petco purple tang rescue action

Greenstreet.1 · May 23, 2016

Jamesfl said:
Almost hit play but then had same thought lol.

Sleeping right next to me lol

Jamesfl · May 23, 2016

Greenstreet.1 said:
Sleeping right next to me lol

Same

bevo5 · May 23, 2016

Hey good luck man! That does look like velvet from the rough photos. Hopefully that copper is going to kick some but fast....but I'd follow Humble's advice to the T.

NeuroticAquatics · May 23, 2016

Good luck. Go with Humble's advice.

NeverlosT · May 23, 2016

that is an awesome opportunity to save those suckers. Good luck! Heck I am going to swing by my petco more often...

ngvu1 · May 23, 2016

Why tap water? I thougth fresh water dip meant/means RO/DI water dip....Anyway, I am following ...

Russ265 · May 23, 2016

ngvu1 said:
Why tap water? I thougth fresh water dip meant/means RO/DI water dip....Anyway, I am following ...

While chlorine will kill fish eventually, it is an antiseptic. If it can kill a multicellular organism such as a fish, it will really be rough on simpler life such as a dinoflagellate.

anyway... some good news and some "meh" news.

good news is both survived the night.
bad news is the one i thought wont make it is not eating and is just hiding in the rock.

after @Humblefish chimed in with his writeup, i am in agreement that they "look" like they have velvet and ich.

his suggestions look on par with how i treat ich short of using formaline. ill get some during my lunch hour at work to have it on hand but i do not plan on using it just yet....
they need to look a bit worse or heading in the wrong direction before i go nuclear.

due to the added information that velvet may/is photosynthetic, ive covered the tank with a blanket.

ill update after work...

revhtree · May 23, 2016

Thanks for trying to save them! Following along!

NeuroticAquatics · May 23, 2016

If it is Velvet, I don't think I would wait. I've heard of people "managing" Ich, but not Velvet.

Are these two getting along okay? I know my Purple was a bully and would not have done well with any other fish in tight quarters.

Humblefish · May 23, 2016

Russ265 said:
While chlorine will kill fish eventually, it is an antiseptic. If it can kill a multicellular organism such as a fish, it will really be rough on simpler life such as a dinoflagellate.

Are you sure your tap isn't actually treated with chloramine? I think even the presence of chlorine will do more harm than good here.

I play the "let's save Petco fish" game A LOT, and two chemicals I consider indispensable to my success rate are acriflavine and especially Chloroquine phosphate: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/chloroquine-phosphate.192309/

In addition to killing the free swimming stage of external parasites, CP is a pretty strong algaecide. Velvet, being a dinoflagellate, might be susceptible to an algaecide in the tomont, trophont stage.

Bouncingsoul39 · May 23, 2016

ngvu1 said:
Why tap water? I thougth fresh water dip meant/means RO/DI water dip....Anyway, I am following ...

You thought right. Or at the very least, de-chlorinated tap water. I'm sorry I guess you mean well OP, but I really hope no one ever listens to your advice or follows what you are doing. Your answer of chlorine being an antiseptic for fish is just 100% wrong. Please folks do your research and do not follow these poor practices. You are also doing the freshwater dip completely wrong. There is zero point to adjusting the specific gravity for a freshwater dip. The fish goes from full strength seawater to 100% freshwater (treated with de-chlor). The rapid change in osmotic pressure is what kills the parasites.
That video made me cringe...this is mindblowing considering the huge amount of information available on the internet on these topics.
http://www.petplace.com/article/fish/general/when-your-fish-is-sick/chlorine-toxicity

jedimasterben · May 23, 2016

Yes, I can verify that in my experience with CP it will take care of velvet with no problems.

Russ265 · May 23, 2016

NeuroticAquatics said:
If it is Velvet, I don't think I would wait. I've heard of people "managing" Ich, but not Velvet.

Are these two getting along okay? I know my Purple was a bully and would not have done well with any other fish in tight quarters.

well this will be my first if it is indeed "velvet". im still skeptical due to the fact my reading indicates velvet is an incredibly fast killer.

im aware that these 2 tangs can fight and stress each other out. i made a live rock divider between the 2 which they seem to "honor" at this point in time. these 2 are too weak to really care about territory right now but if one starts misbehaving i can put him in an acclimation box.

McMullen · May 23, 2016

Following! Interesting thread! At what point as hobbiest do we try and force better animal care at petco and other large chains??? It's not just fish that are poorly cared for!!!

Seriously, at what point? What can we do?

Side note, a friend of mine recently bought a red ear slider that was very ill....bacterial and fungal infection!

Russ265 · May 23, 2016

Bouncingsoul39 said:
You thought right. Or at the very least, de-chlorinated tap water. I'm sorry I guess you mean well OP, but I really hope no one ever listens to your advice or follows what you are doing. Your answer of chlorine being an antiseptic for fish is just 100% wrong. Please folks do your research and do not follow these poor practices. You are also doing the freshwater dip completely wrong. There is zero point to adjusting the specific gravity for a freshwater dip. The fish goes from full strength seawater to 100% freshwater (treated with de-chlor). The rapid change in osmotic pressure is what kills the parasites.
That video made me cringe...this is mindblowing considering the huge amount of information available on the internet on these topics.
http://www.petplace.com/article/fish/general/when-your-fish-is-sick/chlorine-toxicity

maybe you didnt see the video of me popping them out of the bag straight in to a bucket of tap to give that "osmotic shock"?

They dont drop off after raising salinity, its when they go to absolute 0 (1.00)

as far as bringing salinity back up... sorry. done the dip too many times with more ornamental fish and the rise from 0 to 1.026ish has killed fish instantly.

ive had 0 losses fw dipping this way.

despite what you read on the internet, ive been doing this method for over 10 years.forgive me if i take your "petplace" resource for a grain of salt.
technically fresh water kills salt water fish, doesnt mean im housing in it.

Russ265 · May 23, 2016

Humblefish said:
Are you sure your tap isn't actually treated with chloramine? I think even the presence of chlorine will do more harm than good here.

I play the "let's save Petco fish" game A LOT, and two chemicals I consider indispensable to my success rate are acriflavine and especially Chloroquine phosphate: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/chloroquine-phosphate.192309/

In addition to killing the free swimming stage of external parasites, CP is a pretty strong algaecide. Velvet, being a dinoflagellate, might be susceptible to an algaecide in the tomont, trophont stage.

havent met an invert that wont die to copper.

http://agrilifecdn.tamu.edu/fisheri...mportant-Parasite-of-Cultured-Marine-Fish.pdf

mmw64 · May 23, 2016

Russ265 said:
aight fellas.

petco usually sells these things for $180 a pop.

i got em for $10 a pop. ich ridden and on their last leg.

i gave them both a 15 minute freshwater dip for the immediate relief.

im setting up a coppered out 40 breeder to treat em. no sand. no lights for this treatment. im actually considering a blackout entirely.

what would YOU do to make it work?

i ask only because i know a ton of you have experiences beyond my own.

thanks all

Good luck Thanks for trying.

domination2580 · May 23, 2016

Russ265 said:
this is a snapshot from a video im doing....

gem tang anyone?

Depends on price.

Humblefish · May 23, 2016

Russ265 said:
havent met an invert that wont die to copper.

http://agrilifecdn.tamu.edu/fisheri...mportant-Parasite-of-Cultured-Marine-Fish.pdf

The main advantage CP has over copper is you can go from zero to full therapeutic without having to worry about Cu intolerance, appetite suppression or other side effects. Copper also only eradicates ich & velvet; it only suppresses symptoms with brook, and may or may not be effective against Uronema marinum. I've successfully tested all of the "Big 4" external parasites using CP.

Russ265 · May 23, 2016

Humblefish said:
The main advantage CP has over copper is you can go from zero to full therapeutic without having to worry about Cu intolerance, appetite suppression or other side effects. Copper also only eradicates ich & velvet; it only suppresses symptoms with brook, and may or may not be effective against Uronema marinum. I've successfully tested all of the "Big 4" external parasites using CP.

I'm not comfortable with CP. I understand you swear by it, but some wrasses and regal tang are not recommended? It is also not easy to come by. There are just too many variables for me to use it with confidence. I know you are well respected on this, and will take suggestions, but realize I have my experience as well that I need to go by. Call it my "gut" I guess you would say.

As such I plan on administering hydrogen peroxide baths (salt water) for an hour each evening. - Brown's work in '31 is constantly referenced on the subject and the statistics look promising.

For me, Im all to familiar with peroxide. I've dosed more bottles in my tank than anyone would like to know. Funny that it was because of dinoflagellates, not dinospores. (dinos are dinos right?) I plan on giving them 60 minute baths every evening and returning them back in to the coppered out tank.

I'll be sure to document the process and I appreciate everyone's feedback, (whether we agree or disagree on some things)