Paying before cutting - your thoughts?

[Ian]

It all depends on the seller/buyer...

I have people ask me for stuff that I didn't plan to frag and in that case, if they want it cut, I ask for a deposit as a commitment. If it's someone Ive dealt with before, Ill cut something they ask for and have no problem trusting that they'll pay...

On the flip side, there are plenty of people that I trust well enough that I don't need to see a WYSIWYG...

 

[SDguy]

And so I guess it goes without saying in any such dealings, that should something happen to the frag, the buyer gets a full refund?

 

[mpoletti]

It all depends on the seller/buyer...

I have people ask me for stuff that I didn't plan to frag and in that case, if they want it cut, I ask for a deposit as a commitment. If it's someone Ive dealt with before, Ill cut something they ask for and have no problem trusting that they'll pay...

On the flip side, there are plenty of people that I trust well enough that I don't need to see a WYSIWYG...

I think that is a whole different story Ian as you were contacted by someone else. That happens all the time in this hobby. I think what Peter was talking about was someone who starts a thread trying to dig up a sale. Am I correct Peter?

 

[Ian]

if that's the case and a seller is offering, I need a WYSIWYG frag for sure...

Either way I think this is a great topic Peter

 

[KT 325]

Pre pay is a way for the seller to generate income before delivery of product. This can be looked at as a ponzi. Taking from Peter to pay Paul. At some point it will fail. For example, the seller takes payment in advance for 100 frags. He uses the money to pay the electric bill, rent, supplies, etc. The money runs out before the frags are ready. To keep the business going he continues to take orders for frags. Now he owes 150 frags. Soon the 100 frags are ready and he ships them. Now after packing and shipping and paying bills he is out of money again. So now he offers another pre pay option on another coral. He uses that money to keep afloat until he can ship 50 more of the original coral when they are ready. This type of business practice is doomed from the start.

Any ethical seller should only request a small deposit, if any at all. Paying in full is just asking for trouble.

As for trusting a seller, that is even more risky!!! If the seller is in trouble, self preservation takes precidence over ethics and morals.

 

[CHALICEKEEPER]

What if the mother is not big enough yet and waiting for growth kinda like a prepay

 

[mpoletti]

What if the mother is not big enough yet and waiting for growth kinda like a prepay

Why frag it it in the first place if its not big enough?

 

[SDguy]

I think that is a whole different story Ian as you were contacted by someone else. That happens all the time in this hobby. I think what Peter was talking about was someone who starts a thread trying to dig up a sale. Am I correct Peter?

Correct, Mark.

The way I see it, if everything is completely on the up and up, and the seller either just sits on the money until the frag ships or the seller has enough to be able to repay the buyer should something happen, then no harm no foul. But if this is the case, then why take the money up front in the first place? This isn't something that requires investment captital to happen (unless epoxy and plugs have skyrocketed in price :bigsmile: ) I guess that goes back to the idea of not having a buyer or not getting the price you want, and having to sit on the frag for a while. As a hobbyist, sure, I can see that sucking. But as a vendor, kinda comes with the territory, no?

 

[CHALICEKEEPER]

why frag it it in the first place if its not big enough?

i guess to help somebody out that really wants that chalice

 

[mpoletti]

Correct, Mark.

The way I see it, if everything is completely on the up and up, and the seller either just sits on the money until the frag ships or the seller has enough to be able to repay the buyer should something happen, then no harm no foul. But if this is the case, then why take the money up front in the first place? I guess that goes back to the idea of not having a buyer or not getting the price you want, and having to sit on the frag for a while. As a hobbyist, sure, I can see that sucking. But as a vendor, kinda comes with the territory, no?

That pretty much how I see it as well. I'm glad I'm not the only one out there who doesn't understand posting a picture of a frag (some call a colony) saying "Give me XYZ amount of money, and I will frag it for you". What happens when the seller frags the piece and its not what the buyer originally anticipated it would be?

 

[SDguy]

i guess to help somebody out that really wants that chalice

I think this would then fall into the scenario that Ian was mentioning, with the buyer approaching the seller, which I think is a different situation.

 

[mpoletti]

i guess to help somebody out that really wants that chalice

I guess I just like watching corals grow I can see your point as I have given away corals to share the wealth and to have a backup.

Like so many of these threads, it comes down to intentions and not everyone has the same intentions in this hobby; and my coral counselor told me "that's ok"

 

[Acrokeeper3729]

I think if the frag after being cut is not what the buyer thought it would be then a full refund is in order. Don't get me wrong, I would obviously rather buy a wysiwyg frag but if the seller says it will need to be cut and heal and its a trusted seller then I don't complain about it. On the flip side I do not believe a vendor should have any reason to be doing this.

 

[SDguy]

and my coral counselor told me "that's ok"

:snicker:

 

[Ian]

What happens when the seller frags the piece and its not what the buyer originally anticipated it would be?

or worse, if the frag doesn't take...

 

[SDguy]

or worse, if the frag doesn't take...

Or even worse, both (it's happened)...

 

[kane720]

I'm not for it either from experience, more times than not a preorder doesn't turn out good. when i pay for a coral i want to see the actual frag not a promise

 

[xmjxflipx]

I'm not for it either from experience, more times than not a preorder doesn't turn out good. when i pay for a coral i want to see the actual frag not a promise

Yea everyones choice.......when i bought from mark i dont think i saw exact pics but i was like what the heck, hes a well known guy in the reefing community so i just ask him to frag me this and that and hes a generous guy when he gives some frags its even more than i expected. I return the favor to some local friends where i live and i share what i get cause i know marks told me before. He doesnt think of anything as an investment but he just wants to share the wealth (corals) in a way or somehow he put it...u know what i mean right mark? lol

same with ian...i dont expect pics....ive prob spent a couple g's with bigian and i always go back cause he takes care of his buyers, i just tell him what i want and i put a down payment and just wait for the corals to heal and hell answer all my questions....i know i have pmd him like 50+ times when i buy stuff but hell respond back and to do that for me...thats great that hes patient enough to deal with me, hes one of my go to guys with corals all the time. time to stop my blabbering :sure:

 

[I-K@ndY]

Everything that's posted here has some good points.. Im with everyone..

 

[mpoletti]

Yea everyones choice.......when i bought from mark i dont think i saw exact pics but i was like what the heck, hes a well known guy in the reefing community so i just ask him to frag me this and that and hes a generous guy when he gives some frags its even more than i expected. I return the favor to some local friends where i live and i share what i get cause i know marks told me before. He doesnt think of anything as an investment but he just wants to share the wealth (corals) in a way or somehow he put it...u know what i mean right mark? lol

same with ian...i dont expect pics....ive prob spent a couple g's with bigian and i always go back cause he takes care of his buyers, i just tell him what i want and i put a down payment and just wait for the corals to heal and hell answer all my questions....i know i have pmd him like 50+ times when i buy stuff but hell respond back and to do that for me...thats great that hes patient enough to deal with me, hes one of my go to guys with corals all the time. time to stop my blabbering :sure:

Thanks Mark

:angel: The main thing is be happy with whatever purchase you make

Everything that's posted here has some good points.. Im with everyone..

True dat!