Parameters good - still losing everything

[Darth.Daddy12]

I was wondering about the socks in the washing machine. I’ll add that to the mix as well. No temp swings. I have heater on controller.

But have you used at least two different thermostats and tested the accuracy of both the heaters and the controllers? Never take that for granted.. I mostly use cheap magnetic thermometers but I do so cause after 20 years of fish keeping I’ve learned they are consistent for long periods of time. If figure this out by using many more expensive ones to verify over the years and found I can use 19 different ones and the average comes to what the $6 magnetic once’s read. I now use them to verify the digital ones on my salt tanks as well as verifying controllers and heater temps.. at they spot on accurate no they very about 2* but they are consistent and once I did the inaccuracy on one I mark it as such and account for that. I even have one that is 12* off from actual temp but it reads 1* up or down accurately.

It’s not about what it says the temp is anymore cause I know.. it’s about it changing. I have 8 tanks as of a week ago in my house wo a fishroom.. these are all display type tanks in various rooms of the house threeof which are in my living room. Freshwater panted, freshwater predator and reef tanks.. he’ll my new 10g nano that’s a week and 2 days old has 5 fish and low nutrient still lol. I don’t know all the details but I know all the basics.. and that’s stability in everything and that doesn’t take Apex read outs I can do it with $6 thermostats and regular water changes..

 

[Darth.Daddy12]

I use my the sponge which is a fine mesh micron sponge. Instead of just throwing out the poly filter I just wringe and wring. And throw it back in. My skimmer is 4x rated for my tank. And I dont flow alot through my sump su the skimmer really cleans the water well. The sponge just polishes the water before it hits the return chamber

What’s a skimmer lol.. don’t have one on any of my tanks except my 210 and it’s only a 160 and I need to empty it maybe once every two weeks lol. Skimmers are a rich mans way to what can be fixed by a good fuge or good scrubber setup.. only reason I run a skimmer still in the 210 is cause it helps keep me from maintaining The cheto as often as backwards as that sounds lol.

 

[blasterman]

Green Slimers are one of the toughest SPS out there....IMO, they are the most durable Acro by far.

I'm looking at the pictures of the OP's tank, and his rock looks like it's only a couple weeks old. By 6 months into a new tank even starting with dry rock you should have *no* white exposed rock left, rapidly growing coraline everywhere, and rock should not be white. I'm scratching my head here...it just doesn't look like any 6 month old tank I've had. Something is seriously suppressing hard carbonate encrusting organisms.

 

[motortrendz]

What’s a skimmer lol.. don’t have one on any of my tanks except my 210 and it’s only a 160 and I need to empty it maybe once every two weeks lol. Skimmers are a rich mans way to what can be fixed by a good fuge or good scrubber setup.. only reason I run a skimmer still in the 210 is cause it helps keep me from maintaining The cheto as often as backwards as that sounds lol.

I'm terrible at not buying fish I like and I tend to run a heavy stocked tank. But my nitrates are below 2. So I definilty like my skimmers. I dont run a fuge as I have no room. Big skimmer, dose vodka and bacteria regularly. Run small amount of go and carbon and a calcium reactor. Lol works like a charm. But I'm wallet is empty.... got a tank full of free damsels hahah lol

 

[Darth.Daddy12]

Green Slimers are one of the toughest SPS out there....IMO, they are the most durable Acro by far.

I'm looking at the pictures of the OP's tank, and his rock looks like it's only a couple weeks old. By 6 months into a new tank even starting with dry rock you should have *no* white exposed rock left, rapidly growing coraline everywhere, and rock should not be white. I'm scratching my head here...it just doesn't look like any 6 month old tank I've had. Something is seriously suppressing hard carbonate encrusting organisms.

Yeah there are a lot of little things here that don’t all add but it’s hard to grow coralline on top of algae. Tank looks like it’s 3-4weeks old someone went little crazy at the lfs. It never passed ugly phase of maturity. Only time I’ve seen that happen is when people jumped the gun adding fish and corals right away under high lighting never letting the tank amature first.. I bit juxdfing I can’t wait 3-4months staring a dim empty tank either but I get good wet rock and use live sand so I don’t have these issues.

 

[donomite]

Green Slimers are one of the toughest SPS out there....IMO, they are the most durable Acro by far.

I'm looking at the pictures of the OP's tank, and his rock looks like it's only a couple weeks old. By 6 months into a new tank even starting with dry rock you should have *no* white exposed rock left, rapidly growing coraline everywhere, and rock should not be white. I'm scratching my head here...it just doesn't look like any 6 month old tank I've had. Something is seriously suppressing hard carbonate encrusting organisms.

started with all dry stax rocks, and maturity kit. No live hence young looking rock. Took forever to cycle. Would not recommend it.

 

[Darth.Daddy12]

started with all dry stax rocks, and maturity kit. No live hence young looking rock. Took forever to cycle. Would not recommend it.

What he was saying was accounting for this already. After this much time you should have some good coralline growth on the rocks by now. If you can’t grow coralline you can’t grow corals. They require the exact same things. This is when you know you can start adding corals to a new tank is when you have good rock coloration of 20-30% of the top of your scape and maybe a little growing on back glass. Your system didn’t mature properly from the beginning and from the pictures is stuck in abkut the 3-4week old stage.

 

[TinCanHero]

I'm enjoying the new tank discussion. IMO new tank and new reefer gets thrown in together to often, being rather new myself i have done some stupid things to my tank and seen bad results that one could easily blame on the tank being new. My tank is in its 7th month being wet, my first coral after my cycle was a SPS and its loved life, since then ive added many other types of SPS inducing acros. only lost one recently infact due to two errors on my part (Flow and over dosing "pox").
I personally don't buy into the new tank theory, i think its perfectly fine to keep SPS in a new STABLE tank. I feel the reason you get issues is because of adding foreign entity's (algae, critters, bacteria, etc) that your tank is new and not used to. these cause blooms before your tank resettles and those cause issues.

The best bit of advice i can give you as a fellow newby is forget about the coral and fish and think about water, think of it as if the water is your sole pet. keep your water incheck and stable and everything else will follow.
There is only a few things to worry about to get good success and that's : param's(correct and stable), flow & lighting get all 3 right and your away.

All i can say with my limited knowledge is make sure your params are in check and stable (Coral pro salt comes with lap ICP testing so you can get the results of your salt from there website using the white label inside your lid) as stated above for your mix it looks low.

how much dose your PH swing? this was a issue for my tank until i added some ventilation and changed alk dosing. since getting my apex i realised just how much it swings through the day. try testing once just before lights on and once again just before lights off.

I had to dose alk on my tank only due to it dropping between WC's. How stable is yours?

Don't stick your socks in the wash. I almost did before reading horror stories, best to soak them in bleach for a few days then rinse and soak in RODI (with prime if you like)

5ppm is really high for RODI water, if i where you id get a addon kit to get rid of the last bit starting with bad water is hurting you from the start.

Again, take what i saw with a pinch of salt but your tank is looking pretty good apart from that. Don't give up hope its all about stability. Last of all, you mentioned brown brown algae. is that like a GHA type or something else? i ask because it was around the 5m mark i had my second diatom bloom.

Kind regards,
TinCanHero.

 

[Darth.Daddy12]

I'm enjoying the new tank discussion. IMO new tank and new reefer gets thrown in together to often, being rather new myself i have done some stupid things to my tank and seen bad results that one could easily blame on the tank being new. My tank is in its 7th month being wet, my first coral after my cycle was a SPS and its loved life, since then ive added many other types of SPS inducing acros. only lost one recently infact due to two errors on my part (Flow and over dosing "pox").
I personally don't buy into the new tank theory, i think its perfectly fine to keep SPS in a new STABLE tank. I feel the reason you get issues is because of adding foreign entity's (algae, critters, bacteria, etc) that your tank is new and not used to. these cause blooms before your tank resettles and those cause issues.

The best bit of advice i can give you as a fellow newby is forget about the coral and fish and think about water, think of it as if the water is your sole pet. keep your water incheck and stable and everything else will follow.
There is only a few things to worry about to get good success and that's : param's(correct and stable), flow & lighting get all 3 right and your away.

All i can say with my limited knowledge is make sure your params are in check and stable (Coral pro salt comes with lap ICP testing so you can get the results of your salt from there website using the white label inside your lid) as stated above for your mix it looks low.

how much dose your PH swing? this was a issue for my tank until i added some ventilation and changed alk dosing. since getting my apex i realised just how much it swings through the day. try testing once just before lights on and once again just before lights off.

I had to dose alk on my tank only due to it dropping between WC's. How stable is yours?

Don't stick your socks in the wash. I almost did before reading horror stories, best to soak them in bleach for a few days then rinse and soak in RODI (with prime if you like)

5ppm is really high for RODI water, if i where you id get a addon kit to get rid of the last bit starting with bad water is hurting you from the start.

Again, take what i saw with a pinch of salt but your tank is looking pretty good apart from that. Don't give up hope its all about stability. Last of all, you mentioned brown brown algae. is that like a GHA type or something else? i ask because it was around the 5m mark i had my second diatom bloom.

Kind regards,
TinCanHero.

How true it is.. we like to think we keep fish really all we are are rookie water chemists trying not to fail an exam lol.

I don’t take faith in the new tank old tank stuff either. That’s imop a product of either bad habits building over time finally coming about, or lack of knowledge in the beginning making things difficult or impossible early on.

However there is a different in a “mature” tank and immature in terms of micro and macro life forms which do a lot to help keep water levels stable. It does mean you can’t grow x in an immature tanks however it will take more work and dedication that most wont due.

As for Ph swings.. I found in the past when my 210g was running that if I covered the top but left the areas over the two overflows open (almost as if cutting out for a hang on device) that it helped to stabilize some. If running a big skimmer then drawing in outside air helps a lot especially in smaller rooms. And closed in cabinets like most sinks are.

What I’ve found though is it’s mostly about the size of the room it’s in, activity in that room and air movement through that room. My house is very open floor plan with high cieling in living room (20’) just off the kitchen which is 20x20 and I have good fans in both rooms always running in high. It’s basicaly one big massive area with lots of air flow and with 3 dogs, three cats and three kids the back door is open almost 24/7 so lots of outside air. Can’t speak to specifically what in this makes the different but all combined I was only seeing .2 swings on that tank. My new nano is in same room similar type setup with fuge and I’m seeing about the same .2 ph swing on that tank which blows my mind being only 8ish gallons of water.

I tend to think most people getting big ph swings have tanks in smaller rooms like an office or bedroom and or.. they fully enclosed their cabinet around the sump. I’ve always left the back wall off my stands for better air flow and cooling but it could play in co2 o2 exchange at same time.

Would be interesting to see BRS do a test on open cabinet vs fully closed as well as different room sizes and cieling heights to see how that effects PH swings. In my planted freshwater tanks if ran air stones at night which help so i think it also has a lot to do with more surface agitation. We turn wage makers down at night to allow fish to sleep and I’m sure that’s a huge huge underrated part.

 

[TinCanHero]

How true it is.. we like to think we keep fish really all we are are rookie water chemists trying not to fail an exam lol.

I don’t take faith in the new tank old tank stuff either. That’s imop a product of either bad habits building over time finally coming about, or lack of knowledge in the beginning making things difficult or impossible early on.

However there is a different in a “mature” tank and immature in terms of micro and macro life forms which do a lot to help keep water levels stable. It does mean you can’t grow x in an immature tanks however it will take more work and dedication that most wont due.

As for Ph swings.. I found in the past when my 210g was running that if I covered the top but left the areas over the two overflows open (almost as if cutting out for a hang on device) that it helped to stabilize some. If running a big skimmer then drawing in outside air helps a lot especially in smaller rooms. And closed in cabinets like most sinks are.

What I’ve found though is it’s mostly about the size of the room it’s in, activity in that room and air movement through that room. My house is very open floor plan with high cieling in living room (20’) just off the kitchen which is 20x20 and I have good fans in both rooms always running in high. It’s basicaly one big massive area with lots of air flow and with 3 dogs, three cats and three kids the back door is open almost 24/7 so lots of outside air. Can’t speak to specifically what in this makes the different but all combined I was only seeing .2 swings on that tank. My new nano is in same room similar type setup with fuge and I’m seeing about the same .2 ph swing on that tank which blows my mind being only 8ish gallons of water.

I tend to think most people getting big ph swings have tanks in smaller rooms like an office or bedroom and or.. they fully enclosed their cabinet around the sump. I’ve always left the back wall off my stands for better air flow and cooling but it could play in co2 o2 exchange at same time.

Would be interesting to see BRS do a test on open cabinet vs fully closed as well as different room sizes and cieling heights to see how that effects PH swings. In my planted freshwater tanks if ran air stones at night which help so i think it also has a lot to do with more surface agitation. We turn wage makers down at night to allow fish to sleep and I’m sure that’s a huge huge underrated part.

I feel you hit the nail on the head with the mature tank statement.

However there is a different in a “mature” tank and immature in terms of micro and macro life forms which do a lot to help keep water levels stable. It does mean you can’t grow x in an immature tanks however it will take more work and dedication that most wont due.

This is what im talking about when people tend to throw the "new tank" statement around, its not that the tank is new its that its easier or rather less work when mature to keep stable.

and again, your totally right with room ventilation, i now keep two windows open to make a draft. I can also see huge difference if were all out with all 3 dogs for the day. id also love to see a BRS ventalation test, i mean any test by them is gold!

do you think your planted tanks help? i have a weird feeling my 6ft tank next to my reef helps pull carbon from the air now i dont dose co2 anymore.

One thing i would be careful of telling people thou is this:

What he was saying was accounting for this already. After this much time you should have some good coralline growth on the rocks by now. If you can’t grow coralline you can’t grow corals. They require the exact same things. This is when you know you can start adding corals to a new tank is when you have good rock coloration of 20-30% of the top of your scape and maybe a little growing on back glass. Your system didn’t mature properly from the beginning and from the pictures is stuck in abkut the 3-4week old stage.

The problem with telling people dont add coral until you have a nice purple tank is where dose this coralline algae come from? Without seeding your tank your not going to get it and even when you "seed" your tank your not going to see a explosion overnight unless you use a good amount (like blending a plate or something). My tank has 0 coralline on the rocks and glass. I have some on frag plugs and hermits that came in but that's it, while its growing well (my hermit is now fully pink) its still not started on the rock.
while your right in saying if you cant keep coralline you cant keep coral, i wouldn't say its a good indication on when to add coral to your system.

 

[Darth.Daddy12]

I feel you hit the nail on the head with the mature tank statement.



This is what im talking about when people tend to throw the "new tank" statement around, its not that the tank is new its that its easier or rather less work when mature to keep stable.

and again, your totally right with room ventilation, i now keep two windows open to make a draft. I can also see huge difference if were all out with all 3 dogs for the day. id also love to see a BRS ventalation test, i mean any test by them is gold!

do you think your planted tanks help? i have a weird feeling my 6ft tank next to my reef helps pull carbon from the air now i dont dose co2 anymore.

One thing i would be careful of telling people thou is this:



The problem with telling people dont add coral until you have a nice purple tank is where dose this coralline algae come from? Without seeding your tank your not going to get it and even when you "seed" your tank your not going to see a explosion overnight unless you use a good amount (like blending a plate or something). My tank has 0 coralline on the rocks and glass. I have some on frag plugs and hermits that came in but that's it, while its growing well (my hermit is now fully pink) its still not started on the rock.
while your right in saying if you cant keep coralline you cant keep coral, i wouldn't say its a good indication on when to add coral to your system.

Understand your issue.. but corrolline is like any other algae you can’t prevent it no mater how hard you try. It’s a great standard bearer for new tanks imop. WWC who I think runs the cleanest systems around says the same thing. And realistically you should see noticeable corralline within 4 months. Not entire tank crusted over but there should be something. If not your tank isn’t ready. Corralline uses same perimeters and is 100x easier to grow then even a green Star polip. If you can’t grow coralline then chances are your getting ready to spend a lot on money on slowly dying corals.

Corralline is an aggressive algae that grows from a single spor like wild fire.. you can’t buy fish and corals and not get a spore into your tank somehow by accident. When you’re 6months cycled with fish and corals and still no corralline the there is a big big issue. Lighting, water something is way bad. Usually water cause corralline will grow in low or high light it really doesn’t care. (Depending on coloration and species)

I understand your concern and my kinda rash blanket statement could’ve been better presented but that is still factual truths. I’ve never seen a tank wo coralline coverednin health corals yet I’ve seen plenty of tanks covered in it that are Fowler and could never support corals..

 

[IslandLifeReef]

@donomite, any updates? How did the mixing go? What did your new salt mix to?

 

[donomite]

@donomite, any updates? How did the mixing go? What did your new salt mix to?

Working on it as we speak. Was out of town yesterday. Will post an update in the afternoon