Palytoxin Poison concern, opinion please!

[reptileguy112]

Palytoxins suck! This was last year or two years ago I knicked my finger on a garden paly growing on a rock. Someone was giving me them for free and I was a newbie, in reality those worthless corals coated an $800 medical bill!! These were before the lines got more defined

 

[Reefster]

I would say it looks like an infection, than Paly toxin. I would be more worried about a bacterial infection than anything else. I always where gloves whenever cleaning my tank now. About 1 and half years ago, I scraped my outside of my wrist with a pin size scrape, well that landed me with a 3 day stay in the hospital. They had to give me Antibiotics intravenously for 3 days. They thought it could be Mycobacterium Marinum but did not confirm it. They told me that people can and have lost limbs and died from these types of infections. Be careful and always where gloves.

 

[cmcoker]

@Camellia, how are you doing?

 

[cj in sac ca]

I agree looks like bacterial not paly toxin. One thing to remember. Every body of water both fresh brackish or salt has bacteria that COULD lead to an infection. After heavy rains when salinity is down along the gulf coast of Florida they warn of a flesh eating bacteria threat because someone a few hrs back got it from swimming a day or so after it rained heavily. There is a fresh water amoeba that enters the body through the noise and sinus cavity and ends up in the brain and literally starts to eat the brain causing sestimic infection and 99% of the time kills and is only found after death.
Every one break down your tanks and send me your corals for your safety!!! Lol
Serously just exercise caution like you do with everything else and enjoy the beauty of the hobby that owe all love, enjoy and are going broke by!

 

[Aquaculture]

Camellia, this happened to JeffMuse (from ARC) when I lived in Lawrenceville back in 2013...here's the link.
http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=83668

 

[Lasse]

Here in Sweden there is rather many reported events there a very aggressive bacteria is linked to palythoas and palytoxin. I have been there by myself.

Sincerely Lasse

 

[stevo01]

I always wear these regardless of what the situation.

Atlas 772 Large Nitrile Chemical Resistant Gloves, 25", Yellow, 1-Pair https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004A9KI7W/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_tai_6gcYxb9THEXSR

 

[Shooter]

Yeah i had to use a antibiotic cream as well as antbiotic pill they gave me. The doctor was brought in and after i explained how i got it he was like wow cool....

 

[Pola0502ds]

Since we are on this subject, what is the proper protocol for cleaning up your fragging area and tools after you have fragged some zoas? Is a simple wipe down and dry everything very well good enough? After its dry is there any possibility of getting infected with it? Or should some type of cleaner be used on the tools and surfaces that were touched by the zoa?

If you know you got some of this toxin on your skim, is washing with soap and water the correct way to handle it?

 

[billrob71]

I had this in my eye and the Dr at the ER had no idea what it was even after I told him , most physicians are not very savy on some of the toxins we subject ourselves everytime we put out hands in our tanks .
Good luck and hope you get well soon

 

[Pola0502ds]

I am a zoa/paly collector myself and reading threads like this keeps me in check and reminds me of the dangers. After reading this something came to mind, i think i am going to have my wife put some notes in her phone about palytoxin incase this were ever to happen to me. I have heard reports of this happening to some people who cant even speak and if that ever happened how would you ever be able to tell the doc what happened? Your wife!!

Does anyone know of a link to a document of some sort that would be information for a doctor to read about what it is and how to treat it? If my wife had this information she can tell the doc what i was doing and that we believe it is palytoxin. He can then read up on exactly what it is and how to handle the situation. When it comes to palytoxin i believe that most doctors/nurses/ER rooms have no idea what it is and how to handle it.

If you have a wife/girlfriend/whoever that lives with you, explain to them what is in your tank and what palytoxin is that way they are educated on it as well. It only helps and with something this serious, the more people that know the better.

Any help would be great for links to documentation that a doctor can read and understand.

 

[jsh mee]

Are you ok Camellia?? Did that antibiotic help?

 

[DMan]

 

[stevo01]

If it gets worse, more swollen, go to the ER. The picture in the link are the ones that made me sick.

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6431a4.htm?s_cid=mm6431a4_e

I have a large colony of this species. When this particular colony is irritated they send out lots of streamers of palytoxin.

I'm always very cautious. I wear full length chemical resistant gloves, and I wash everything under hot soapy water after I finish. It sounds like the hot water doesn't neutralize palytoxin. This article claims the only way to do this is with bleach. Yikes! There is no cure (like an anti-venom) and only support for palytoxin sickness.


I hope the OP'er is feeling better!

 

[aquariumworks]

Palytoxin is no just joke,although the symptoms described and shown here seem to more of a bacterial infection... Which I hope have been treated by a physician ...

As for the Palytoxin, the resulting livestock reactions sound about right...
I have had a real life threatening encounter with this stuff...
I was working on a clients aquarium that had approximately 24"x12" section of the back panel covered in these pests...
They never wanted me to eradicate them as they enjoyed everything natural in the aquarium... I to this point of working with reef aquariums for 20 plus years never experienced Palytoxin...
I had to replace a bulkhead gasket on the closed loop circuit of this aquarium...
So I had the water drained low enough to accomplish this other wise easy task; leaving only about 24"x6" of palys exposed to air...
As I worked on the plumbing, my eyes became very itchy and irritated... There we three cats in the home, so I thought to myself that maybe I was developing an allergy to cats?
About an hour into the job, almost ready to refill the aquarium, I was having what felt like a panic attack, labored and rapid breathing, feeling hot and slightly dizzy...
So I continued on with adding water back to the aquarium and I just was feeling listless and was developing seviere back pain in my kidney area...
I wrapped up the job and left to my home, apparently 1 hr away...
By the time I was home, I felt like I was suffering from a flu...
I checked my temperature and I had a 103° temp; I should have took myself to the ER at this point...
But I didn't, I took a couple ibuprofen and tried to sleep it off...
Turns out after laying in bed for two days and researching Palytoxin, I was most likely suffering kidney failure and I am very lucky to be sharing this story...
Palytoxin primarily effects the heart and kidneys!
It also has caused skin irritation for myself ...

So please, if anyone has even a small questionable encounter with these polyps, SEEK MEDICAL ATTENTION!

 

[sghera64]

I've had Paylitoxin several times. Always acquired from inhalation. It always gives me a high fever ( >104 degrees F) that begins about 6 hrs after exposure and lasts about 8 hrs. Advil helps a lot.

If you did not get the fever, you are likely not suffering from Payli; likely got bacteria infection from surface of rock/knife.

BTW, I always where a chemical respirator and use cold water to rinse. Paylitoxin can be vaporized if heated; even with warm water.

 

[A. grandis]

One day we went to collect some Palythoa spp. My kids know very well about the danger!!! Back then I thought them that only the direct contact with the polyps would give symptoms of the poison. We washed hands after collecting the polyps, as aways, even though my kids never touch them directly.
That day my oldest son suffered minor toxicity. He felt metallic/soapy taste for couple of hours. He's got the poison through the skin only by touching the rocks AROUND a small colony. The colony itself was perhaps 5 inches long. I don't think he touched that exactly rock where the polyps were, but the current/surge was probably spreading the toxin to the other rocks...
I still have those polyps in my system and they are the most beautiful of all Palythoa spp. I've got.
My system is basically for Hawaiian zoanthids and I've got many different colonies of Palythoa spp. in there.
I'm very cautious with my tank. I tell my friends it's a bomb that we should handle with caution!!!

Keep safe! Wear gloves, goggles, and make sure no kids or pets around when you frag them!!
Frag them on disposable plastic plates and make sure to clean well the area afterwards.
Avoid using your kitchen to frag any cnidarians!!!
Sharp knives are only safe if you won't get a cut!!!
Aloha,
Grandis.

 

[Surfandturf]

This is the guy that I was referring too.

 

[Pat Clark]

Had a young fellow here in Florida spend a week in the hospital because of a infection he got moving rocks with captain America palys on it. 38 thousand dollars latter he is back in the his shop selling corals.

 

[SandJ]

Any help would be great for links to documentation that a doctor can read and understand.

I have explained to my husband about palythoa toxin, and if I ever have any symptoms to tell the doctor about it. I also have the document linked below printed and in the first page of my aquarium journal. I should probably print it and put it on the fridge. I would love to have a refrigerator magnet with all the info and poison control phone number for easy reference.

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6431a4.htm