as my indicator
I will start changing Gfo weekly

So is lg water change to lower nutrients not the way to go anymore?

My question is how do some tanks thrive not using Gfo or carbon dosing??
I thought I've been using tried and true methods but they not working for me

 

[MattL22]

Randy thanks for posting ur help and insight very much appreciated

 

[fishroomlady]

I would add that there are many successful tanks keeping sps that carbon dose. Just a thought.....in terms of large water changes, I know that is a good way to go but as md said, you'll need to figure out where the nutrients are coming from because the wc can only do so much in terms of nitrate reduction.....

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Randy thanks for posting ur help and insight very much appreciated

You're welcome.

Happy reefing.

 

[mike007]

I have found that the most common causes of excess nutrients come from overfeeding. That means overfeeding fish, coral foods etc. Are you adding any trace,amino additives? You have to export more of the nutrients you are putting in to get nitrates and phosphates down. Algae love phosphates it their fertilizer. I have found that many salt mixes contain a lot of trace elements and doing numerous water changes will cause a buildup of excess nutrients.

 

[Gwitness]

So it could be bad to do frequent water changes if you are trying to get nutrients under control?

 

[MattL22]

Hi thanks guys


I have a few lg fish and a bunch of assorted smaller fish I def don't think I'm over stocked but I do feed pretty heavy mysis and reef fish frenzy then few hrs later I usually throw in a pinch of flakes or pellets

I have found if I cut back on feelings fish start to get aggressive leading to sickness

 

[MattL22]

I don't think it's too much more then anyone else who keeps angels anthais tang etc

Also I decided to start vinegar was trying to avoid that because I'm trying to do sps only and didn't wanna worry bout keeping alk 7

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

So it could be bad to do frequent water changes if you are trying to get nutrients under control?

Not nutrients meaning N and P, no, unless you are using tap water to make the salt water. But it may add trace elements like iron that might possibly boost cyano.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I don't think it's too much more then anyone else who keeps angels anthais tang etc

Also I decided to start vinegar was trying to avoid that because I'm trying to do sps only and didn't wanna worry bout keeping alk 7

Unless the system becomes an ultra low nutrient system, I don't think that is necessary. Many people have SPS and dose organic carbon with alkalinity in the 8-10 range.

It seems to be when you begin to starve the zoox in the SPS corals that you want alkalinity closer to 7 dKH (for reason no one understands).

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

FWIW, unless you are using tap water or have decaying organisms on your live rock, foods are always the main source of nutrients. It doesn't matter if it is eaten or not, nearly all the N and P in them ends up in the water column.

 

[townjas]

A 40 gallon sump seems small for that size tank. I current have a 40 gallon long as my sump on my 150 gallon and I want to move up to a 4' X 18" tank like a 75 or 90 gallon tank. How big is your return pump? (in GPH) and 1 WP60 seems very light for a 220. I am running 2 WP40's on my tank. Are you running a refugium? You could put some xenia and cheato in a refugium. Both of those would help with Nitrate and phosphate removal. How many gallons in your skimmer rated for?

 

[townjas]

Never mind on the skimmer question. You have a plenty big enough skimmer

 

[MattL22]

The 40 is small wish I had room for a larger sump but I don't I did build a heavy duty shelf above my sump which is in a closet next to my tank I bought a used 60 gal rr tank i filled most the way I just gotta hook up pump and drain i plan on lighting it 12 hrs a day growin macro and hopefully with low flow and 12 hr light it will grow all the nuisance algae in that tank and not display
Should I run air stones to make oxygen rich for algae?

Tank will be bb and I'm also hoping it will act as a settling tank which I can siphon out detritus every day Into a filter sock

 

[MattL22]

 

[MattL22]

The electric was just resting there will be screwed to wall up high